New Lift Kit on the market

[archemitis]

i wouldnt worry too much about ripping off someone elses lift. theres not much to them. the only thing thats even remotely specialized is the front strut extenstion. the rest is just blocks, and hardware. durability is the only thing id be concerned about...

 

the aussie byb lifts use tubing cut to the right length, then big washers are welded on both sides. they used to weld the xmember spacer to the xmember! not huge things to put a patent on.

 

unless you see a big triangle through his strut holes, id say its cool.

[ezapar]

i wouldnt worry too much about ripping off someone elses lift. theres not much to them. the only thing thats even remotely specialized is the front strut extenstion. the rest is just blocks, and hardware. durability is the only thing id be concerned about...

 

.

 

 

PK worries about ripping off Brett. He mails Brett a check for every kit he sells.

[MorganM]

...we built everything without even looking at another lift...

 

PK worries about ripping off Brett. He mails Brett a check for every kit he sells.

 

That's different; PK is selling a BYB lift kit. Nobody wants to see anyone's design ripped off. However its a pretty simple lift idea and there are going to be similarities.

 

 

Seems rude to toss around all these acusations before even seeing the product. Am I the only one that percieves him as inocent until proven guilty? Give the guy a chance!

[Shadyirishmen]

I am going to be away from my computer for the rest of the week, but I will be sure to try to make any one comfortable about the new product. There should be a slew of new information posted on the website www.alliedarmament.com in the next week and we should have some pictures of the lifts, comparisons etc all with pictures. Thanks for posts. JM

 

 

 

Welcome aboard. I think the biggest hurdle your going to need to clear is building a relationship with people here based on trust. It would be hard for me to send $350 to someone with out some sort of evidence of an actual product. Please don't get me wrong, I'm not even implying that this is a scan, but BYB has built a reputation here that will be hard to stand up to. Do I think you should try??? By all means, every new product that comes out for our older Subbies is only going to add to the choices we have for modification. Sell a couple of kit, get a sellers feed back score and you will be on your way. Again welcome to the board, Tim

[iluvdrt]

A lot of people are giving this guy a hard time. Why? He is marketing a new lift for us to buy and use, giving us more choices in the web of modifacation. Some of you are obviously not familar with the wide assortment of products offered to other makes of vehicles for offroading.

What is wrong with having more than one company producing a product? Nothing.

 

As far as copying a PK lift he stated he used it merely as a comparison. PK lifts have been around for a while and have dominated the market, so in short I guess one could say they could be the best offered so far...

why not study one and see where it could be improved upon? That is all he did. He made a product, looked at his competitors, and found small things similar to throw into the mix. I see nothing wrong with that.

 

Everyone complains about the lack of an aftermarket support for our vehicles, but when someone new trys to create a product everyone here gives them a hard time. That is not the way to gain product support for our vehicles.

 

I will be buying one of his lifts around the 10th of April. Look for a write up and review soon.

 

-Jason

[subie94]

let the flame wars begin...

 

yah gotta love em

[ezapar]

AI will be buying one of his lifts around the 10th of April. Look for a write up and review soon.

 

-Jason

 

And I will (providing your feedback is positive) add a link to his site to the Offroad FAQ sticky in the part where it points folks to buy lift kits.

Your review will be added to the sticky somewhere as testimony either way.

[iluvdrt]

Sounds good. As it turn out, I had a run of good luck, so I may be installing the lift sooner than planned.

 

Keeps yopu eyes peeled for a thread in a few weeks.

[Mike W]

When I imported the first BYB kit from Oz, it was a huge leap of faith sending $$$ to a guy on the other side of the planet. It took forever the kit shipped to the States but Bret was very cool and handled questions and concerns and marketing issues just like this guy is doing. Professionalism builds and maintains a relationship but a good product pretty much sells itself. So if this lift kit (or any other) functions better than earlier designs and doesn't infringe on the BYB design...then I guess that just natural evolution in the market.

 

I should also point out that we'd have a lot less lifted Subes, if not for guys getting a look at the BYB kit on my car and saying ah-hah, now I know how to fab my own kit. These people weren't exactly copying Bret's design, they were emulating his concept, but doing it their own way with different materials etc. Some even went bigger than the original 3/3 kit with 2" blocks under the tranny. You might argue that these do-it-yourselfers were stealing Bret's idea, but I would not say they were outright pirating his design.

To actually offer a product forsale on the market, I would say that the kit and especially the strut towers would need to be substatially different in design or else there could be patent infringement issues. From the sounds of it, these folks have taken a different approach. Hope to see more info soon.

[mudrat79]

Here is My Question , Being a Builder of Kits Myself....???

 

How are you coming to the conclusion that you are getting 13"s of Clearance....? Is this Front and Rear, or Front only, or Rear Only....? Also What Size tires and Rims do you have to be running to Achive this 13" goal....?

 

I have been Building 3" kits locally since before I got into the computer scene....So before Brett, and P.K. but I've Moved onto bigger Better things as well.....

 

I still will build the occasional 3" kit as well as 4" Kit as you are advertizing......I actually just started to Advertize the 4" Kit recently myself, But then found that P.K. was making them....So chatted with him directly, and Came to an agreement.....I give him First Dib's to sell them, If someone needs one sooner than He can Provide, then He will refer them to me....I have so much going on I don't mind Not doing that business, and sending it his Way.....

 

Where are you Located....? International as a State is pretty Wide Open.....?

 

I'm on my way to Check out your site now, Maybe I'll learn a bit more there....???

 

Later, John in Oregon.....

[soobmater]

If you look at my reply to the other post above yours you may have some clarity in my nature. As for the lifts effect on suspension geometry and fender well trimming. There is trimming needed to be able to install the 29's not a ton. The lift does add some strain to the axles but only by an extra ten to fifteen degrees. We have never broken a rear axle yet and have put over 10 thousand miles on the test mule. As for the front axles we have taken a BYB lift design approach, which almost eliminates strain on the front axles. Also we are giving a five year warranty on our product so if there is any defects you have five years to exploit them and have your lift kit parts repaired free of charge sans shipping. Anyways got to go leave a message and I will reply shortly. JM

 

How much are they. $

[brat1709]

Hi Board. I agree with some of you. Give the new guy a chance.Why, because he deserves it. There is always the chance that a design can be altered.

-For instance, as someone on the board said, I was a bit leary about sending money to BYB, such a long distance, but after waiting a long time, the kit came in.

-Second, after installing the kit, the kit was not completely bolt on.Why, it was never discussed, but I had a brat with the power steering conversion. The adapter for the steering linkage was for manual. I had to adapt, and create one, since I particularly didn't want to wait with my brat parked for over another month, just to receive the correct part. I sure PK is doing a better job of this now.

-Third, even after installing the kit, I wasn't happy with the strain that was put on the front wheels with the front crossmember adapters being 4" and the rear tranny support crossmember adapters being 3". I don't know if this is how the kit usually comes, but I went out and bought some tubing and washers and had to fabricate my own 4" adapters, thus the cv axles where returned to there normal angle and engine was no longer tilted.

I belive if someone is offering a new kit, by all means, let him. Especially if someone is new to working on there own cars, and does not need the extra headaches. Luck for me I am knowledgeable with some fabrication, but not everyone is on the board. This was my experiance, and hopefully it had been smoother for others. Again, I expect the same mutual repect from all the fabricators and manufactures alike, but bottom line, it a benefit to have parts available for our vehicle, versus a few years ago, where no aftermarket parts where available. Just my opion, but I rather have the parts availability, versus no parts available at all. Hugo/So.CA

[monstaru]

well said.....all of you

[TheSubaruJunkie]

I cant wait to see it in action The more lifted subaru's the better.

 

-Brian

[[HTi]Johnson]

I'm thinking of lifting my Subaru. 3 inches. I wouldn't buy anyone's lift. I'd build it myself. How? I'd put the car on stands and start taking things off that would allow the body to be lifted 3inches and fab as needed. And, I'd take notes and possibly sell the lift. Would I be infringing on anyone's ideas/designs if I have never looked close enough at a kit and built my own? What if some of the ideas were similar? Would I not be allowed to sell them?

 

Isn't that how the free market works? Someone makes a product...then another improves it...then the other one makes their's better...that's good for the buyers...because that means they get a better product, cheaper.

 

I might even make bumpers and roof racks...but I'm held back by my conscience...I know mudrat...I'd feel like I am stealing his business.

 

It'll be months before I get around to the lift...it'd be on my old green car...I sold ...but by then, hopefully I can buy it back.

 

Well, good luck with your lifts. I agree with the others...the more parts available for Subarus the better.

 

Don't be discouraged...keep the kits in the market...unless you get in some legal trouble.

 

[HTi]Johnson

[archemitis]

Here is My Question , Being a Builder of Kits Myself....???

 

How are you coming to the conclusion that you are getting 13"s of Clearance....? Is this Front and Rear, or Front only, or Rear Only....? Also What Size tires and Rims do you have to be running to Achive this 13" goal....?

 

 

 

i could think of a realy good way to get more ground clearance out of a lift. especialy if you consider the PK lifts use 3 inch blocks between the body and the xmembers, 2 inch blocks on the tranny, and then runing a 4" strut extension all the way around... you see where im goin with this

 

woundnt it be cool to run 4 inch blocks all the way around, then have your axles at a reasonable angle?

or you could put 5 inch strut extensions, front and rear, and get the same axle angle as the byb/pk list.

[mcbrat]

i could think of a realy good way to get more ground clearance out of a lift. especialy if you consider the PK lifts use 3 inch blocks between the body and the xmembers, 2 inch blocks on the tranny, and then runing a 4" strut extension all the way around... you see where im goin with this

 

woundnt it be cool to run 4 inch blocks all the way around, then have your axles at a reasonable angle?

or you could put 5 inch strut extensions, front and rear, and get the same axle angle as the byb/pk list.

 

but only the rear of the trans is higher, so there isn't that much difference. pulls the wheel back a bit...

 

 

here's my config for the past year:

5" block at engine crossmember

4" strut block

RX springs on front strut(+1")

front struts cranked up(+1")

heavy front bumper w/winch (-1")

3" radius rod (trans) blocks

3" blocks in rear

torsion bar clocked in rear (+2" or 3" ) forgot to measure that one...

 

urethaned motor/trans mounts

 

I do have an axle that needs replaced finally, but it hasn't blown yet....

[soobmater]

Here is My Question , Being a Builder of Kits Myself....???

 

How are you coming to the conclusion that you are getting 13"s of Clearance....? Is this Front and Rear, or Front only, or Rear Only....? Also What Size tires and Rims do you have to be running to Achive this 13" goal....?

 

I have been Building 3" kits locally since before I got into the computer scene....So before Brett, and P.K. but I've Moved onto bigger Better things as well.....

 

I still will build the occasional 3" kit as well as 4" Kit as you are advertizing......I actually just started to Advertize the 4" Kit recently myself, But then found that P.K. was making them....So chatted with him directly, and Came to an agreement.....I give him First Dib's to sell them, If someone needs one sooner than He can Provide, then He will refer them to me....I have so much going on I don't mind Not doing that business, and sending it his Way.....

 

Where are you Located....? International as a State is pretty Wide Open.....?

 

I'm on my way to Check out your site now, Maybe I'll learn a bit more there....???

 

Later, John in Oregon.....

 

hey john,

do you think you could build me a 3/3 lift kit?

[RXTurbo]

You guys that are carrying on about patent and crap, you do of course realise that there is at least 5 manufacturers of lifts in Australia, all make 2" kits because we can't legally fit anything bigger than that, and they all pretty much look the same and use the same design to achieve the lift. Only main differences are the steering extensions.

 

I like the look of the rear of the Allied kit and am considering changing my rear to that style. I have been looking at building a set of portal axle drives for the front to get cv angles and gear reduction back in check - I am happy to say this and share any ideas and concepts I have mostly because if I do and somebody copies it, I hope they extend my generosity and talk to me back about it. I know that no big aftermarket giant will pick it up because the market isn't large enough, so that isn't a worry.

 

For anyone interested, I drive a 93 L series (EA82) wagon with a 2" body lift, 3" strut extensions and 1.5" spring lift. I also have BFG AT 27's on Scorpion rims. I have 16" clearance under the sills at the back, 13" under the rear crossmember lift blocks and 10" under the diff. I have taken the car on some crazy rutted tracks and have not had any clearance issues.

I bought a scorpion steering extension because welded extensions are illegal in Australia and is the only part on the car that I didn't make (although I have the capability, I more bought it so I could copy it for future kits.)

 

My current plans for offroad bits include a detroit/lockrite/powertrax style automatic rear difflock (currently making the tools/jigs to do this) and as mentioned above, the portals - These will be a 1.2:1 ratio drive and mount to the front, with a 3.7 diff in the front this will give the same drive ratio as having stock tyres, but with 27's and for the rear the fitment of a 4.44 diff will be necessary. We can't use 8" lifts with divorced tfer cases here, so we need to find other solutions to the subes problems.

 

I congratulate the guys from Allied, people that look at our cars from a different perspective and think of solutions to our problems are welcome in my book. That additional diff clearance can be very handy, well done guys!

[the_postie]

g'day all i know their is more than 5 manufacturers of kits in aust.my kit was built by a bloke who was building them long before most people thought of lifting subies[his words]he has no hard feelings towards other lift kit builders,most guys in aust proably haven't heard of him.so know one can really say who came up with the idea really.As long as their are people out coming up with ideas and designs good on them.i don't know if you get crap thrown on you by drivers of bigger 4wd over there but i do here and you need all the support from inside the subaru fraternity.Enough ranting for my first post[and i said i would not post outside ausubaru]Happy subaru'ing to all modified, standard,builders of one of the toughest little 4wd out there

 

Cheers Will