I wanna Turbo My wagon... What will i need?

[ausubaru92]

I want to throw a jap import turbo motor in my wagon, which is carbed so i will need a computer,.. i am thinking megasquirt:brow:

 

I have something i can use as a fuel surge tank, an old thermos flask with the centre can removed, holds roundabout a litre.

 

I think i can weld up a turbo downpipe to my current exhaust,.. anything i should be aware of????

 

Here is a crazy thought, can the knock sensor be used to activate a water injection system {even crazier... a fuel pump to pressurise water through an injector driven by a waveform generator circuit}

 

Any suggestions welcome

[555Ron]

Hi, not sure if you've heard of it but the current issue of Speed has a review of computers for performance mods. Thought you might be interested... Other then that, i've got nothing.

[Ross]

 

Here is a crazy thought, can the knock sensor be used to activate a water injection system {even crazier... a fuel pump to pressurise water through an injector driven by a waveform generator circuit}

 

 

Interesting thought. The seperate knock control unit used on all ea81t and '85 & '86 ea82t engines could easily be used to control such a set up.

The knock control unit normally puts out a dv voltage of around 5v (i think), but when a knock is detected it increases this voltage slowly up to a max. of around 7v untill the knock stops. This usually changers when the ignition module pulses the coil (ie ignition timing).

This voltage change could be used (probably with an op amp circuit, as im not sure how much current it will put out) to trigger a relay, or trigger an electronic control.

How do injectors like 100% duty cycle? If its ok, your control circuit could just send a dc voltage to an injector mounted in the plenum.

[4x4mudrat]

Many of us on the ausubaru forum have put EJs into L series and MY series Subarus.

 

The process is long, arduous and by no means straight forward.

 

You'll need a fuel pump for starters, a surge tank is not necessary but it would be an advantage.

 

The standard EJ series computer is good.

 

You'll need an RX Turbo engine crossmember for a turbo conversion.

 

What gearbox do you plan to use?

 

A wiring loom that has been modified to suit the conversion is a great idea too.

 

Budget about $5,000 to get the whole thing from stocker to sorted, plus things like brakes and other stuff you'll need to get an Engineer's Report and make it roadworthy.

 

Try searching Ausubaru.

[ausubaru92]

I was planing to put an EA82T, not EJ seriesIts either that or turbo my current engine, i have 1 good mpfi head, the intake (incl injectors ect.) and a turbo up-pipe

 

but a new (second hand import) engine would be better.

 

I was gonna use megasquirt and make my own wiring loom, it dosent look that hard.

 

I was told to heat up the offending part of the crossmember and bash it into place:lol:

 

If an injector cant handle 100% duty cycle, that is why i suggested the waveform generator,.. it will produce a pulsating voltage and the volume of water can be regulated by the frequency of the waveform

 

Thanks for your input

[wagonist]

List of parts you'll need to do the fuel system properly (all should be able to gotten off one car)

 

EFI fuel tank (has surge tank inbuilt), EFI fuel pump, EFI fuel lines (they're bigger than carb). These could come form an RX turbo, or any EFI touring wagon or Leone Royale sedan.

If you can get an L series turbo halfcut, you'll get the loom, computer, & engine crossmember with it. Plus you'll get a turbo tacho dash & other better features your DL won't have.

Oh yeah, don't forget that if you want to keep it legal, the engine should be the same emissions standard or better.

[redskin]

l might be mistaken guys but this is starting to look like the Ausubaru forum

[PoorManzImpreza]

ok here's my list of parts I've acquired to convert the car in my signature to 'turbo'

 

1 1988 ea82 MPFI turbo engine with all sensors and engine harness intact

1 LHD GL-10 turbo xmember (I can't use this as my car is RHD but I took it off the parts car anyway)

1 MPFI turbo ECU P/N 22611AA630

three GL-10 fuel lines {main, return and EVAP}(only one needed really to work as a fuel return; carb fuel return is tiny. Carb main fuel line looks the same diameter and material as gl-10 supply line, just happens to enter the engine bay in the stock gl-10 evap line position)

1 turbo downpipe with O2 sensor

1 MPFI fuel pump and lines from tank to underbody where main lines hook up

1 complete wire harness off of an RHD 88+ L-series GT (MPFI, 9.7:1 compression, FWD) almost the same as a turbo harness

1 MAF sensor and air hose to inlet housing on turbo

Pressure switches, drop resistors and various misc bits bolted around the shock towers critical for the conversion

1 turbo engine schematic from FSM for 88+ vehicles

umm evap canister if you want evap, vapour seperator is already in the carb car (at least it is in mine even though the car came from FHI with no evap provisions on the carb)

 

OK the crossmember cannot be beat to accomodate a turbo up pipe it really is that different, the sway bar mount points and steering rack mount points are made of completely diff. sheet metal welded in to make the dip for the up pipe...solution heh you'll never believe this guys.. Yes you can get an L-series turbo xmember that is RHD OR you can go waaay back in 1985-86 L-series cars and gab the motor mount brackets from the stock ea71 varient that are sloted to fit both the ea82 and ea71 engines, then go grab some 88+ ea71 motor mounts and bolt em up to the brackets (Might require a lil 'adjustment' with grinder) and bolt the assembly up to turbo motor..suddenly the up pipe has room with the teeniest bit of persuasion

the ea71 mount combination lets the engine sit higher on the xmember and don't worry the bonnet still closes.. You could build spacers if you wanted..

I've probably left out a few things but you get the idea:brow:

[ausubaru92]

Ok, guess i will be looking for a crossmember.

 

I still believe Megasquirt will be easier, and cheaper

 

And i think my Surge tank will too, i hope. Im trying to do this on a budget.

 

Thanks for your opinions, keep them coming

[wagonist]

Last time I got a price on an EFI fuel tank, it was $100 (that was Sunspares BTW).

 

If you really want to get tricky (but it's more hassle IMHO), you don't have to replace all the fuel lines. Just replace the carb return line with the EFI feed line. That's all subaru did. The carb feed line becomes the EFI return line & evap stays the same.

 

And yeah, why didn't you post this up on the BYB forums:) . I'm pretty sure there's one or two people who've done this swap in Australia.

[4x4mudrat]

Only one or two...

 

Just replace the carb return line with the EFI feed line. That's all subaru did. The carb feed line becomes the EFI return line & evap stays the same.

 

What else do you have to change for this mod? I can't remember off the top of my head, but how easy is it to adapt the discharge of the fuel pump?

[wagonist]

You have to change this line all the way back to the pump from the engine bay. If you've get the lines from a wreck, its easier to simply replace all 3 at once because they clip together.

 

The fuel pump brackets are interchangeable from Carb to EFI.

Unless you make an external surge tank (which would be a pain to find a place to mount it in a wagon), you'll need to change the fuel tank as the feed line from the tank is bigger.

[85Sub4WD]

You have to change this line all the way back to the pump from the engine bay. If you've get the lines from a wreck, its easier to simply replace all 3 at once because they clip together.

I never replaced the metal lines when I converted my car to fuel injection, and I have had no problems - yes, the fuel return line is smaller, but that seems to have made no difference in performance - I am not running rich or anything - and I have compared the thickness of the metal pipes on turbo, FI, and carbed cars - they are all the same - so you are not going to burst anything

 

however, you HAVE to replace ALL rubber fuel lines with ones that are rated for fuel injection fuel pressures - your current ones are designed for about 10 psi - you will be going to 60-70psi

[wagonist]

sorry 85Sub4wd, but you'll find you're wrong with your info.

 

Line up a carb car & EFI beside each other.

Use some vernier calipers to measure up.

The carb feed line is one the chassis rail, so is the EFI return line. They are the same size.

The Evap lines are both in the same spot.

The EFI feed line is up near the strut tower. So too is the carb return line. This is the line removed from the carb versions & replaced.

 

You'll find the EFI feed line is at least 1 or 2 mm bigger than the carb version.

Might not be much, & if you're only running an NA motor, it'd be fine. But start winding some boost in...

Yeah, only

Only one or two...

(forgot the extra bit)

[85Sub4WD]

You'll find the EFI feed line is at least 1 or 2 mm bigger than the carb version.

Might not be much, & if you're only running an NA motor, it'd be fine. But start winding some boost in...

that is simply not so on american versions then - or I was not clear enough as to my setup, because I researched the differences carefully before I made the change, and have since put 5k MILES on the car without problems.

 

I did that with my carb feed tube, and used that as my EFI feed tube,

 

I used the carb return tube as my EFI return tube - it is narrower than on the FI version, but not by enough to cause a performance problem

 

the EVAP tube remined the same

 

yes, it does make for complicated hose routing, but it WORKS

 

the highest pressures that the fuel line will expierence will be at idle anyway, as much of the fuel is just cycling back into the tank, the line pressures are the highest then (electric pumps do not vary their volume so the fuel pressure regulartor compensates)

[wagonist]

hmmm, I notice in your sign that you've got a SPFI. Maybe the SPFI cars have the same size lines as the carb, as SPFI is basically an electronic carby. Seeing as we didn't get an of the SPFI engines here, I don't know.

 

When you were checking, did you measure up SPFI cars or MPFI cars, or both?

[85Sub4WD]

When you were checking, did you measure up SPFI cars or MPFI cars, or both?

My car originally had a Hitachi carb, I CONVERTED it to SPFI (SPFI did not come out until 1986) - I measured SPFI AND Turbo cars (couldn't find any MPFI N/A in the JY), they have the same plumbing (here).

 

The SPFI fuel pressures are around 40psi, turbos are 50-60psi, maybe more if the fuel filter clogs.

[wagonist]

Sounds typical Subaru, no consistency anywhere.

 

But seeing as the original poster is in Australia...

[ausubaru92]

I found a EA82T for $950 at Rollin Auto Imports, Does that sound ok, they r in tested working order, thats a complete turbo motor without computer, but i wanna megasquirt anyway.

 

They also had a Vortex Turbo (XT Turbo) with single range FT4WD front cut for $2500

 

Gettin a complete engine would be better then tryin to redo my engine wouldnt it???? after gasgets and hardware ect.

 

Does anybody see a downside to a surge tank, i could mount it in the airbox position, i dont need a MAF so i will use a cone filter. I think it would be easy. and a pump from any efi car would be cheaper also.

 

im realy excited about all this

[4x4mudrat]

I'd think you'd wanna mount your surge tank as close to the fuel tank as possible.

 

Talking to Brumbyrunner on Ausubaru, he seems to think that for the converison it would be a good idea to replace the old return line with a new larger diameter line and use this for the new pump discharge line, then have the old discharge line as your return line. Makes sense.

 

Without going outside and crawling around under my car I'm not sure how much time or effort this would save.

[wagonist]

No, those prices sound extremely high.

 

You can get a twin turbo Legacy half cut in Sydney for $2500!

I know the EA82T are getting rare (they stopped making them over 10 years ago) but I paid $1000 for an 85 turbo halfcut in 1988.

 

I know that your location makes it very difficult to simply go driving around the importers until you find one though, but I'd keep hanging on until you find the right one at the right price.

[Ross]

Come to New Zealand, you'll get one for $500 easy! :-p

[ausubaru92]

What would you suggest as a reasonable Australian price for an EA82T?

 

i have got one working MPFI head and the MPFI intake and the turbo up-pipe, if i found another head, could this work out cheaper? (take into account gaskets ect.)

 

I will post on Ausubaru soon.

 

There are subaru's with converted FI and still use the Carbi lines arent there?

[Ross]

Gaskets are very cheap for these engines, even oem ones. I'm picking up oem headgaskets for my ea81t for nz$30 each, intakes for nz $7each, so if you can find enough engien parts it may well be cheaper that way.

[ausubaru92]

Ok, if i can get two working heads, a fuel surge tank and the needed gaskets and have the MS ECU ready to go,.. what else will i need to consider, (no turbo at this point)

 

All suggestion welcome:drunk: