mentis Posted August 4, 2005 Author Share Posted August 4, 2005 Okay so I just went out there to see if I could find out what's going on. I took off the spare tire and whotnot, and voila. There was that dang O2 sensor. Well, it was obviously the new part, being all shiny-like . I ran the car for about 45 minutes, and reved it up a few times, and I was not able to reproduce the smoke. My guess is that what happened was the fluid which they used on the old sensor to loosen it had run over the manifold etc. So when the engine got hot, it burned off that fluid. And now that's done. Nevertheless, my car does run noticeably worse than it used to. So maybe the ECU (or, as I found out, the ECM as my manual calls it) is indeed shot. I also realized that the O2 sensor was located towards the top of the manifold, unlike other Subarus where it's on the bottom. Unless they stuck it in the wrong spot . I now know that I could have easily done this job myself. Sigh...live and learn I guess. So now I'll probably need to replace the ECU myself, and I just need to figure out if the 86 unit above is the same as mine. I can probably find a part number on mine and see if we can match it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebz Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 Okay so I just went out there to see if I could find out what's going on. I took off the spare tire and whotnot, and voila. There was that dang O2 sensor. Well, it was obviously the new part, being all shiny-like . I ran the car for about 45 minutes, and reved it up a few times, and I was not able to reproduce the smoke. My guess is that what happened was the fluid which they used on the old sensor to loosen it had run over the manifold etc. So when the engine got hot, it burned off that fluid. And now that's done. Nevertheless, my car does run noticeably worse than it used to. So maybe the ECU (or, as I found out, the ECM as my manual calls it) is indeed shot. I also realized that the O2 sensor was located towards the top of the manifold, unlike other Subarus where it's on the bottom. Unless they stuck it in the wrong spot . I now know that I could have easily done this job myself. Sigh...live and learn I guess. So now I'll probably need to replace the ECU myself, and I just need to figure out if the 86 unit above is the same as mine. I can probably find a part number on mine and see if we can match it up. 86 ECU won't work. any 87-90 Turbo EA82 ECU will work though. I may have one more spare here, But I'm not sure. I'll check as I unpack (just moved last weekend) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azsubaru Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1992-Subaru-Loyale-ECM_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33596QQitemZ7990141169QQrdZ1 If you're a risk taker - runs out in a few hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted August 4, 2005 Author Share Posted August 4, 2005 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1992-Subaru-Loyale-ECM_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33596QQitemZ7990141169QQrdZ1 If you're a risk taker - runs out in a few hours. The description says the ECM only works with 90-92 models. Plus, isn't the turbo ECM/ECU different anyhow...? Calebz, thank you for looking. If you find one that would be excellent . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Hey Mentis - you are on my doorstep!! Anyway - I have a number of parts, all nonturbo so I can't help there http://www.halspartsandservice.com is who I have used for parts in the past, but they have changed management and cleaned out a lot of stuff so it is hit-or miss wheter you can get anything from them, but they are usually VERY reasonable about the pricing. the computer is easy to replace - takes a 10 mil socket wrench and a phillips head screwdriver remove the driverside kickpanel (using screwdriver) and vola, you see the computer mounted to the bottom of the steering column disconnect the negative battery cable YOU MUST DO THIS after that, remove the three bolts holding the computer in place, remove the old computer, chuck it, and plug the new one in - installation is the reverse of removal as Calebz said, any 87-90 turbo computer will work on your car any TBI/SPFI computer will work on any TBI/SPFI car any 85-86 computer should work on any 85-86 car (turbo or mpfi) any 87-later MPFI computers should be interchangeable OK - that is all the different intercompatibilites I can think of Ridgewood Phillips 66 in Raleigh is OK for service, but not spectacular, Southern States Subaru caught my car on fire - there is a really good foreign service place on Durant Road - I think it is on the eastern side of US 1 - the guy will work on anything, I have seen Lotuses and a Delorean in his garage - he is good, my high school Calc teacher uses him for her Subaru work I do all my car's maitnence myself limits who I have to blame for when the car breaks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoostedBalls Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 My 86 computer won't work for you, they changed the MAF sensor for the 1987 year and added a third connection to the unit. Oh well, hopefully someone here can give you a good deal on a working unit. My 87 unit will be up for sale soon as I get the MegaSquirt up and working, but probably not in time for you. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Mentis, maybe you should just pay 85Sub4WD to do your Subaru repairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted August 5, 2005 Author Share Posted August 5, 2005 Hey Mentis - you are on my doorstep!! Anyway - I have a number of parts, all nonturbo so I can't help there www.halspartsandservice.com is who I have used for parts in the past, but they have changed management and cleaned out a lot of stuff so it is hit-or miss wheter you can get anything from them, but they are usually VERY reasonable about the pricing. the computer is easy to replace - takes a 10 mil socket wrench and a phillips head screwdriver remove the driverside kickpanel (using screwdriver) and vola, you see the computer mounted to the bottom of the steering column disconnect the negative battery cable YOU MUST DO THIS after that, remove the three bolts holding the computer in place, remove the old computer, chuck it, and plug the new one in - installation is the reverse of removal as Calebz said, any 87-90 turbo computer will work on your car any TBI/SPFI computer will work on any TBI/SPFI car any 85-86 computer should work on any 85-86 car (turbo or mpfi) any 87-later MPFI computers should be interchangeable OK - that is all the different intercompatibilites I can think of Ridgewood Phillips 66 in Raleigh is OK for service, but not spectacular, Southern States Subaru caught my car on fire - there is a really good foreign service place on Durant Road - I think it is on the eastern side of US 1 - the guy will work on anything, I have seen Lotuses and a Delorean in his garage - he is good, my high school Calc teacher uses him for her Subaru work I do all my car's maitnence myself limits who I have to blame for when the car breaks Hey there 85Sub, nice to meet someone a bit closer to me . I appreciate the info on the parts and the contact info for Hal's. So what kind of crazy stuff have you been doing with your Sub...? Any fun mods? My 86 computer won't work for you, they changed the MAF sensor for the 1987 year and added a third connection to the unit. Oh well, hopefully someone here can give you a good deal on a working unit. My 87 unit will be up for sale soon as I get the MegaSquirt up and working, but probably not in time for you. Good luck! It's allright. Thank a lot for your offer anyway. I appreciate your helpfulness . Hey Calebz, I don't mean to rush you or anything, I was just curious as to when you think you might find if you have one of those ECUs. I'm not in a big hurry right now or anything. And thanks again for looking, I truly appreciate it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted August 5, 2005 Author Share Posted August 5, 2005 Mentis, maybe you should just pay 85Sub4WD to do your Subaru repairs You know, the thought had crossed my mind as well, ha ha . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Hey there 85Sub, nice to meet someone a bit closer to me . I appreciate the info on the parts and the contact info for Hal's. So what kind of crazy stuff have you been doing with your Sub...? Any fun mods? I converted from the dreaded Hitachi carb to SPFI (as many will tell you it is not really a crazy mod, so much as a needed one for a carbed car) I did it before Snowman wrote the manual for it too, and with far less literature than he presents, so I ran into a few interesting obsticles. One thing great about running SPFI on a carbed block is that the lower compression ratio on the carbed engine lets me run regular unleaded without a problem. I will admit that I have planned a few mods (not too crazy, mainly swapping parts off of other soobs for better performance) Right now my time very limited, and what time I have is spent is holding the thing together, I am in school and rely a LOT on it for transportation I am looking for a 4WD XT6/RX in the JY right now for a rear end because my trailing arms are shot, and I want a rear sway bar - Hal did a clear-out of a lot of his older stuff and crushed an XT6 without telling me about it He also junked TWO good XT6 engines :( I am going to need it to get me from Raleigh to Charlotte a lot in the next couple months because I am transferring from NCSU to UNC-Charlotte. ( I don't mind carolina blue either ) So, I have done stuff like fix the A/C, which had been broken for about 7 years. Next on my list is cruise control. I am starting school soon (leaving the 18th) and I am working until the 17th, which leaves me just weekends to pack/prepare for fall semester, so I am a bit busy now, but believe me, I wish I could help, if for no other reason than I want to play with a turbo don't be intimidated by the car, one reason I love Subaru is because they are so EASY to work on, replacing the ECU on that car is a cakewalk, just don't force anything, make sure you disconnect your battery first and reconnect it last, and you should not have a problem (disconnecting the battery is so important because you can fry the old and the new ECU if you don't, not to mention that you must have the bolts that hold the ECU in TIGHT for proper grounding - improper ECU body grounding can also fry it) I speak from expierence there. Actually the proceedure is a lot less complicated than is sounds. Here'e the link to a FSM (for an 89 - which uses the same turbo system as the 87) BTW - it is not complete, and one of the missing sections involves info about the turbo system, but you should hopefully be able to glean some info from it (look under EA82) http://www.finleyweb.net/default.asp?id=142 Good Luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Oh sure. I see how it is. First you get my hopes up by making me think there's another subaru fan close by, and then you crush them by telling me your moving away!!! He he, just kidding. I did also look into my own Sube Repair Manual (I think mine's a Haynes), and found info on the ECU. It's right under the steering wheel in that mess of stuff. So I figured I can do that myself without too much trouble . Now I just have to hope that someone (i.e. calebz) is going to find that ECU. If not, I'll probably have to drop the money on one from Hal's. But not before checking a few other sources. I actually might be able to get one shipped from my former excellent Subaru mechanic back in MT. He always had loads of parts laying around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted August 18, 2005 Author Share Posted August 18, 2005 *bump* Actually if anyone else has got an ECU/ECM that will work for my 87 Turbo, I would greatly appreciate it. Perhaps I should start "looking for ECU" thread though . I ran the car after the "smoke" incident for a while, and I think my suspicions that it was just some oil on the surrounding area evaporating was right. I haven't seen any smoke since then. It seems to be running better now too. Nevertheless, I still get some fuel-like odor in the engine compartment, which has been going on for a long time, so replacing the ECU might be a good idea if it's not operating accurately. So, still looking for an ECU. I may just have to order one from Hal's though . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted October 5, 2005 Author Share Posted October 5, 2005 Update... As noted previously, the smoke and smell went away and never came back. So that was good. I haven't had anyone reply with wanting to sell me an ECU, so I went to look for one myself. I found one from a salvage place and ordered it, specifying the model number to them to be an AA140, and they sent it out to me. Having received the package recently, it turned out that they sent me an AA141 model however. Does anyone know whether they are interchangeable/compatible? How could I find out if they are? If they are not, I'll have to send it back to the seller . Information on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cap86 Posted October 5, 2005 Share Posted October 5, 2005 What exactly does the oxygen sensor do besides telling you that it needs to be replaced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted October 6, 2005 Author Share Posted October 6, 2005 Any ideas folks...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted October 6, 2005 Share Posted October 6, 2005 The Oxygen Sensor tells the Computer how much Oxygen is coming out of your combustion chambers. It tells the computer if there is too much Oxygen (lean) or too little (too much fuel, rich). The computer can then fine tune the amount of fuel coming to the amount of air coming in; in it's attempt to create a stechiometric (spelling?) ratio for optimal combustion. For gasoline this is 14.7:1 air:fuel ratio; too much fuel (rich) and you create pollutants. Too little fuel (lean) and you create pollutants and risk damange to the engine. So it serves two purposes really. Helps optimize air:fuel ratio for proper combustion and is part of the emissions control system by cutting pollutants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mentis Posted October 15, 2005 Author Share Posted October 15, 2005 Thank you for your clarification MroganM, though I suspect it was more for cap86's benefit that mine . I thought I would post my conclusion to the issue in this thread, so here it goes... I discovered that the ECU with model number 22611 AA140 (which came out of my Sube) is interchangeable with the 22611 AA141 model. Apparently the other model is the "replacement part number" or some such thing. I swapped out the faulty ECU in my car for this "new used" unit, which was a cakewalk. After reconnecting everything, I started her up and noticed that she started up smoother than I was used to. After driving for a few days I believe that my sube runs noticeably better. And for $50 (plus $20 s+h) this was a very worthwhile thing to do. I am quite happy with my results! For anyone else that's interested, I got the ECU from a place in my old state of residence, Montana. It's called Green Meadow Auto Salvage, and you can check them out at www.greenmeadowautosalvage.com. They have been courteous, friendly, and helpful on the phone and I am very satisfied with my purchase from them. Yay, that's another Sube problem fixed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Romero Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Interesting story here, but there is a moral to it all... "If you want something done right do it yourself!" True it may cost you some extra time and effort to learn how your car works, but you'll be better off for it in the long run, and you won't have to jerk around with a bunch of clowns who claim to be "professional", and charge you outrageous amounts of money just because they have "ASE" stamped on their building. Don't get me wrong mechanics do have their place, but they are getting to be increasingly expensive, and a good one as we all know is very hard to find. I'm sorry to here about your troubles. I hope you were able to diagnose and fix your problem without too much more headache. ./steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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