amartin Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Do I have a story (don't we all).... My son bought his 1992 loyale (an automatic) about 2 years ago - had 105k on it - but the second owner lavished attention on the little wagon - even had it repainted a neat charcoal metallic grey. The car belonged to my boss's dad, and when his dad died, he decided to sell it after a while. Since i know what kind of attention he paid to his car, I knew I could trust him - and I was right. My son got a good price, and with regular maintenance and such has had it on the road with no problems, no noises for those past two years. He loves that little car. (I also own an 87 wagon @ 167k and it is still going strong). Well, the other day there was a concert in Philadelphia, and my daughter wanted to go, so they decided to take frank jr (his name for the car) down the turnpike and back - about 100 miles round trip. The concert outside was hot, my daughter fainted from the heat, but recovered fine, and they decided to head back after being down there about 4 hours. On the way back he was crusing at about 65mph and one second everything was ok, and the next he heard loud tapping from the engine, and started to slow down. He did not notice any loss of power. He noticed the oil guage was steadily dropping and started searching for a place to pull over. About a half-mile down the road they noticed white 'smoke' starting to issue from the engine hood and work its way into the cabin. About a half-mile after that and at about 45 mph, he saw a good pull-off point. The oild guage was at near zero and then white stean started billowing from under the hood. They got out safe and sound and called us, his parents, and we got them towed back home. I popped the hood, and immediately saw that the main return hose on the radiator had a 3 inch split and said aha! I had an extra new hose, so i replaced it and filled frank up. I had him start the engine - and - loud tapping...... The oil pressure guage registered as fine, and I had him turn it off. Now that it is daylight here I am going to go out and do some toubleshooting. What is your opinion on what happened, and what do you think I shoud look for or try? I am not a mechanic but have heavy diy experience with different makes and models engines, brakes, etc. thanks for reading all of this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggymike Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 My first thought is they fried the oil. Change oil and filter and see if that doesn't help. Do I have a story (don't we all).... My son bought his 1992 loyale (an automatic) about 2 years ago - had 105k on it - but the second owner lavished attention on the little wagon - even had it repainted a neat charcoal metallic grey. The car belonged to my boss's dad, and when his dad died, he decided to sell it after a while. Since i know what kind of attention he paid to his car, I knew I could trust him - and I was right. My son got a good price, and with regular maintenance and such has had it on the road with no problems, no noises for those past two years. He loves that little car. (I also own an 87 wagon @ 167k and it is still going strong). Well, the other day there was a concert in Philadelphia, and my daughter wanted to go, so they decided to take frank jr (his name for the car) down the turnpike and back - about 100 miles round trip. The concert outside was hot, my daughter fainted from the heat, but recovered fine, and they decided to head back after being down there about 4 hours. On the way back he was crusing at about 65mph and one second everything was ok, and the next he heard loud tapping from the engine, and started to slow down. He did not notice any loss of power. He noticed the oil guage was steadily dropping and started searching for a place to pull over. About a half-mile down the road they noticed white 'smoke' starting to issue from the engine hood and work its way into the cabin. About a half-mile after that and at about 45 mph, he saw a good pull-off point. The oild guage was at near zero and then white stean started billowing from under the hood. They got out safe and sound and called us, his parents, and we got them towed back home. I popped the hood, and immediately saw that the main return hose on the radiator had a 3 inch split and said aha! I had an extra new hose, so i replaced it and filled frank up. I had him start the engine - and - loud tapping...... The oil pressure guage registered as fine, and I had him turn it off. Now that it is daylight here I am going to go out and do some toubleshooting. What is your opinion on what happened, and what do you think I shoud look for or try? I am not a mechanic but have heavy diy experience with different makes and models engines, brakes, etc. thanks for reading all of this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 What is your opinion on what happened, and what do you think I shoud look for or try? I am not a mechanic but have heavy diy experience with different makes and models engines, brakes, etc. thanks for reading all of this Had the same thing happen a few weeks back. Was really hot and the oil lost it's whatever that makes it lube stuff. I went out the next day and fired it right up and it made a little noise not bad. I did an oil change with 20-50 partial synthetic castrol gtx and now its fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 i'd change the oil and filter and go from there. motor probably got hot as the motor heated up from the coolant loss. probably compromised the characteristics of the oil. you should be good to go assuming it wasn't overheated too bad. was there any mention of the temperature gauge getting higher than normal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooziewhatsit Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 sounds like the exact same thing that happened to my loyale a week ago. Huge split in the upper radiator hose. Another thing you'll want to check is the water pump. Check for any play in the shaft by pushing/pulling on it. If it moves much at all, it should probably be replaced. Mine has a little play a good whine to it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syonyk Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 It's probably one of two things. The first one is the lash adjusters clicking. This will be a constant clicking related to engine speed, regardless of engine load. Not a big deal, there are a lot of threads about trying to fix it, but the engines will run fine. The other, significantly more major possibility, is the bearings. This isn't too likely, but it's a possibility. If the oil pressure dropped, the bearings may not be getting proper lubrication. The way to detect this is to drain the oil and look at it. If there's a metallic sheen on it (looks like iridescent paint), that's Bad. Also, once you put oil in it again & run it, if the knocking gets louder when the engine is revving up and quiets down as the engine is slowing down, it's not a good sign. Personally, I doubt it's the second one. These engines seem to have an insanely strong bottom end (at least for their normal power output). Fill it with coolant, change the oil, and see what you get. -=Russ=- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amartin Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 Excellent and concise information - thank you New developments: There is no sheen nor foam on the oil that I changed out, although the oil smelled slightly 'burnt', if that is an adequate description. I have been doing my own maintenance since '75 so i noticed this - although maybe I was just excited about the situation and is IS 90 degrees and no breeze. I performed a visual inspection with the roo off and noted no obvious issues top nor bottom of powerplant. Also the oil filter i changed out has a semi-plastic coating that is provided to the consumer for gripping the filter during de-install. This coating was slightly bubbled and the bubbles cracked under pressure when i pressed them - as though the filter had been pushed beyond its temperature rating. THAT scared me. But at no time did the engine overheat as the coolant dump took place over 1/2 mile - although maybe it got insanely hot after the coolant dump even though the roo was just sitting - a possibility now that i think about it, as there was no buffer of coolant in the engine at the time it was first stopped - not sure. I power washed Frank jr so I could get a good look at him top and bottom, and afterward filled him up with 4.2 qts. The tapping continued, as last night, not quite as pronounced, but as I said maybe I was a little excited last night - just knowing the kids got home safe. The tapping does not vary in noise level as i tach it up. I also used the old tube to ear trick once the choke released the engine and noticed that the tapping is decidedly more pronouced (perhaps all of it) on the passenger side of the engine. A note: The engine has 112k on it, and the previous owner had new(or remanned) heads installed 4 years ago - probably about 25k miles. Also the timing belts have not been changed out as far as i can tell from the previous owner's service receipts for well past the 52k recommended by Gates - but maybe that is for a separate battle. At this time I am hoping that this tapping has to do with a lash adjustment - and i have more questions: If it is an adjustment issue, could it have been quiet one moment and tapping the next (at 65 mph)? Also - I have never pulled anything off a roo (never had to ) - so besides my haynes, do you have a place I can go to get step-by-step, recommendations, insider hints, specs, etc? Do you think this is the next course of action, and if so, while i'm in there should I look at/repair/reman anything else? I have to keep in mind that my son is down a vehicle and he will be borrowing one of ours while Frank is out of commision, BUT he can wait a little while if I could do a little more work to ensure he'll be ok over the winter..... thanks for the encouragement and help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syonyk Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 If it's coming from the passenger's side head, it's the lash adjusters. The fact that the oil is clean is a good thing. Don't worry about it. If you want, you can search and find dozens of threads on making them shut up, but running some seafoam through the engine should help out - you might have just baked some oil into them. Fill 'er up, and go. :-) -=Russ=- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amartin Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 Great. I will try some sea foam but i'm a little bit of a stickler and will probably want to adjust the lash also. BTW - I found out that the crackly finish on the oil filter is apparently the result of a new formulation the mfr is using - my other roo's filter is the same way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amartin Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 What do you all think of atf instead of sea foam? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syonyk Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Well... good luck adjusting the lash. That's what the hydraulic lash adjusters do. They get pumped up with oil and properly adjust the lash every time the engine is fired up - or at least they're supposed to. The ticking occurs when they get sludged up and can no longer pump up properly. They get pushed down each time the cam cycles, and make the tapping noise. I believe you can get solid lash adjusters that can be adjusted normally, but you're not going to have much luck adjusting the set that's currently in there. -=Russ=- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amartin Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 Right - one does not adjust hydraulic lifter lash. ok so i dont know what i am talking about - won't be the first time. Observations: took roo out on road after oil change - without sea foam - tapping disappeared. BUT i noticed that coolant guage is now not working - something else to track down...... thanks for all your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chef_tim Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Marvel Mystery Oil is the way to go. That stuff is amazing!!! Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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