2?'s Starter Ain't & Key Hangs Up.

[Hayne]

I have my doubts that these two problems are related. But they involve two different cars of the same type.

 

My daughter has an '86 Loyal SW with an automatic. She is having intermitant starting problems involving the starter. It has been replaced but hasn't alieved the problem. My son-in-law replaced the cables to the battery and starter before I R&R'd the starter. His mechanical aptitude doesn't impress me that much. Our 1990 Loyale SW automatic is also starting to refuse to turn over. But hasn't gotten that bad as of yet. Would this be related to connectors or is there an inherant problem with the ignition switch or inhibitor switch?

 

Also on our 1990. The key has a tendency to get hung up in the ignition switch. This seems to happen more when the car is turned hard; like when pulling into a parking space. I've used WD-40 on the switch and can't really tell much difference. Any input would be helpful

[sregor13]

There is a black and yellow wire on the back side of the ignition switch. This runs to to the Inhibit switch which I found under the hood by the transmission on my 90 Loyale. Upon exiting the Inhibit switch it becomes a black and white wire. When I was trying to fix my intermittent starting problems I first bypassed the Inhibit Switch.

I did this by cutting the black/yellow and black/white wires and jumpering them together. I thought this fixed the problem. Alas, a few weeks later I started having the same problems. So I tested the Voltage on the Black/white wire and it was in fact supplying 12V to the Solenoid. However since the problem was intermittent I dont know if it always did.

Then I decided to install a pushbutton Starter Switch. All I did was ran a known to be good 12V Power lead into one side of the switch and ran a wire directly to the back of the starter. At first I kept the black/white wire in the line-up. After a week or two, the same problem returned.

I then removed the Black/white wire altogether and am just relying on the button. So when I turn the key to the Start position and push the button it starts everytime. The only thing I can think is that the Black White wire is slightly grounding out or it is getting old? So far the problem has not returned, but when it does I intend to test the Voltage and all that Jazz to root out the gremlin from its nest.

The other thing to mention is that the only other thing in the Starter Line-up is a Fusible link. It is possible that the Fusible link is going bad or is loose on yours. It is Fusible Link 4 (Black in Color). There should be a white wire leaving that link that goes to your Ignition Switch. i would test the Voltage of that wire the next time the Starting System acts squirelly, along with the Black/yellow & Black/white wires. That way you can determine where the Problem lies. I also forget to mention that I first tried a differnt Ignition Switch and a different Starter. Both provided only temporary relief from my woes. So I guess if I had to do it all over again I would carry a Multi-meter in my car along with a log sheet for troubleshooting.

 

However, I must say the push button is intended only as a temporary solution but may in fact become a permanent fix. I guess to finish I should mention that some have recommended that the Ignition Switch plate may be loose on the backside. It is a real dinky little scrw that holds it in place and may have become loose or otherwise out of place.

 

BTW- your daughter;s 86 has the same linup as what I described. As far as wiring goes. (Except I dont know if it is Fusible Link 4) but it will be black and it will have a white wire exiting)

 

So I hope this info has helped you because it has only disturbed me. In the end I suppose it might just be your solenoid. But I guess the best advice I have for you is to remove the Black/white wire from the Spade Connector and attach a wire of your own. Turn the Key to Start and touch the wire (in some kind of safe manner) to your positive terminal on your battery. If it starts 20 out 20 times with a direct 12V lead then I would focuse on the above mentioned info. if not then I would look at the solenoid as a prime suspect.

[Hayne]

Thanks sregor13. I'll give this a try.

[john in KY]

It has been my experience the starter solenoid is not getting enough amps, not volts, to energize. Not enough amps because there is too much resistance somehere in the circuit. What I have done is to just install another relay under the hood. One side of the relay connects directly to the battery and the other to the starter solenoid. The original solenoid wire is then used to trigger the new relay. Takes about 30" to install and has worked every time for me.

[Hayne]

I've also heard of this solution. Thanks, Hayne

[sregor13]

Where is the original relay located? What color wire goes in and out of it? Or perhaps you can descibe the relay. I guess what I am wondering is do you leave the original relay in place? Thanks

[Cougar]

There is no relay in the circuit to power the solenoid. The power runs from the fusible link, to the ignition switch, to the inhibit sw(w/AT only) and then to the starter solenoid. To me it is better to fix the problem rather than add something new. I don't like changing the OEM system unless it is really necessary, but that's just me.

 

I think most of these problems come from bad connections at the fusible link or the ignition switch connection.

[sregor13]

Thats what I thought. I looked at the Diagram, but was reading him say adding "another" relay. Yea, thanks Cougar for all your expertise. I have learned alot on this thread. Although I have yet to come find the solution. On thing I did notice is the White wire is crimped into another white wire. I does not look OEM becasue it had Electrical Tape. Does this sound right to you? Thanks

 

 

There is no relay in the circuit to power the solenoid. The power runs from the fusible link, to the ignition switch, to the inhibit sw(w/AT only) and then to the starter solenoid. To me it is better to fix the problem rather than add something new. I don't like changing the OEM system unless it is really necessary, but that's just me.

 

I think most of these problems come from bad connections at the fusible link or the ignition switch connection.

[Skip]

This problem is so common it should be in the USRM

 

Here is a wiring diagram of the fix I have used on

5 different L series cars

 

[Cougar]

Your welcome for the help.

 

It sounds like someone added the extra wire but I can't say for sure.

[Hayne]

Thanks a bunch for the diagram. With my daughters acting up pretty consistant and ours starting to give problems it does seem to be pretty common. I have an old 80 Corolla SW that does the same thing. It was suggested by someone years ago. It seemed to help changing the battery cables on it. But I figured they really took a beating considering the genius that designed it put the starter right under the exhaust down pipe. Great place for a major electrical component. Makes you wonder why a relay wasn't incorporated in the first place.Thanks again.

[Skip]

You are most welcome, hope it helps.