Ryanb Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 i went off roading yesterday ( I don't know if thats relevant or not) and today I have no lights. I had lights earlier today but then they just quit working. I still have brake lights, hazards, and signals. No* It's not a fuse. I also tried a different switch. My haynes is not offering much help. Anybody have any ideas? 83 GL Wagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoscowSubaruDude Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 Knocked the plugs/harness off the back of the lights? check them out, had that happen to my passenger side light, one of em, anyway, when i came down off an embankment at speed, fast enough to have the rear wheels off the bank before the front ones started to drop and slammed the frame down hard once. Different suby tho, my old 2wd 83 wagon, before it blew a head gasket. First place I'd check, and then just go back from there, checking every connection. Did you get any water in any connnections? I mean a lot... aka fording streams and whatnot? If not, then I'd check the connectors. Especially the grounds, if they came loose, they won't work. My 0.02 Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 16, 2005 Author Share Posted November 16, 2005 Yeah, maybe. But why would the headlights, high beams, and tail lights all go out just cause one wasn;t connected properly? I'm thinking it's more about something that connects them all toegther. The fuse box, a relay, a connection at the fusible links...something. I just don't know where to start, electrical freaks me out, I don;t mess with it too much. Knocked the plugs/harness off the back of the lights? check them out, had that happen to my passenger side light, one of em, anyway, when i came down off an embankment at speed, fast enough to have the rear wheels off the bank before the front ones started to drop and slammed the frame down hard once. Different suby tho, my old 2wd 83 wagon, before it blew a head gasket. First place I'd check, and then just go back from there, checking every connection. Did you get any water in any connnections? I mean a lot... aka fording streams and whatnot? If not, then I'd check the connectors. Especially the grounds, if they came loose, they won't work.My 0.02 Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subarian Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 I'm not sure, but I think Subarus have a headlight relay. That's where I would look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 There is a lighting relay on the left side of the dash. If it is the problem and it is just dirty contacts causing the trouble, you may be able to get it to work by tapping on it with a screwdriver handle . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zyewdall Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 Yeah. There is a lighting relay or two. I think my '82 GL might have had three. One for running lights, one for low beams, and one for high beams, because I just lost my low beams. If the car warmed up, the low beams would start working again. I never did find the relay, as the rest of the car gave out soon after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomRhere Posted November 16, 2005 Share Posted November 16, 2005 Lost the lights on my old '86 BRAT. Found that the connection under the Fusable Link box had broken off. Have to un-bolt the box to see the bottom, but would check there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 *Update** Here's what else I know... They sem to be shorting some where. When I'm not evcen touching the car they sometimes come on by themselves now. This wasn't happening before. When the lights aren't working, neither are the 3 fuses on the bottom left of the fuse box...the rear license illumination, the Rh and the LH all don't get power, but the fusible links still do. Also, while all the lights were on I unplugged 4 relayes under the hood next to the fusable links, but even with all 4 unplugged the lights stayed on. The right relay on the bracket clicks when the lights are turned on, but when I unplugged it it didn;t seem to affect anything??!?!?! Anybody! Please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 Bump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 The lighting relay is under the dash on the left side. It is fed power by one of the red fusible links. The link ties to a blk/wht wire. I think the problem is due to either a loose fusible link connection or a dirty relay contact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Ryan, The entire lighting grid is powered by the a fusible link. These are located in the black plastic box mounted on the over flow bottle behind the battery. Lift the entire plastic box to get at the wires connected to it. The link you want to test has a black with white stripe wire. Run a jumper wire from the battery positive post to this wire. My check mark goes beside a loose connection to the link (this may become evident when you look under the link box.) Good luck let us know what you find. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 Thanks. But it's not the fusible links. They are all just fine, and they are all still getting power...any other ideas? I will look under the link box though for a faluty wire or a short, thanks Skip Ryan, The entire lighting grid is powered by the a fusible link. These are located in the black plastic box mounted on the over flow bottle behind the battery. Lift the entire plastic box to get at the wires connected to it. The link you want to test has a black with white stripe wire. Run a jumper wire from the battery positive post to this wire. My check mark goes beside a loose connection to the link (this may become evident when you look under the link box.) Good luck let us know what you find. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 The lighting relay is between the fusible link and fuses 9,10, and 11. You stated that the power to the fuses is not there when the problem happens so either the relay is intermittent or the wiring from the fusible link is faulty. The wire color from the fusible link to the relay is blk/wht and the color of the wire from the relay to the fuses is blk/red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zyewdall Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 The lighting relay is between the fusible link and fuses 9,10, and 11. You stated that the power to the fuses is not there when the problem happens so either the relay is intermittent or the wiring from the fusible link is faulty. I think Cougar may have it. Or: Electrical Gremlins. One of their favorite habitats (other than british cars) is old subaru's. To fix this requires proper karma, fung shei, an exorcist, a little application of voodoo, and a little bit of jedi powers. A mere voltmeter and copper wire seldom has any effect in my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 With all due respect I must disagree Zyewdall. Armed with a mere voltmeter a Jedi Knight can find the trouble with just about any electrical system on the 4 wheeled transporter. May the Fluke be with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 I have been using a voltimiter to test connections, It's difficult because the lights occasionally come back on, in turn suppliying power back to those fuses. I'm still at work but as soon as I get home I will check that relay and under the fusible links. Thanks alot for your guys' input. My haynes is barely being helpfull and I don't have a facroty service manual. Withough the advice of you guys I'd be up a creek, hopefully I'm not now. -Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 You're welcome. I would try lightly tapping the suspected areas with a screwdriver handle. It may tell you where the problem area is at real quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 Ryan Hope we help some. My reading of the wiring diagram lame as it may be, and not on par with Glenn's, does not show a single relay in control of the entire lighting grid. Each head light has it's own relay and the relay for the left hand lights also powers the parking lites. So if both head lights are out (high and low beam) then both relays must be out of action. So if hot wiring the black/white wire at the fusible link box does not solve the problem, the next truly universal control is the light switch or it's connector. By chance does the auxiliary parking light switch on the steering column provide any illumination? My guess is no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 Skip, The info I am using is from a CD I purchased on Ebay. It is a Mitchell On-Demand CD and covers '83 thru '20. It was cheap and covers the basics fairly well but it doesn't replace a factory manual. I mainly got it to help with questions on the site here. Since all the lights are having a problem and the 3 fuses lose power I suspect that the lighting relay may be the problem, or the wiring to it. I'm not sure why your info shows something different. There is another section that covers the digital dash and I haven't looked at that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 18, 2005 Author Share Posted November 18, 2005 Here's the news... Still no lights....with the switch on I get power at the fusible links. The black/white wire under the red fusable link gets power as well. Under the dash The small metal almost cansiter shape object I assume is the relay. It has a black/red wire out the back. No power in that line at all...so that would mean it would be that relay, correct? I tried tapping it and it did nothing at all. I'm gonna go buy a new one of those tommorow at Napa and hope that solves it. Anybody think that means something else that I'm missing? Please feel free to enlighten me. Thanks again for all your help and input, much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 You need to also check to see if the relay coil is getting voltage to it when the lights are supposed to be on. My info shows two other black wires going to the relay which should be tied to the coil side of the relay. One of the wires goes to ground so the other one will be from the switch. One of the black wires should have 12 volts on it when the light switch is on. If you don't have any voltage then the problem will be towards the switch. To prove the relay is ok you can use Skips idea of applying voltage to the relay coil and see if it turns the lights on. Just be sure you don't apply power to the wire going to ground. By pulling the relay and ohmming the wires to ground you will find out which is which unless you already have found it by seeing voltage on the wire when power is on. You may also be able to find another relay you can swap with to see if that will make it work. Edit: Another trick you may want to try is to turn on the lights while placing one hand on the relay. You may be able to feel the action inside it indicating it is getting coil voltage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryanb Posted November 19, 2005 Author Share Posted November 19, 2005 Okay...ready for my day? First of all, YAY IT WORKS! I found the relay under the dash, EVENTUALLY I got one at napa for like 26 bucks. Then the lights worked. In the process I was rear ended from behind. Then, on my way to get food, my clutch cable snapped. I spent the better part of my day changing that ************ like Mcguyver with the 3 tools I had on my person. That was after a mile and half walk to the Subie dealer nearest me for a new cable. That all said and done I made it over to the napa JUST before it got dark and luckily once I bought the relay I had light. The best part ( besides trasportaion ) my mudrat rear bumper and two hitch F&$#%d this guys whole grill and bumper up. Not even a tiny scrath on my car. LOLZ LOLZ LOLZ! Thanks a million , especially Cougar and Skip, you saved my rump roast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Thanks for the thanks but Glen deserves all the credit. I mis-read the original post "I'll never own another EA82" I thought it was an EA82 car and you were fed up with that series I was working on the premise that it was an EA82 series Glen had it correct from the beginning and he is the man P.S. I meant no malice in my relay comment - Glen does do his homework as I obviously did not until it was too late Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 19, 2005 Share Posted November 19, 2005 Wow! What an adventure story. Glad you got the problem solved at least and you're welcome for the help. Thanks for the feeback. Skip, Now I see why are info was different. I don't usually beat you to the punch on these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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