New member, 94 Loyale 4WD Releasing?

[SubyRan3]

Hi folks, I recently purchased an 'experienced' 94 Loyale with only 65K original miles on it (3rd Subaru, 1st w/ 4WD). It's a 5 speed manual w/ pushbutton 4WD w/ lots of extras. The car is in great shape and was meticulously cared for. When I got it home a couple of weeks ago, I backed it into the yard (through about 10" of snow) in 4WD without incident (the wheels didn't spin at all). Since then it's been sitting in the yard in very cold temps and we've accumulated a little more snow. Last weekend I pulled it out of the yard (more snow now and hard packed) and when I applied a little extra torque to get out of the packed stuff, the 4WD slipped and I could hear a 'whirring/clicking' sound from the trans that changed with engine RPM's. I had to dis-engage the 4WD and re-engage it before it would grip at all again and then it did the same thing. Once I got it out of the yard and ran it on the street (hard packed snow/ice), I couldn't make the 4WD slip. Got back home and experienced the 'slipping' in the harder deep stuff in the yard again. Any Ideas? Thanks.

[tunered]

i am not familar with standard trans,i have never heard of a 4wd button,what is this button you are pushing?

[SubyRan3]

i am not familar with standard trans,i have never heard of a 4wd button,what is this button you are pushing?

 

The 5 speed has a 4WD On/Off pushbutton at the top of the stick-shift.

[WoodsWagon]

#1 your in the wrong forum. The loyale is considerd an old gen subie, becuse it was a hold over from the GL/DL models of the late 80's. It's a good solid car.

 

#2 Pushbutton trannies run off of vacuum. The button runs a couple of vacuum solenoids under the hood by the brake resivaor (sp?). If there is a vaccum leak, it might not fully engage the 4wd and that would let it slip out.

Does the engine run worse when you engage the 4wd?

[SubyRan3]

Thanks for the help. I'm gonna check the vacuum today because I'm also getting an EGR soleniod code (34) from the ECM and I've cleaned the EGR and it appears to be working fine. So I think it may be vacuum related as you said.

[Skip]

Ran,

The EGR code is for open windings in the EGR control solenoid.

It has nothing to do with the valve or the vacuum needed to activate it.

Follow the rubber line from the valve it will end at the solenoid. Check for open windings with a multimeter.

 

The 4wd issue could be vacuum or more likely the cable or engagement lever on the tranny.

It could be frozen or jammed from ice, snow or...

 

You will find the vacuum motor / diaphragm by following the rubber lines from the control solenoids.

This pair of solenoids are located under the hood on the shelf in front of the drivers side hood hinge.

 

Hope this helps

[SubyRan3]

Thanks a bunch Skip! I'll also check the EGR solenoid coil as you suggested. As far as the 4WD (packed ice and snow), We've been in a thaw here recently (now that winter's officially here) so I'll check the 4WD again.

[SubyRan3]

Vacuum tested fine (19-20 Hhg) steady at idle with a slight brief drop (to 18 Hhg) in vac when the 4WD is switched on. EGR solenoid coil showed high resistance and the solenoid is open (guess the ECM was right), gonna try to find a new one today. Tested the 4WD again and found that it takes more torque now (above freezing) to make it 'slip'. When it does release there is a loud 'clunk' from under the car (sounds further back then the trans) just prior to the release. This is occuring as the car begins to move slowly (forward or reverse) through the snow as I engage the clutch. No vibrations or noise on the road so I don't suspect any problems with the U-joints. Gonna check the gear lube, linkage and the rear end lube next.

[[HTi]Johnson]

Check all your axles for any signs of tears. You could have spun a cup, that pops out every now and then.

 

Also, check your rear differential(diff). It should be a 3.900 Gear Ratio. There is a sticker on the back of the diff, it may have mud on it, so you will have to wipe it off. I had a car with similar problems...it was an 3.700 Gear Ratio Automatic Tranny with a 3.9 rear diff. It would make a clunk when I gave it gas, but I didn't realize that it had a 3.9 rear diff until the automatic tranny fried and I converted to a manual.

 

Keep us up to date.

[SubyRan3]

Thanks for the advice. I'll check the axles. I'm not familiar with the phrase "spun a cup". What are you refering to? As far as the ratio goes, I'll check it to make sure but it seems unlikely that it would be mismatched. The original owner had the car serviced at the Subaru dealer for everything and as far as I know, neither the rear end or transmission were ever replaced.

[TomRhere]

Welcome to the Board from another Michigander.

 

Not real familiar with your tranny, but I'll go along with Skips idea of binding cable/lever. Different tranny set-up yes, but the center diff-lock on my XT-6 was acting the same way, wouldn't fully shift all the time. I just sat there cycling it on and off, and now it works. May be worth a try. You can also spray some lithium grease into the end of the cable, then cycle it on/off, spraying more grease every so many times. This will work it up into the cable. However, this is if one can get to the "free" end of the cable. Like I said, not real familiar with your tranny set-up.

[[HTi]Johnson]

Spinning a cup refers to the DOJs (DOuble offset joints, right?)... there are spots in them that the bearings of the axle shaft go into...like three channels...so the cup can "grip" the axle and transfer the rotation from the tranny stub to the wheels...they make it so they can slide in and out to make up for the up and down travel of the wheel. I hope somebody can explain this better.

But, if you spun a cup...that means the channels in the DOJ have stripped and it will just spin around the axle... but I read your post again and I don't think that is your problem.

[SubyRan3]

Welcome to the Board from another Michigander.

 

Not real familiar with your tranny, but I'll go along with Skips idea of binding cable/lever. Different tranny set-up yes, but the center diff-lock on my XT-6 was acting the same way, wouldn't fully shift all the time. I just sat there cycling it on and off, and now it works. May be worth a try. You can also spray some lithium grease into the end of the cable, then cycle it on/off, spraying more grease every so many times. This will work it up into the cable. However, this is if one can get to the "free" end of the cable. Like I said, not real familiar with your tranny set-up.

Thanks Tom, I probably won't be climbing under the car until this weekend to give it a good look see. I did check the gear lube in the tranmission and it's quite dirty so it looks like a gear lube change is next. I also priced the EGR solenoid from the dealer (unavailable at three different auto stores). Cost is $104.00, wow!

[TomRhere]

Yeah, they are right proud of those solenoids. A trip to the local salvage yard, with your multi-meter is best bet. Also, the solenoid next to it is for the Purge canister, if I remember right. One of those will work, you just have to change the connector for the wiring of it.

[SubyRan3]

Yeah, they are right proud of those solenoids. A trip to the local salvage yard, with your multi-meter is best bet. Also, the solenoid next to it is for the Purge canister, if I remember right. One of those will work, you just have to change the connector for the wiring of it.

Thanks Tom, for another good tip. This message board is great, I'm glad I stumbled onto it!

[WoodsWagon]

And for the vacuum solenoid, don't limit yourself to subaru's. Mine is running one off of a cadilac. 40 something ohms is what the computer expects to see from the solenoid coils. Then just cut, solder and heat shrink the old connector onto the new solenoid.

[SubyRan3]

...I probably won't be climbing under the car until this weekend to give it a good look see. I did check the gear lube in the tranmission and it's quite dirty so it looks like a gear lube change is next...

Changed the gear lube yesterday. It was dirtier then I thought and ran out like water when I drained it. Didn't have time yet to check the rear diff or axles. Haven't had an opportunity to retest the 4WD much but it didn't slip as I manuvered it around on the soft ground in the backyard so hopefully it's fixed. I was bummed out to find a hole in the floorboard at the mounting assm where the driveshaft splits. There must've been a crack in the undercoating there and the salt evidentally got to it. Big bummer cause the rest of the car (including the engine compartment) is in great shape. For now, I greased it up real good and will try to fix it in the spring.

[stevo151617]

i had the opposite problem but could be related. i was stuck in 4wd in my 91 loyale wagon 5speed with the same pushbutton 4wd. the solenoids are on the left fender/firewall area up near the master cylinder (where you add brake fluid). i could hear them click so i knew that that was good. i then traced the vaccuum line that those solenoids controlled. that line runs to a large "diaphram" located on the left (drivers side) of the transmission.from that diaphram controls the action of a cable that runs all the way around the top of the transmission to the right side of the transmission, where it hooks to a linkage that goes into the transmission.at the point where the cable connects to the linkage, the cable snapped. it snapped in the 4wd position. i cut a hole in the floor and hooked up a manual lever to the linkage because im cheap. it is more than likely your cable may have snapped if you pushed the button on the stick while you were moving and it is stuck in 2wd and when you push the button on the stick the cable is hitting the linkage and not quite making it all the way into 4wd. sometimes these things are tricky with when to put into 4wd and when not to. if you find that you need the solenoids or the diaphragm i would be willing to remove them, sell and ship them to you.

let me know!

[DaveT]

EGR solenoid coil showed high resistance and the solenoid is open (guess the ECM was right), gonna try to find a new one today.

 

This is a recurring problem.

Take a look here:

http://users.adelphia.net/~davidtief/solenoid.html