SakoTGrimes Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Every time I go wheeling I am re-amazed at how incredible these cars are. Do the Japanese have anywhere to drive where a car as hardcore as the Subaru is needed? So anyways, I goes up to Anderson Butte today to ride my bike, which I built specifically for that mountain (although you wouldn't know by looking) and it had snowed a lot, like a foot. On my way up, a guy in a dually Ford was towing a trailer down the mountain, so I pulled over into a snow bank to give him plenty of room to pass. His tires (all 6 of em) are spinning faster than the truck, fronts pointed left, truck still going straight. Being nice, he stopped and offered to pull me out backwards if I couldn't get out, (I did bury the Soob pretty good) but that wasn't neccesarry. I have d/r and 205/70/R15 studded snow tires that hit the fender wells when fully turned. Near the top, there's massive hills made up of broken rock and hard packed gravel, covered in snow. The steepest angle I climbed was maybe 30 degrees, and only one wheel spun a little bit. No LSDs here. After that, I tried to climb the same hill on my bike, couldn't do it. Then I tried it on foot, still couldn't do it. But the Sub made it up just fine. I am going to miss this car when I move. I'll built up a lifted EA82 instead Subarus for the win!!!1 __ __/ / / / / O/ <----- thats my car car, can ya tell? / / / /___ /O / Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SakoTGrimes Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 __ __/ / / / / O/ <----- thats my car car, can ya tell? / / / /___ /O / looks like my wagon got botched in posting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKSTI Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 nice! Youre torturing me while i get the $$$ for the AA kit for my legacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyB0y Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I think I have the answer to your Q ... Fuji Heavy Industries (I know I'm smart but no not really an rump roast ... most of the time )... but I doubt they ever concieved of the amazing things we do with them ... who knows, maybe I am wrong and there is a mud pit near the factory where all the mechanics play with their old lifted Ru's :-p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrap487 Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 hey, its a light car with the same 4wd system as there are on larger suvs and trucks, and with narrower and shorter wheelbase... big truck performance in a little package Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Actually - Subaru was very active in the rally scene in places like africa - the "Safari" rally's..... wherever did they get this idea? Well they stole it much as they stole the "Boxer" design from VW. See - Audi (VW subsidiary) was HUGE into rally back in the 80's. '81 was the first year to see the Audi chain drive "quattro" system. Basically Subaru didn't amount to much until Group B rally was eliminated and Audi left the rally scene never to return. That left no one but Subaru using the symetric AWD layout. And yes - to this day the Audi setup is near identical to the Subaru stuff. Take a look at any new Audi quattro. Mean - very mean. The 4WD transaxle design was used on some models of the Kubelwagon back in WWII by the germans. Basically a VW beetle with a PTO on the end of the transaxle driving the front wheels. Dr. Porsche had it right all along.... The soob layout is a decendant of this design, with the diffs reversed and the engine in the front... water cooling and a more conventional look to the vehicle probably prompted this change. Take a look sometime at the EA81, and the VW 1.6 used in the old air cooled beetles. The design of the engine is so similar that the distributors will swap between the two - drive gears are the same. Other than being water cooled the differences are slight. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Actually - Subaru was very active in the rally scene in places like africa - the "Safari" rally's..... wherever did they get this idea? Well they stole it much as they stole the "Boxer" design from VW. See - Audi (VW subsidiary) was HUGE into rally back in the 80's. '81 was the first year to see the Audi chain drive "quattro" system. Basically Subaru didn't amount to much until Group B rally was eliminated and Audi left the rally scene never to return. That left no one but Subaru using the symetric AWD layout. And yes - to this day the Audi setup is near identical to the Subaru stuff. Take a look at any new Audi quattro. Mean - very mean. The 4WD transaxle design was used on some models of the Kubelwagon back in WWII by the germans. Basically a VW beetle with a PTO on the end of the transaxle driving the front wheels. Dr. Porsche had it right all along.... The soob layout is a decendant of this design, with the diffs reversed and the engine in the front... water cooling and a more conventional look to the vehicle probably prompted this change. Take a look sometime at the EA81, and the VW 1.6 used in the old air cooled beetles. The design of the engine is so similar that the distributors will swap between the two - drive gears are the same. Other than being water cooled the differences are slight. GD I have noticed the similarities (I also have a VW bug) and have wondered how long an EA81 would last without a cooling system if the heads had cooling fins, and a big fan like the aircooleds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Audi started the Quattro system after subaru started their 4WD system - Subaru introduced 4WD into a car in 1975, the Quattro came out in 1980 - the center differential concept came from the Jeep Quadra-Trac system of the 1970's I wouldn't say Subaru STOLE the ideas, it merely combined a number of ideas from different manufacturers into it's final design. For that matter, the 2WD subaru drivetrain is very similar to the Citroen 2CV's design, albeit the subaru has twice as many cylinders and is water cooled - and the 2CV came out about the same time as the VW beetle - for that matter, the FWD concept/design behind the early 2WD cars goes back to the "Traction Advant" (also made by Citroen) from the early 1930's - it had a water-cooled I4 too - It also PREDATED THE BEETLE!!! So Subaru stole from Citroen as much, if not more than it did from VW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmes Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 The long block from my old '72 VW Squareback looked a LOT like my EA82. I was amazed when I first saw a Subaru long block. I had heard about the similarities, but didn't realize the extent. I read somewhere that the WRX is very similar to a Porsche in many ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Audi started the Quattro system after subaru started their 4WD system - Subaru introduced 4WD into a car in 1975, the Quattro came out in 1980 - the center differential concept came from the Jeep Quadra-Trac system of the 1970's Actually 72 for 4wd subes.The centre differential comes from the Ferguson 4wd system pioneered on the 1966 Jensen FF.I don`t think Jeep ever invented anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Audi started the Quattro system after subaru started their 4WD system - Subaru introduced 4WD into a car in 1975, the Quattro came out in 1980 - the center differential concept came from the Jeep Quadra-Trac system of the 1970's I wouldn't say Subaru STOLE the ideas, it merely combined a number of ideas from different manufacturers into it's final design. For that matter, the 2WD subaru drivetrain is very similar to the Citroen 2CV's design, albeit the subaru has twice as many cylinders and is water cooled - and the 2CV came out about the same time as the VW beetle - for that matter, the FWD concept/design behind the early 2WD cars goes back to the "Traction Advant" (also made by Citroen) from the early 1930's - it had a water-cooled I4 too - It also PREDATED THE BEETLE!!! So Subaru stole from Citroen as much, if not more than it did from VW I am perfectly aware of when Subaru introduced 4WD, but Audi (VW) as I said did this in the 30's. The AWD system of the 80's for them was simply a use of tech they already had around. Audi merely used the VW tech they already had around, as did Subaru. Audi advanced the system to AWD where subaru simply went with 4WD. The advance to AWD didn't happen until around 84 for Subaru. The PTO idea as I said came from the Kubelwagon of the late 30's. Believe me - the Japanese aren't stupid, and the VW transaxle design is very good. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack in Norfolk Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 I don't know exactly where the design came from or who stole what from whom. And everything written so far is speculative, but interesting. I do remember seeing somewhere on this board that the first 4wd subaru was a wagon and that it was built for the Japanese power company to be used we use our powerline trucks. To get out to remote places and fix the power. Someone had the idea to market this to the public and eventually they found their way to the states and I believe the subaru wagon has been the best selling car in the rockies and the northeast ever since. In regards to the notion that Subaru 4wd was "stolen", it is entirely possible. Another example of this is the Toyota Land Cruiser. The old ones (FJ 40 and previous) were descended from the vehicles built in occupied Japan for the allies. They were essentially told to build a Jeep and came out with something better; that is coming from a Jeep owner by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fishums Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 The Germans made some high quality stuff and the japanese learned from them, as did the rest of the world. VW is a spawn of porsche, which Dr Ferdinand created. This even included a fully fuctional 4 wheel drive electric car created in the year 1900. The air/water cooled versions of the VW/porsche have been heavily borrowed from and are amazingly strong reliable power plants, Subaru would be stupid not to use them :-p! If you have worked on air cooled VW/Porsche engines you will see they have so much in common you can even bolt some the engines and parts back and fourth, with no modifications. Everyone learns from everything, I'm sure even Ferdinand himself didn't just have the idea of opposing cyclenders pop in his head overnight. http://www.motorsportshalloffame.com/halloffame/1996/Dr_Ferdinand_Porsche_400.jpg I have a picture of the first beetle rolling out of the factory, with hitler driving it and Ferdinand at his side. I'd post the image but I would most likely be called a raciest, so I'm not going to bother lol. Look at it this way, who was germany allied with in WW2? wouldn't it be benificial to share technology with your friends? That's my guess. PEace, Fishums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack in Norfolk Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Look at it this way, who was germany allied with in WW2? wouldn't it be benificial to share technology with your friends? That's my guess. That makes a lot of sense. Especially when you consider the fact that Fuji heavy machine corp came into being after the war when they could no longer build air planes (same is true of BMW and probably other car companies). The first Fuji Rabbit Scooters used landing gear wheels from air planes as thier wheels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 That makes a lot of sense. Especially when you consider the fact that Fuji heavy machine corp came into being after the war when they could no longer build air planes (same is true of BMW and probably other car companies). The first Fuji Rabbit Scooters used landing gear wheels from air planes as thier wheels. Yeah - there was a lot of tech sharing between the two. Jet technology was another. The Japaneses did eventually build some jets right before the end - never in enough numbers tho. To sum it up - VW made the Rod shifted transaxle, and opposed cylinder engine combination the standard by which all small cars were measured around the world with their Beetle. Subaru relied heavily on this example. Honda did not, and neither did toyota. They could have, but clearly chose not to. And it's not really a matter of "stealing" anything I guess - we gave them a lot of leeway after the war - heck we just looked the other way when they walked all over RCA's patent on the B&W TV.... in the intrest of rebuilding their country. Made so much money, they just bought the patent for color! GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now