Questions about my "new" 01 Outback LL Bean

[Audiophobe]

Sorry about the newbie questions.

I bought an '01 LL Bean Outback (6 cyl.) with high miles (130k) from a used car dealer.

I know from having other high milage cars that there are major tunes, like timing belts, pumps, tensioners, plugs, ect., that need to be done.

Is there any way to tell if this was done?

Also, is there any maintanance that needs tio be done to the auto tranny?

What preventive measures should I be taking?

Thanks

[1 Lucky Texan]

Sorry about the newbie questions.

I bought an '01 LL Bean Outback (6 cyl.) with high miles (130k) from a used car dealer.

I know from having other high milage cars that there are major tunes, like timing belts, pumps, tensioners, plugs, ect., that need to be done.

Is there any way to tell if this was done?

Also, is there any maintanance that needs tio be done to the auto tranny?

What preventive measures should I be taking?

Thanks

 

That engine has a chain so no worrys on belt replacement.

Confirm that the FWD fuse is NOT installed and make some slow figure eights to check for 'torque bind' (try a search)

If you cannot confirm any service, immediately plan to flush and refill the tranny. You probably should've had a mech check the car before pruchasing, but doing it now and getting some thinks looked at may cost a little - but likely will prevent a breakdown. make sure any service done to the cooling/radiator system is done by someone who understands how to properly 'burp' the system.

Plugs would be another area to inspect. Pulling ECU codes and maybe testing for 'lazy' O2 sensors would be a good idea.

Maybe change differential grease. Inspect CV boots and brakes.

 

others may have some ideas.

 

(my wife has an '03 OBW H6, much fewer miles than yours but it has been reliable so far!)

[Audiophobe]

Does that mean a timing chain never (under normal circumstances) needs replacement?

Why doesn't evryone use chains instead of belts?

[1 Lucky Texan]

Does that mean a timing chain never (under normal circumstances) needs replacement?

Why doesn't evryone use chains instead of belts?

 

I think there is fairly sophisticated engineering to get the noise down. Plus, they may be heavier.

Nissan uses a chain in V6s - probably a lot of others do too.

 

I dunno why it isn't universally used.

[OB99W]

Does that mean a timing chain never (under normal circumstances) needs replacement?

Why doesn't evryone use chains instead of belts?

Timing chains, like other engine parts, do wear. Since they have to be lubricated (unlike a belt), the rate of wear partly relates to the condition of the engine oil. If the oil isn't of sufficient quality or changed frequently enough, the chain (just like other engine parts) will wear faster than it should. In addition, the sprockets the chain runs on (sometimes called "gears") also wear. The wear has the effect of "stretching" the chain, with ever-increasing timing errors being the result. The fibers in timing belts don't tend to stretch much, keeping timing more accurate during the life of the belt. Of course there is some wear of the teeth and eventual cracking of the belt's rubber compound, but hopefully the belt would be changed before that causes a problem.

 

Timing chains tend to be noisier than belts. Some manufacturers use plastic-toothed sprockets to reduce noise. Unfortunately, they don't seem to be as reliable as metal ones. Also, due to the need for lubrication and other factors, a chain can't be enclosed in simple unsealed/ungasketed covers. In addition, the tight turns from sprocket-to-sprocket necessary on some engines (especially certain DOHC) are more easily accommodated by a belt than a chain.

 

And as "1 Lucky Texan" suggested, the mass of a chain versus a belt would almost always be a design consideration.

[ferret]

Working on cars for over 45 yrs here are my observations, (sorry if any of this is a restatement, but are my views):

 

Chains do stretch, are noisy, need lubrication, cost more and are not as precise on timing. Also as stated were part of the oiling gallies to keep them properly lubricated.

 

Newer vehicles, especially OHC, brought to the world a longer reach for that timing chain, and long chains had keepers or tensioners added which had to be much heavier and heftier to control a larger moving mass. Long chains, when at speed, also shiver, shake and squirm more leading to more wear and tear.

 

Belts have a lower mass, are more easily tensioned, keep timing more precise (especially needed for todays emissions). Also can go up to 100K these days without normal maintainence. I remember doing a lot of Chevy's, Pontiac's and Ford's timing chains with a lot less than 100K on the Odometer. Either they broke, stretched and jumped a tooth, or as pointed out had a nylon coated timing gear which shattered and the chain lost all drive timing capabilities.

 

I now look at Motorcycles and remember the chains on bikes on the highway and watching the chains shake and squirm (and require lubrication). The new ones with belt are so quiet....and less lost to belt squirm or vibration.

 

End of MY $.02...

[Audiophobe]

Sooo....

When is the recommended major tune?(timing chain, ect.)

[ferret]

The 3.0 chain is designed to last the life of the engine according to Subaru. There are really 2 chains under the casing cover.

[shaggywerewolf]

http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/H4H6Fall03.pdf

 

Some interesting reading with a few pictures of the H6 with the timing cover removed.

[cookie]

But unlike belts, chains rarely just break. Modern timing chains usually last the life of the camshaft.

Both systems have good and bad points on thier design. I bet those new Subaru sixes are going to prove to be excellent engines.

[OB99W]

http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/H4H6Fall03.pdf

Thanks for the link. Note the part near the end of page 13, "The timing chain on the EZ-3.0 is designed to last the life of the engine. Proper engine oil maintenance is necessary to ensure its longevity." (I added the emphasis.) While good oil is obviously important for all of the engine components, timing chains really don't like incorrect/contaminated/fuel-diluted oil.

[1 Lucky Texan]

http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/H4H6Fall03.pdf

 

Some interesting reading with a few pictures of the H6 with the timing cover removed.

 

excellent!

 

btw- I noticed on page 9 it says 5-30w oil is recommended to improve fuel economy. NOT engine longevity!

 

(*ducking*)

 

lol!

 

Carl

[cookie]

When you go in for a tune up it's going to be fairly simple as far as filters and such go. Prepare yourself for a bit of a shock on the expense of a plug change though, it is a hard engine to change plugs on.

[shaggywerewolf]

"The timing chain on the EZ-3.0 is designed to last the life of the engine. Proper engine oil maintenance is necessary to ensure its longevity."

 

I remember being told the same thing by the Saturn dealer when I used to have my old SL2. These engines had a timing chain as well, and was apparently rather picky about clean oil. Might be mistaken, but I believe the 1.9L DOHC engine in these cars was an interference design.

[cookie]

Nearly all engines are interference these days except Briggs and Strattons.

My BMW uses a timeing chain on its complicated "M" engine. The only complaints I ever hear are from folks who don't keep thier oil changed. This often plugs up the tensioners or vanos variable valve timing. Frankly on the board I follow there have only been two complaints of this in five years, so it's not very common.

[Audiophobe]

What about transmission service. Should I get a flush and change?

[Wayne Boncyk]

I'm surprised that nipper hasn't spoken up on this one. He will tell you, rightly so, that a host of problems (and potential problems in the making) will be forestalled by a tranny fluid flush. He and I differ over the wisdom of using synthetic tranny fluid in a high mileage rig - I think it's a good idea and he thinks I'm dead wrong - but the essential truth is, if you want that tranny to last you've gotta change fluid regularly. Personally, if it were my car I would probably do it just on principles since you don't know the history. Others might say to look at the color of the fluid in there now. Bright red is good, brick red is on the way out, and brown is a clear DANGER signal flashing right at you. So if the fluid is any color other than the clear bright red as it comes out of the bottle, I'd say change it -- and if that tranny has an external fluid filter, change that, too!

[OB99W]

What about transmission service. Should I get a flush and change?

If there's any question as to fluid age/condition, it's probably a good idea to completely replace it; that's what a "flush" does. In my opinion, don't have any additional chemical cleaning done, as that often leads to problems.