Mystery Marvel and No Leak: Reaction when used together?

[Cynthia]

Hey .....

 

I've used No Leak (http://www.goldeagle.com/no-leak/faqs_no-leak.asp?sub_cat=Brown%20Leaks) in my 89 GL FWD Sedan Subaru. And I used Mystery Marvel.

 

Used MM first and then not long after No Leak. So, tell me, will the lifter cleaning benefits of MM disappear from using No Leak????

 

Reason I ask is because my lifter ticking had stopped after using MM.

 

So, then I used No Leak to do the obvious. It's helped a ton but now that I've slowed the leaks, the ticking returned.

 

I got to thinking that maybe the No Leak had reversed the effects of MM on the lifter.

 

Possible?

[GeneralDisorder]

Solution - STOP USING ADDITIVES. Fix the problems.

 

Hate to yell, but if they worked, Subaru would tell you to use them or the oil companies would have already included them in the oil.

 

There is no silver bullet for this stuff - lifter ticking is usually a result of bad oil pressure. MMO is just a cleanser/degreaser, which is already present in your oil in lesser quantities. Flushing the engine with MMO is not bad - I just wouldn't leave it in there.

 

If you have leaks - replace the seals or buy kitty litter. They are hard and no amount of additives will bring back hard, crusty rubber. The sealing junk you used probable sealed up the lifters just as much as it sealed up the gaskets - now you have a mess. No leaks, but oil can't get to the lifters to inflate them.

 

Flush the engine out a couple times with kerosene or MMO, etc. Run a whole case of cheap, cheap oil through it - replace it every couple hundred and the filter too. If the lifters tick, repalce the oil pump seals, and cam tower seals, and possibly the whole oil pump (I replace the whole pump - they DO go bad). If that doesn't stop the ticking, likely the lifters are worn from lack of oil flow - have to replace them too. There's a place that can rebuild them - someone posted a link to them. Pretty reasonable too.

 

GD

[Cynthia]

ouch

[Bucky92]

I was told years and years ago buy a Subaru Guru that younever never ever add any form of stp leak to a Subaru motor...causes alot more problems.Clogs things up that shouldnt be clogged. I agree with GeneralDisorder.. fix the problems right if you can't live with alittle ticking and marking of territory. And even them it doesnt guarentee that it will completely fix the problem...I just rebuilt my oil pump and resealed the motor on my EA82 back in Sept...well just Sunday while it was getting an exhaust issue looked at my friend tells me my right side cam seal is leaking both valve covers are leaking..the oil pan in leaking and now I have oil seapage from my one head gasket. And the ticking never went away BTW...but it does stop after about 10 minutes.

These cars will run almost forever with oil dripping and HLAs ticking.Think about the oil leaks this way........rust preventative. My mechanic friend (who has owned 34 Subarus and he is around 33 y/o)said the front half of my Loyale underneith is mint..no rust..now the very back where the oil didnt get flung is another story:lol: .

 

Flush that leak stopper out!!Before it does more damage then it benefits

[Bill90Loyale]

I agree with the remarks above. Bitter medicine, but good advice.

My own approach to ticks and leaks, which has worked effectively:

1. Replace the oil pump and o pump o ring

2. Replace the oil pan gasket

3. Replace the valve cover gaskets.

What this does is increase oil pressure to your hydraulic lash adjusters (which are the "tickers"), and stops the most common sources of leakage.

 

All of this stuff, like the buzzing shifter, can be put off indefinitely if you wish. It's all annoying, but won't do any long term harm. If you want to run a nice quiet clean operation, then this stuff is worth doing. The oil pump job is best left to the time you replace your timing belts (every 60k miles) because a lot of the hassle has to be done to access the belts.

[Subarian]

I agree with the previous posts to a point. Your seals are not going to get any better with any additive. Stop-leak additives tend to soften the seals, which can temporarily decrease leaking, but the softer seals will wear even faster. The only solution is to replace them.

 

As far as the lifters or hydraulic lash adjusters go, there are two causes for the ticking. One is low oil pressure. You can usually fix that by resealing the oil pump. The second cause is varnish on the lifters that causes them to stick. Thats where Marvel Mystery Oil (and similar cleaners) can be beneficial, by removing the varnish.

[Sonicfrog]

My oil pump gasket was the culprit behind my TOD. Of coarse a month after I replaced that I blew a head gasket. Must be Subies just can't handle the proper amount of oil pressure, which is Subaru built them to have the TOD (JK) .

[Roundeye]

I too must agree. There is no "mechanic in a bottle". I have seen MMO and others quiten noisy lifters (at least for a little while), but that is covering a symptom, not curing the problem.

 

Here is the link to the lifter rebuilders that GD mentioned: http://www.mizpahprecision.com/pricing.htm

[azsubaru]

Have to agree on the No Leak, but not about the lifter noise.

 

If it's varnish on the lifters that's causing the noise, MMO or Seafoam will often fix the problem. It's a darn cheap and effective thing to try before you change lifters. The TOD may come back eventually due to more varnish forming, but I don't feel thats the same as covering up a problem.

[Cynthia]

OK. Ok! Got it.

 

As I have spent $750 in the past 10 days on my Subaru, the $400 more needed to redo the cam seals (plus timing belts while in there) is something that I need to put off as money is needed for my son's summer college classes. Thus .... the No Leak, which evidently is a "newish" product that cost $7 and had a guarantee of $14 if it didn't work within 200 miles. So, I did it. And blew it, from what I read here. Live and learn.

 

The ticking? Repair shop said any fix of those lifters is best done by install of a rebuilt engine.

 

I just finished reading the words of the fellows at Car Talk, Klik and Klak, who report that Mystery Marvel is akin to chicken soup: people swear by it, but nobody has proven it can do anything, but it probably won't hurt anything either.

[GeneralDisorder]

Repair shop is dead wrong about the lifter tick. The lifters can be rebuilt for cheap, and replacement does not require the removal of the engine. Proper oil pressure, and rebuilt lifters will almost certainly rid you of the tick. If the engine is otherwise sound, lifter replacement is a lot less work, a lot cheaper, and less of a gamble than a replacement engine.

 

On the other hand - the ticking is more of an annoyance than anything. If you can ignore it the engine will not suffer.

 

GD

[azsubaru]

The General is right - the ticking won't hurt anything, and it doesn't mean you need another engine.

 

As an example, my Loyale ticked - loudly - for a couple years. It was so loud it was embarassing driving down the street sometimes. Much like you, I was told I needed an engine overhaul or replacement engine.

 

Then I found this forum and learned about MMO and Seafoam. I put a half can of Seafoam (I believe this is similar to MMO) in the oil, ran about 500 miles, then changed the oil with fresh 10W30. The ticking almost disappeared completely after a while. It's been maybe 40,000 miles now and the engine ticks a little from time to time, but that's about it.

[Cynthia]

OK, so I have to "firmly request" that the mechanic shop does lifter rebuild, hmmm? Anybody paid for this before and have a sense of the fee? If they refuse, are their shops that specialize in that type of work that woul be more amenable?

 

Wish my son was going to mechanic school and the university! Would be easier on this single income mom. But.... no matter....it all works out in the end, always.

 

Thank you for the advice.

[azsubaru]

No idea what it would cost to have it done. You need a mechanic who is familiar with Subarus, and that you can trust. Get a quote on cost to do it the same time as the cam seals. Maybe there's someone from your area here on the forum who could recommend a local mechanic or shop for you.

 

But first, try to fix it on the cheap - add MMO or Seafoam (again), run 500 miles, change the oil and filter, Drive a thousand miles and repeat. If that doesn't quieten it down, then you may want to go further. Use 10W30 Castrol GX oil and continue to change it every 3000 miles or so.