Options for more ponies on the ER27???

[skishop69]

Ok, I may or may not be bagging the turbo idea on my ER27 Brat, but I thought if I do, I need more pony producing options. Any ideas besides hotter spark, more fuel and high flow exhaust?

[ballitch]

i dont think anyone makes cams for the ER27 so your stopped there. if you dont have at least a 2.5'' or 2.25'' exhaust i would start there. but with a motor that big in a brat i would think gearing is more of a problem than power.

 

 

~Josh~

[mikeshoup]

You want to head over to xt6.net. There's more people there who have done performance mods to the ER27.

 

Starting simple:

Advancing the timing a few degrees will give you quite a bit more torque. I know KBD (kingbobdole) runs 30 degrees on his and it runs fine with Premium. I ran my XT6 up to 28 degrees and didn't play any further. It certainly helps.

 

2.25 inch exhaust seems to be good.

 

Custom intakes are nice. At least a cone filter.

 

And you can get custom cams ground. Plenty have done it.

[GeneralDisorder]

Those are all good sugestions. Pop the heads off and have a complete valve job done - three angle grind, port & polish the heads, mill 20 thou off em to up your comp a little.

 

I'm sure Delta cam will be able to assist with your cams - just send em in, and they can grind whatever you like. For big tires, you want a torque machine - so go low end. Heavy torque cam. I'm guessing there is a LOT to be gained here for the ER27 being that it was really built for a sports coupe, and had a light flywheel, and such.

 

Change to the "heavy" EA82 flywheel. Bolt pattern is the same. This will give you more rotating mass, and higher torque at lower RPM.

 

Can't "recurve" the disty since it's.... software. But you can do the fuel management and look into fuel maps for low end torque. That will also give you timing control. Seriously - you would rather LOSE some peak HP for more low end - it's going to get you farther off road. On road is going to be fine - 235's are not all that large for the HP the ER27 can put out - even detuned a bit at the peak.

 

Keep in mind that the "perfect" off road engine for a vehicle with the Brat's capabilities would really be a lightweight diesel - you want to try and approximate that model as much as possible. Think of the Hummer H1, and model your mods off it - just that will get you FAR (ex military myself). Realize that here you have a 6,000 lb+ truck (four wheel independant just like a soob) with an AUTOMATIC (yes, they only come as auto's), and only 160 peak HP from a non-turbo V8 diesel (armored ones are different). You want serious grunt, not 200 HP at 10,000 RPM. You'll never see a use for it.

 

I know it's not as "glamorous" as a turbo, but it's what will work - vs. being stuck and blowing your engine to bits. Remember that less is more off road. There's a reason people still drive willy's jeeps, old beater trucks, 60's rovers, samuri's and the like.... they are simple, rugged, and almost always will bring you back. Note how any of the previously mentioned if set up for off-road will do around 50 MPH on the freeway - teeth chattering, bone jarring ride it may be, but those are the ones that get the job done. It really does come down to weight and gearing. A lot of the old rovers made around 50 - 60 HP. They are stump pulling, tree climbing machines. Same for Suzuki's, and old willy's jeeps too.

 

GD

[jeffast]

be carful with timing i proved too much is bad news but mine was at like35+ almost maxed out

although you do get a ton more power with it set ahead a bit right

[skishop69]

I know all about fuel and spark maps. I do custom building and programming of GM EFI. If you're able to adjust the fuel map, does this mean someone has hacked the ECU? If so, where do you find the software? If not, how would you make ajustments without using a piggyback? I had already planned on porting the heads myself. I also know first hand about too much timing. Last fall we put a hole through the #4 piston on my small block trying to go too hot on the spark curve. I would definitely like more info on the soobie fuel maps.

[Turbone]

From what I understand, the ECU cannot be hacked. You might be able to piggyback it tho. Alot of people here are getting away from swaps like this because theres alot of fitage headaches. The better engine for a swap is the EJ's, it fits nicely into any year engine bay, is very dependable, has lots of available upgrades.

[GeneralDisorder]

Turbone's right - and a timing belt change isn't $300 in just parts

 

The ER27 has all the problems of the EA82 + 50% more because unlike the EA82, parts are not plentiful, often only availible from the dealer, and usually at a high price. For that you get the same stock performance as the JDM EJ20 N/A, and less performance than the EJ22T. Only slightly more than a USDM EJ22 N/A. Add to that the fitment issues with any chassis other than the original, and you have a pretty dim combination. It's a cool engine for sure, but like a lot of brands, it's a high end engine, and there just weren't many made.

 

As for hacking the ECU - sure it could be done. I'm a software engineer, and I know people that could do it. But the time investment is not worth it, and all the people I know would maybe assist me in doing it as a personal favor, but they would all much rather play with their PC friendly Audi's and Porsche's..... I'm the weird one of the bunch driving old soobs. Best to just go with something like MegaSquirt. I learned a long time ago that re-inventing the wheel gets you nowhere - while you do that, someone else is working on the jet engine....

 

GD

[northguy]

Has anyone messed with the performance chips available on e-bay and elsewhere?

[skishop69]

'Generic' performance chips are basically crap (IMHO). If they're not vehicle system specific all they do is trick the ECU/ECM into thinking its either cold outside or fake low coolant temp forcing it to stay in open loop. Either way you're just adding fuel without much (or no) change in timing control. The gain is negligable and doesn't out way the possible long term negative effects on plugs, valves, O2 sensors and cats (not to mention crappy mpg) If I'm going to lose mpg, I'm at least going to make a significant power gain. Just my two cents.

[skishop69]

AHHHH!!! Too many Subiglyphics! EJ22??? Once you get out of EA and ER, I'm lost. Ask me a Chevy question, no prob. Ask me Subaru question, mostly you get dumb deer in the headlites. I've already got the ER27 so that's what I'll go with. I know GM ECMs (pre OBD2)are not happy when you start messing with cams. How much will the Sub ECU compensate for changes?

[idosubaru]

might help to give an idea of what you're looking for - how much work you want to do, custom or bolt on, how much power you're looking for...etc.

 

you're not really going to make an XT6 'fast' so i wouldn't consider it a good candidate for making fast on a low budget.

 

a better muffler, intake, distributor timing will help some.

a good tune up and cleaning up any grounds, power, sensor connections can help just as much as some mods too. best to start here, get the car running well stock and then go from there.

[skishop69]

It's going in a Brat so we're not looking for go fast, but HP and torque. I'm also starting with a fresh build.

[Caboobaroo]

www.subarubrat.com He's got a ER27 in his Brat....