Ever Victorious Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 To you XT6 owners: Where on your temp gauge does your XT6 normally run at operating temperature? My 6 seems to be running hot, but the odd part is the radiator fan doesn't even kick on until the car is more than 3/4 of the way to hot... which is where the heat peaks out. It doesn't fully overheat, but it does look like it runs HOT... is this normal? If not, what's the fix? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 nope not normal. does it do it all the time, even at highway speeds? you need to fix this now or your headgaskets will be mean to you. i've owned about 15 and the gauge rides about 1/3 of the way up at most. definitely not halfway, up to halfway and something isn't right. if it stays cool at highspeed but not at idle it's probably just the fan not turning on. if the fan never comes on, sounds like you found your problem. check the sensor for the fan (the one that is screwed into the bottom of the radiator on the passengers side tank) and the relay....i forget which relay it is though. the radiators on these jokers are OLD, has yours ever been replaced? most of them i get are questionable at best. they need replacing and most people don't because there are no aftermarket sources for a direct fit radiator and dealers want $400-$600 for one. (you can get them for $300 online sometimes). more details would help...mileage, condition, anything replaced, overheats all the time no matter what.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75subie Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 if you need a quick fix, just wire your fan so it comes on when you turn the key..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 What Gary said. You might consider changing the thermostat also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted June 26, 2006 Author Share Posted June 26, 2006 if you need a quick fix, just wire your fan so it comes on when you turn the key..... Freebie was wired like that, and it became a problem, so you'll understand if I pass on that suggestion. nope not normal. does it do it all the time, even at highway speeds? you need to fix this now or your headgaskets will be mean to you. i've owned about 15 and the gauge rides about 1/3 of the way up at most. definitely not halfway, up to halfway and something isn't right. if it stays cool at highspeed but not at idle it's probably just the fan not turning on. if the fan never comes on, sounds like you found your problem. check the sensor for the fan (the one that is screwed into the bottom of the radiator on the passengers side tank) and the relay....i forget which relay it is though. the radiators on these jokers are OLD, has yours ever been replaced? most of them i get are questionable at best. they need replacing and most people don't because there are no aftermarket sources for a direct fit radiator and dealers want $400-$600 for one. (you can get them for $300 online sometimes). more details would help...mileage, condition, anything replaced, overheats all the time no matter what.... I don't know if it does this at highway speeds. I have only tested this in the confines of my garage (I still don't have the front struts on, I haven't had time). So this has technically happened only once, but it's not exactly something I want to "test" a lot, i'd rather get it fixed if you know what I mean. I don't know if the radiator has been replaced. Car has 115k miles on it and other than the toasted air suspension and a dead cybrid pump, it's in REALLY good condition. The fan DOES come on, but not until it's 3/4 of the way to hot. Which I find very bizarre. Is that still the same sensor? Or would that be a water temp sensor or something like that? Edit: Also, know a good way to remove the t-stat housing bolts WITHOUT snapping them off in the water pipe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 it's the sensor in the radiator. water temperature sensor at the thermostat doesn't affect the fans. the one in the radiator does. two different sensors. seems like the fan should come on sooner. clogged radiator, i'd try flushing or cleaning it out first. or replace it. thermostat? after you start it, feel the hoses. if d/s gets faster quicker than p/s you may have a problem with the radiator. or water pump/thermostat. in my experience the radiator is usually the problem. i've never had a water pump, thermostat or temp sensor fail. they CAN, i'm just saying i've never had any of those fail but i've had about 6 bad radiators...if not more. missing fins, rotted out, leaking, cracked tanks, clogged up....lots of issues with the rads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted June 26, 2006 Author Share Posted June 26, 2006 it's the sensor in the radiator. water temperature sensor at the thermostat doesn't affect the fans. the one in the radiator does. two different sensors. seems like the fan should come on sooner. clogged radiator, i'd try flushing or cleaning it out first. or replace it. thermostat? after you start it, feel the hoses. if d/s gets faster quicker than p/s you may have a problem with the radiator. or water pump/thermostat. in my experience the radiator is usually the problem. i've never had a water pump, thermostat or temp sensor fail. they CAN, i'm just saying i've never had any of those fail but i've had about 6 bad radiators...if not more. missing fins, rotted out, leaking, cracked tanks, clogged up....lots of issues with the rads. OK... so is it an XT-6 only radiator, or are there other fitments that work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 XT6 only. some places list that they carry an aftermarket, they are ALL WRONG, don't bother asking if it's really for an XT6, im' telling you they are not. because none were ever made. they will be for a 4 cyliner EA82 XT. they can work but the mounts don't line up, the fan holes don't line up and the inlet/outlets are smaller than the XT6 and the radiator is much smaller. they are adaptable, those arne't problems that are hard to over come. some people have used them....they are probably better than what's on there if it's old!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted June 26, 2006 Author Share Posted June 26, 2006 Alright... here's hoping it just needs a flush... By the way, does anyone know what the capacity of the cybrid steering pump's reservoir is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted June 27, 2006 Author Share Posted June 27, 2006 grossgary... I have a question about the diagnostic method of feeling how the hoses heat up. I fired up the 6 and started monitoring the hose temperature. The d/s hose was pretty warm by the time the temp gauge got to the lower tick of the C spectrum on the temp gauge, and got a bit hotter (hot enough that touching it was uncomfortable, but not dangerous)... and the p/s hose didn't ever get as hot, even when the gauge went past 1/2 way to H. HOWEVER... I then went and replicated the experiment on my Kia, which has a perfectly functional cooling system. Its upper hose is equivalent to our p/s hose (it comes off the thermostat and goes to the radiator) and its lower hose is equivalent to our d/s hose. I turned the car on and monitored ITS rate of heat progression, and it did the exact same thing... except it never got over 1/2 to H because both of its fans kicked in at the appropriate time. Now, I didn't heat the 6 up to the point where the fan kicks in... but I noticed there are two fans on this model instead of one. Are they both supposed to kick in at the same time, or is one a failsafe that kicks in at a higher temperature? I remember autozone's site listing an "auxiliary radiator fan" but didn't pay much attention to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 The second fan is usually for the A/C system and it should turn on with the A/C. Have you checked to see if this heating problem may be due to exhaust gases getting into the coolant system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted June 27, 2006 Author Share Posted June 27, 2006 The second fan is usually for the A/C system and it should turn on with the A/C. Have you checked to see if this heating problem may be due to exhaust gases getting into the coolant system? And, to ask the stupid question... How does one check for that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 This might be a little tough, theres not much room. After the car reaches op temp, reach down and feel the bottom of the rad. If its cold the rad is plugged. Theres a possibility the sensor in the rad is also bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 And, to ask the stupid question... How does one check for that? One clue is seeing bubbles in the coolant reservoir. You can also have the radiator coolant sniffed for gases in it or have a block check done to test for gases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted July 24, 2006 Author Share Posted July 24, 2006 Next stupid question: The radiator fan temp sensor, single-speed or multi-speed? As in, does it turn then fan on when it reaches a certain point and then keep running the fan at a constant speed until the car cools down, or does it turn the fan on at a certain point, and then if the temperature keeps rising, increase the speed of the fan at a higher temperature to cool the car off faster? (Getting very close to being able to take the car to Smart Service... but I need to know before I take it whether the cooling system is something I can fix, or if I'm going to have to bite the big one and have him fix it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 fan is either on or off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingbobdole Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 things to note: there are 3 temps sensors in the XT6... one for the fan, one for the gauge and one for the ECU... isn't that neat? The main fan should come on at half and stay on till the temp drops... at 3/4 both fans come on... or just the smaller AC fan will run if you have the AC on. I say check the rad temp in the lower parts, then check the thermotime fan switch (on the rad) for corosion in the connector... Mine runs at about 1/4 or so unless I run the AC, then its about half.... BTW is your car an auto, if you have tranny issues that can make it run hot too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 things to note:there are 3 temps sensors in the XT6... one for the fan, one for the gauge and one for the ECU... isn't that neat? The main fan should come on at half and stay on till the temp drops... at 3/4 both fans come on... or just the smaller AC fan will run if you have the AC on. I say check the rad temp in the lower parts, then check the thermotime fan switch (on the rad) for corosion in the connector... Mine runs at about 1/4 or so unless I run the AC, then its about half.... BTW is your car an auto, if you have tranny issues that can make it run hot too. I wouldn't have bought it if it were an auto. I've got the sneaking suspicion that I've got a shot radiator now... I'll go fire it up after dinner tonight to check temp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 OK... you guys said run it at operating temp and then check the bottom of the radiator... well, I ran it up to 1/2 to H (what was operating temp on my last XT), and then felt the radiator in several places. I felt it down near the bottom on both sides of the radiator (the tanks?) and also on the fins, then I also touched the top of the fins. The radiator is STONE COLD everywhere I touch it! I take it that's not a good sign? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 No, if there was a difference in temp between the top and bottom, then there would be a problem. It almost sounds like a sticking t-stat. Not sure if you said you replaced it or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 No, if there was a difference in temp between the top and bottom, then there would be a problem. It almost sounds like a sticking t-stat. Not sure if you said you replaced it or not? Haven't, yet... I had asked for advice about removing the t-stat housing bolts without breaking the bolts off in the water pipe... the one and only time I replaced an XT thermostat, I ruined the water pipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 When was the last time the cooling sytem was flushed and serviced. the car is old enough for a clooged or corrded raditaor. Your going to have to remove the radiator and inspect the cooling fins (if you have any left). I had an older soobie do this too. It passed the cloged radiator tests, but when i took it out there no cooling fins left. Simple flow test, disconnect the bottom hose. Put a garden hose on top and let it run at a moderate rate. The amount of water going in should equal the amount of water going out. A water pump pushes out more water then a garden hose so you will not over test. If the water starts backing up, you have a clog comeplace. Another method using cold hose water, is to feel the radiator, It should be equally cold all over. i have a feeling that the fins are all gone, you cant see this from the engine side. nipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever Victorious Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 Actually, part of what I felt during the heat test was the fins, in a couple places, and they felt intact. The radiator is cold all over even at full operating temp. I take it that in a normally operating cooling system, the water stays in the engine/coolant reservoir until warm, then the t-stat opens up and sends water to the radiator for cooling? If that's the case, then yeah, it sound like the bad t-stat because the coolant hose coming off of the housing is also stone cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 sounds like a thermostat, but about the fins, on my Gl the engine side looked fine, but the grill side (covered by the condenscer) was all eroded. do a subaru t stat and a generic radiator cap. nipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingbobdole Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Haven't, yet... I had asked for advice about removing the t-stat housing bolts without breaking the bolts off in the water pipe... the one and only time I replaced an XT thermostat, I ruined the water pipe. sounds like a tstat... how to remove them if your a bit uneasy... LOTS AND LOTS of PB Blaster FTW! soak it on, let it chill, bolts will come free... I usually dont have problems tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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