testy Posted July 15, 2006 Share Posted July 15, 2006 So I went and bought a cheap angle grinder and just gave'r. Better throttle, and the sound is absolutely amazing. Sounds like theres is WAY WAY more under the hood. The filter sits on the ridges i left. You cant even tell its cut out when all assembled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebz Posted July 16, 2006 Share Posted July 16, 2006 Looks just like my old one. Now put some sort of shield around it and make the hole in the fender bigger so you can get some cooler air in there. (PS Turbone made mine for me about 3 years ago ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted July 16, 2006 Share Posted July 16, 2006 Was it that long ago? 3 of my cars have the box cut out, some day I'll put cone filters on them:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leon Posted July 16, 2006 Share Posted July 16, 2006 i have my box removed altogether and have a 4.5 inch k&N jammed in there (barely fits) - there is a nice rushing of air sound on throttle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted July 16, 2006 Share Posted July 16, 2006 About 3 years ago in school i had the EA-81 intake on a flow bench, found that the difference between full stock, and no filter, or bottom of the housing, the difference in flow at max lift was somewhere around 2-3 CFM. Will you get more sound, sure, will you get more power, thats a negatory ghost rider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testy Posted July 16, 2006 Author Share Posted July 16, 2006 i would disagree. The air was being sucked from a 1 wide tube. Ram air kits for cars increase power, why wouldnt that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testy Posted July 16, 2006 Author Share Posted July 16, 2006 http://www.overboost.com/story.asp?id=563 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom63050 Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 About 3 years ago in school i had the EA-81 intake on a flow bench, found that the difference between full stock, and no filter, or bottom of the housing, the difference in flow at max lift was somewhere around 2-3 CFM. Will you get more sound, sure, will you get more power, thats a negatory ghost rider. It depends on the degree of airflow you are testing. My Loyale with stock airbox was starved for air above 4000 RPM. The airbox intake is ridiculously restrictive--compare its little oval cross-section to the larger round cross-section on the other end of the airbox cover, above the filter. After drilling a couple dozen holes on the bottom of the airbox, the motor easily went to redline. So below 4K RPM, yes you're right, but at higher RPMs there is noticeable difference. Wouldn't hurt to put in a K&N filter too; probable 2-3 horsepower gain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Doing that will make any car louder, because the snorkus in the fender is designed to keep it quieter. Doing that to a TURBO car will get you a speeding ticket Doing it to a non-turbo car will have a negligible effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Doing that will make any car louder, because the snorkus in the fender is designed to keep it quieter. Doing that to a TURBO car will get you a speeding ticket Doing it to a non-turbo car will have a negligible effect. Hmmm, aint got one yet:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeshoup Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Doing that will make any car louder, because the snorkus in the fender is designed to keep it quieter. Doing that to a TURBO car will get you a speeding ticket Doing it to a non-turbo car will have a negligible effect. No speeding ticket (yet) and I have a TURBO car with cone air filter Just have to know how to spot the cops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 K&N will get you no power increase, i've flowed them too, doesn't even change the CFM, the intake manifold is so restrictive on its own, a different filter won't make a difference. The manifold and nesessary bits with a valve lift of .45, which is more than stock lift, will not flow much more than 200 CFM, making your car louder and mashing the accelerator more will not add power to these cars, regardless of where you are in the RPM range. It seems to me a lot of the power increases that people feel are "hindsight power" they don't want to be the only one that didn't get gobs of power off of a simple tweak, so they perpetuate the myth of free power so they don't look like the idiot. BTW, we replace about 5 turbos a week, and you guessed it, they all run K&N's, they don't filter for crap and blow out turbos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom63050 Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 K&N will get you no power increase, i've flowed them too, doesn't even change the CFM, the intake manifold is so restrictive on its own, a different filter won't make a difference. The stock airbox intake is certainly the major culprit, which is why the airbox needs to be opened up. While I don't have a dyno or flowmeter, I did the airbox mod with an impartial mindset. The motor most definitely breathed significantly better after drilling a bunch of holes in the bottom of the airbox. As I'm sure you know, many cars have too-restrictive airboxes to keep noise down, to the detriment of performance. As for the K&N, there may be a further flow improvement with the airbox already opened up, but honestly I'm not sure. An interesting set of tests would be: 1. with the stock airbox, with new paper filter, all the way through the intake manifold 2. same as above, but with modified airbox 3. same as above, with K&N filter added. Any chance you could do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 he probably meant versus a K&N cone filter, which would mean removing the airbox entirely. His point is, in reality, the ENTIRE REST of the air intake is too small to take advantage of much more (naturally aspirated) airflow. He has tested the entire intake on the bench, with both stock airbox/filter bolted on, and a K&N (which as i said, i imagine was a cone filter) and found no appreciable difference. to get power by increasing airflow into your intake, you need forced induction... IE super/turbocharging. it really is something of a myth... that "ram air" and high-flow air filtration REALLY amkes that much of a difference. it sounds different, and it might alter the hp/torque curves a bit, but increasing, not much. Of course, each vehicle is different, and you never know where they engineered economy into things, so the worst it can be is a waste of time. All this being said, im opening up my airbox and getting a K&N filter for it.. i just found out the soob and my 75 datsun 280Z (bosch l-jetronic fuel injected) use the same size filter so take it as you will. if you want to go the next step, port match your intake to your cylinder heads, and widen them out a little. Keep in mind that Turbulence is the enemy, and make every air channel as smooth and unobstructive as possible.. the straighter the air is flowing into the combustion chamber, the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom63050 Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 he probably meant versus a K&N cone filter, which would mean removing the airbox entirely. His point is, in reality, the ENTIRE REST of the air intake is too small to take advantage of much more (naturally aspirated) airflow. He has tested the entire intake on the bench, with both stock airbox/filter bolted on, and a K&N (which as i said, i imagine was a cone filter) and found no appreciable difference. to get power by increasing airflow into your intake, you need forced induction... IE super/turbocharging. I agree. The only thing we can easily and cheaply do is get more air into the airbox somehow, or toss the airbox and install a cone filter. To me the cone is overkill without modifications to the rest of the intake--either larger holes, or forced induction. The best you can do with the stock airbox is to equal or slightly exceed the total diameter of the holes bringing air into the box, compared to air exiting the box toward the motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgd73 Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 nice mod! I did similar with intention to keep air climbing in from outside. How does your engine temp do? is it a bit warmer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 An interesting set of tests would be: 1. with the stock airbox, with new paper filter, all the way through the intake manifold 2. same as above, but with modified airbox 3. same as above, with K&N filter added. Any chance you could do this? Thats exactly what i did, and the total cfm difference was 2, sorry to but the intake manifold has about a 1 inch diameter, so no matter how big you get your intake before the carb/TB, you just aren't gonna over come the restriction that is inherent in the intake manifold and heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azsubaru Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 So I tried this to see for myself (easy to switch back if I don't like it). And here's what I experienced. More bottom end torque and a better throttle response from just about any speed. Feels like it's going to take off really fast. But, after that, it's pretty much the same, except for the sound. It's disappointing how slow it picks up speed after that nice inital kick. It actually feels even slower than it used to be, but I think that's because the sound and the feel of the torque makes me expect something better. So I would have to agree with those who say it's mostly an illusion. However, it probably helps as part of a bigger intake/exhaust mod project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 ... so the worst it can be is a waste of time. All this being said, im opening up my airbox and getting a K&N filter for it... Assuming this statement included using a "free-flow" filter (e.g. K&N), wasted time is NOT the worst that can happen. Having your engine internals damaged by ingested fine particles is a likely event. Nothing (commonly available) on the market filters as well as a pleated treated paper filter element. You want better airflow? Get a larger surface area of pleated treated paper. At the risk of (yet again) beating a dead horse: There is a lot of talk about more power of this improvement or that, but it for the most part is just talk. It is from people who want to believe that what they have done has made a difference; this is human nature, and it is OK. The human mind is easily tricked; noise, vibration, and jerky running can seem like power, seem like movement and acceleration, and this is what amusement-park ride developers use to get you to believe that the room you are sitting in is really a spaceship. Power is measurable. Dynos and flowbenchs are good ways to measure, but not everyone has one. But (almost) everyone has a straight stretch of road or a nice hill. Time your car to a certain speed or distance (or multiple benchmarks), make your mods and repeat. "...full of sound and fury; signifying nothing.” (From MacBeth by W. Shakespeare) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
operose Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 "...full of sound and fury; signifying nothing.” (From MacBeth by W. Shakespeare) yaaaaaaaaaaa shakespeare! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testy Posted July 20, 2006 Author Share Posted July 20, 2006 nice mod! I did similar with intention to keep air climbing in from outside. How does your engine temp do? is it a bit warmer? Dont notice any temp increase, and done quite a bit of highway driving too. So what you guys say makes me feel stupid haha, just wondering if its that easy to mod the intake now..... OH well, the sound is well worth the 15 minutes it took to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 ...So what you guys say makes me feel stupid haha, just wondering if its that easy to mod the intake now..... OH well, the sound is well worth the 15 minutes it took to do this. No reason to feel stupid. You did something that cost you nothing, did not take much time, and you enjoy the sound. Sounds like success to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgd73 Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 Thats exactly what i did, and the total cfm difference was 2, sorry to but the intake manifold has about a 1 inch diameter, so no matter how big you get your intake before the carb/TB, you just aren't gonna over come the restriction that is inherent in the intake manifold and heads. you can challenge the restriction, by ensuring cool air while keeping fuel atomization. Density of air is a sensitive yo-yo. To to keep it steady would actually require a tight intake *and* ensuring very cool air.Intake too big is volume too slow and accepts the engine heat. Tighten it up and engine has no choice but to swallow it down. I actually like the little intake. Very "torquey" once conquered.Unless you run at high rpms at all times, little intakes are very smart if tuned proper. All I did was drill a 2inch hole to outside of fender. The only other prob is the heat from the hotwire maf, and it won't run without it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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