Loyale Turbo Nightmare Story

[Pooparu]

I just wanted to get this off of my chest. 2 months ago I purchased a 1990 AWD Loyale Turbo with an automatic transmission and it had 90,000 miles showing. I made this purchase off of craigs list for $280.00. The man I bought it from said it was a tweeker mobile and he wasn’t kidding. The only problems he said it had was a bad water pump and a leaky oil pump. The thermostat assembly was pulled apart and there wasn’t any water in the engine. He started it up just fine for about 30 seconds or so. I didn’t hear anything bad so I got it. I figured I would go ahead and pull the motor and replace a few parts and re-seal the motor. I found the stupidest stuff, only one bolt on the turbo, no gasket on the oil pan, an external transmission cooler zip tied to the air conditioning condenser, no electrical fan, only three blades on the clutch fan, timing belt covers broken all up, a ball point pen tube holing the transmission line splices together, random nuts and bolts hidden all over the motor, and a bungee cord holding the battery in. These are just the things I could think of off of top of my head. My wife told me that if she was going to drive it that it had better be reliable. So went through everything I could.

 

Now part two of my Loyale Tweekermobile. I ordered tons of parts and started working on the motor. As I got the first head off I noticed a split between the valves (cracked heads on both sides). I quickly posted a thread on this site. I got a quick response from XSNNRG. He said that he would bring the heads down with him from Olympia to PIR for the Oregon Rally Group races. So I had to talk my wife in to going down there to look for him on our anniversary (not easy). I wandered around for about 5 – 10 minuets before finding him. He’s was a really nice guy, but he for got the heads at home, and so I had to go up after work three day’s later and didn’t get home until midnight. So the next weekend I put the heads on and start to seal up the motor, but apparently the head gasket kit I got didn’t come with a front crank seal so I couldn’t put the timing belt stuff back on until I got that part. Also the timing belt covers I got from the dealership didn’t fit. So I had to wait another week for them to get the right ones in. Now I got the parts and put it back together. I also decided to replace the front axles because one of them had a rip in the boot. The auto part store gave me the wrong size, went back and got the right size. I finally got that job done and wanted to change out the transmission fluid and filter. I ended up spilling fluid everywhere and made a big mess (wife not happy again). I put the filter in and the gasket on the pan then tried to put the pan on but there wasn’t enough clearance for that to happen. For some reason there was an extra lip on the filter the original one didn’t have. The auto part store said that was the only one they listed. So I went to another one. I took a week to get it, and it was a completely different one, so we ordered another one, and finally it was right. So I put it in and finished up that project. Now I stared to button up all the small stuff on the motor and again there was another gasket missing from the gasket set so I had to go to the dealership and wait a week. Now to finish the motor all I have to do is put the exhaust back on, but oh wait just as I get everything in place and start to tighten up the bolts the F-ing things fall right out on one side. The threads on the heads are completely gone. Now I have to go get a re-thread kit and put some over sized bolt in. So now I’m done with the motor and ready to install it. I put the motor in and bolt it up and attach hoses and wires back up. I’m just about ready to fire it up, but I have to put the radiator in before I put the rest of the stuff back on the front of the motor. Now the radiator didn’t fit, the pegs were too far apart by an inch or two. I take it back and the same story, that’s the only part they list for my car. So on to the other parts store. They had to order it and after going back four times they finally got it in and gave me a huge discount on it for the trouble (all right finally something going my way). Wrong, now this radiator did fit great, but now the fan switch didn’t fit in the radiator. Arrrrrg, I take the fan switch back and again it’s the only part listed for the car. So on to the other store, they get it in the next day, and the night before I installed the radiator so I could get the front of the motor put back together, but the alternator belt didn’t fit so I took it back and they gave me another one that didn’t fit, then finally I got the right belt and the wrong fan switch again. I got the front of the motor done and now I waiting for the fan switch. It should be here Tuesday, but the auto part guy said I should just hook up some hokie red neck setup that I would have to drill and putty in to place on the radiator. So that’s where I’m on the car now.

 

Is there any reason I’ve had so many problems getting the right parts for this car? I mean I’ve been to four auto part stores and one dealership, and I’ve got wrong parts from all of them. I know that the car has the correct motor in it and that everything was for the most part original to the car. I hate this car so much, but I’ve too much invested to just blow up the car now. It’s so close now and I can’t stand it anymore. If anyone can help me with some information on what I can do to get the right parts for this car please do.

 

Thank you for reading my rant, pooparu

[Turbone]

For $250, I think you did all right:cool:

What I should say is, a better inspection might have saved you $250.

Now for the parts. Most auto parts store dont have the correct books to get the right parts for Subaru's. If they do have them, the counter person doesnt know how to read them:rolleyes: The dealer should know what parts fit on the car, if they dont, they need a new parts guy. Or find another dealership.

When you get into the engine like you did, take a inventory of everything you think needs replaced. Its better to have it all ready to go rather than running all over town trying to find the right parts. Hope it runs all right when you get it together.

[NorthWet]

I agree with Turbone about parts stores. Most of the computerized systems confuse EA81 and EA82 parts. Usually by 1990 MY they are straight, but nothing surprises me anymore. (Wait until you try to get tuneup parts!!! ). I am lucky in that most of the parts stores around here has at least one ex-/current Subaru owner, or at least have dealt with enough Subaru to know that they have to think a little.

 

Headgaskets sets do not come with crank seals. That would be a separate seal (commonly available here), part of a full gasket set, or part of a "conversion" ("head"-to-"full") gasket set. The tranny issues are probably because you have 4-speed automatic, and they are uncommon enough that most computerized systems (and parts books) do not list them. Changing the tranny "filter" in a Subaru (pre-spin-on filter) is a pointless frustration and waste of money, as it is just a screen.

 

And just to add a little salt to your wounds, cracks between the valves on a Subaru are common and usually mostly cosmetic. Your worry is more with cracks in the exhaust port divider.

[Pooparu]

I pulled the valves and the cracks went all the way though. It wasn't pretty.

 

 

 

 

I agree with Turbone about parts stores. Most of the computerized systems confuse EA81 and EA82 parts. Usually by 1990 MY they are straight, but nothing surprises me anymore. (Wait until you try to get tuneup parts!!! ). I am lucky in that most of the parts stores around here has at least one ex-/current Subaru owner, or at least have dealt with enough Subaru to know that they have to think a little.

 

Headgaskets sets do not come with crank seals. That would be a separate seal (commonly available here), part of a full gasket set, or part of a "conversion" ("head"-to-"full") gasket set. The tranny issues are probably because you have 4-speed automatic, and they are uncommon enough that most computerized systems (and parts books) do not list them. Changing the tranny "filter" in a Subaru (pre-spin-on filter) is a pointless frustration and waste of money, as it is just a screen.

 

And just to add a little salt to your wounds, cracks between the valves on a Subaru are common and usually mostly cosmetic. Your worry is more with cracks in the exhaust port divider.

[NorthWet]

I pulled the valves and the cracks went all the way though. It wasn't pretty.

Bummer. I have seen one head that was as bad as yours sounds, and the valve seats were tilted at an odd angle...

 

Forgot to mention that one reason for alternator or A/C belts being wrong is that Subaru used two different configurations for alternator and A/C. One has the alternator mounted outboard of the compressor, the other has the alternator mounted inboard of the compressor.

[kingbobdole]

Belts are a fun mess.. but like everyone else said parts stores suck... try getting a dizzy cap from a checker/shucks they give you one, but its just not right... at all. Heres a hint for you though.. stop saying loyale! just ell them you have a 89 GL-10 turbo wagon. you say loyale and they are rare enough that the parts store may not have them listed... its like the Rx... try getting a part from Napa for an Rx... and no, I dont need new apex seals!

[daeron]

great googelly moogelly, what a friggin mess! i like people like you. i find people who tell me stories like you, and become their friends. I am people like you. what you just described has quite simply turned all the motivation to work on my car that i have gained from this site in the last four months, into thin air!! i WAS contemplating swapping out my auto for a 5spd, becuase it sounds and seems simple!! but now im thinking, no, maybe these cars ARENT immune to the chaos-storm that always seems to accompany any mechanical job i do... IE, replace brake rotors etc, and suddenly after bleeding everything, the car wont run.. that was my datsun 280Z, and it was a fualty FI component connection (i forget which part, but still.. didnt touch it, never had a problem before, and bam, stops running when i change the brakes.) my little brother blew the motor in his 300ZX up one time by replacing his front brake pads.. changed em, test drove, parked the car back at the shop for a moment, and it started knocking.. they hit the gas a little, to see the reaction.. and it reacted from going thunk-tunk-tunk to WHOP WHOP WHOP POW!!!!!! no more motor. weve got these cute little irish gremlins on our backs called leprechauns.... the bloody ironic thing is, most people think theyre GOOD luck.. its good luck to SEE a leprechaun, because that means he isnt perched on your back, gnawing into your neck where it meets the shoulder......

 

keep truckin man, youve got the car thats worth it (turbo 5spd awd)

 

when youre done, it will be worthy (and not so unjustifiable) to spend a bit on getting a wee intercooler up there to boost you that much more, too. BTW, anyone care to swag on the HP of a more or less stock EA82T with an intercooler added? i know i read stock HP was like 119.. would an IC get you to 140 range? how high can you get an ea82t with a stock engine, adding only bolt-on parts? like, simple, down to earth stuff.. no bigger injectors.. im tlaking things like a hotter coil pack, etc.. is there really all that much "simple bolt-on" upgrades for a turbo motor like it?? because im not talking about a redesign so much as an optimization.. and i ask for future reference, as a conceptual ceiling for power on a vehicle that would NOT be me primary project/go fast car, but would be a daily driver type thing... because i have a 280Z that (god help me, if my family ever gets the projects already at the shop taken care of....) WILL be my project baby soon... but im thinking about trying to pick up a turbo soob to replace my GL10 as the auxiliary vehicle when the GL finally falls into its component subsystems... and im wondering what the power ceiling is with upgrades of a low "giveadamn" factor.....

[idosubaru]

you are tough. what a piece.

[Turbone]

when youre done, it will be worthy (and not so unjustifiable) to spend a bit on getting a wee intercooler up there to boost you that much more, too. BTW, anyone care to swag on the HP of a more or less stock EA82T with an intercooler added? i know i read stock HP was like 119.. would an IC get you to 140 range? how high can you get an ea82t with a stock engine, adding only bolt-on parts? like, simple, down to earth stuff.. no bigger injectors.. im tlaking things like a hotter coil pack, etc.. is there really all that much "simple bolt-on" upgrades for a turbo motor like it?? because im not talking about a redesign so much as an optimization.. and i ask for future reference, as a conceptual ceiling for power on a vehicle that would NOT be me primary project/go fast car, but would be a daily driver type thing... because i have a 280Z that (god help me, if my family ever gets the projects already at the shop taken care of....) WILL be my project baby soon... but im thinking about trying to pick up a turbo soob to replace my GL10 as the auxiliary vehicle when the GL finally falls into its component subsystems... and im wondering what the power ceiling is with upgrades of a low "giveadamn" factor.....

 

The EA82T 5spd has 82hp, the AT has 111hp. Thats what the FSM says, I hope its a typo.

The reason you install a IC is for when you increase the boost. It helps keep the intake air cool. Your best bet for more HP for these engines is to do something with the intake (IC, cone filter, etc), put a larger exhaust on (3in), increase the size of the turbo (TD04). Then keep your fingers crossed. Some here are putting cams in and/or using a SPFI block for higher comp. Not advisable if a DD.

[Caboobaroo]

The EA82T 5spd has 82hp, the AT has 111hp. Thats what the FSM says, I hope its a typo.

The reason you install a IC is for when you increase the boost. It helps keep the intake air cool. Your best bet for more HP for these engines is to do something with the intake (IC, cone filter, etc), put a larger exhaust on (3in), increase the size of the turbo (TD04). Then keep your fingers crossed. Some here are putting cams in and/or using a SPFI block for higher comp. Not advisable if a DD.

 

Heh, we'll find out now won't we:D

 

Like kingbobdole said, ask for parts for a '89 GL-10 1.8 turbo. Granted, some places will have the turbo Loyale listed (Advance lists my '89 RX) but it will help save you many problems, especially that in '89, that was the only engine that could ever possibly come with a turbo so its makes it harder for them to screw up.

[mikeshoup]

Some here are putting cams in and/or using a SPFI block for higher comp. Not advisable if a DD.

My XT Turbo w/ SPFI block almost DD says otherwise

 

Only problem so far is it had a head gasket blow, but I attribute that to overheating and lack of retorquing OEM gaskets...

 

We'll see how it holds up in a year from now.

[Turbone]

Heh, we'll find out now won't we

My almost XT Turbo w/ SPFI block DD says otherwise. Only problem so far is it had a head gasket blow, but I attribute that to overheating and lack of retorquing OEM gaskets...

 

Exactly. Calebz also had this problem. If you get boost happy I guarentee your engine is not going to last. And dont try and tell me you will be conservative, it aint going to happen. You cant resist it:burnout:

[mikeshoup]

Exactly. Calebz also had this problem. If you get boost happy I guarentee your engine is not going to last. And dont try and tell me you will be conservative, it aint going to happen. You cant resist it:burnout:

I ain't ever gonna up the boost on it, its stupid to do so on a high comp motor.

 

And I don't think the head gaskets blowing was a result of the high comp. The car always had an overheating problem, and we don't think what's his name retorqued the oem head gaskets...

 

Anyways, like I said, now its got a brand new two row radiator (apparently it had only a one row), and its stopped overheating. So, *crosses fingers*

 

Btw, it doesn't ping or anything. Helps that I live at a high altitude, plus its gonna be intercooled soon.

[daeron]

no way.. i just opened up the FSM .pdf and it says the NA 2wd SPFI is 84 hp, the turbo MPFI across the board is 115, and the 4wd sedans, and all NA SPFI wagons are listed at 90 hp. in that partial 1990 loyale FSM that floats around, at least. so it was a read-o, i guess sometimes acrobat reader sucks, huh?

 

but.. was 140 hp all that much to ask given simple things like exhaust and intake? thats pretty much what i meant, maybe basic ignition stuff too.. like a hotter coil or something.

[bgd73]

no way.. i just opened up the FSM .pdf and it says the NA 2wd SPFI is 84 hp, the turbo MPFI across the board is 115, and the 4wd sedans, and all NA SPFI wagons are listed at 90 hp. in that partial 1990 loyale FSM that floats around, at least. so it was a read-o, i guess sometimes acrobat reader sucks, huh?

 

but.. was 140 hp all that much to ask given simple things like exhaust and intake? thats pretty much what i meant, maybe basic ignition stuff too.. like a hotter coil or something.

 

Subaru was way cautious and conservative. Gaining 20hp with simple stuff is easy. Pushing limits in any ea82 is revealed by heat.

[4WDFrenzy]

If you really want to gain some "pony power", it will cost you money. I think 140hp is feasible with the proper upgrades and precautions(cooling). EA82Ts have a big problemo with heat, so adding an intercooler and maybe a step colder themostat(180* as opposed to 195*). Also adding an electric cooling fan + an adjustable thermoswitch for the fan would increase the reliability factor of the motor. But simple things like flushing the cooling system will help too. And you might think about adding some kind of fuel enrichment, like an adjustable FPR or adding some Nissan 280ZX injectors. These mods will help keep combustion chamber temps down and keep pre-ignition(detonation) in check. But I think to get that 140hp, you will definately need a boost controller of some sort. I think with around 9psi of boost and proper fueling, you will be able to achieve that rating with no problem.

 

Patrick

[GeneralDisorder]

RAM performance has N/A EA81's pushing 140 HP built for aircraft - they bore out the heads and make them dual intake port heads.....

 

Being that the EA82 N/A MPFI already has dual port heads and larger valves it shouldn't be real difficult to change cam profiles, make custom intake and exhaust, and with some big carbs 140 should be easy.

 

Also - Subaru had all the parts availible in the 80's to turn out 175 HP on the EA82T for their race engines. Someone not long ago posted scans of the part numbers for the cams, turbo, downpipe and such. It can be done, and it can be done reliably, but it requires careful planning and implementation. I say start by getting in contact with Subaru and finding the specs for the race engines.

 

GD

[daeron]

hey, thanks for the great replys to my thread jack. I got a good summary to confirm my vague idea.. which is exactly all i need for now. I have about forty or fifty 280Z injectors, actually.. im gonna celan and flow test them all, because i have a 280Z that im rebuilding.. the soob is the daily driver, and we got like 8 intakes that i stripped..

 

I also have some NOS OEM radiators and mufflers, i believe for ea-81s but may be too early to be of much use.. c. 1980 i think was our guess, but that was before i joined the forum. ive only read up on soobs as long as ive been a member, and i havent actually seen these parts in a bit more than a year now, so my recollection is hazy and my knowledge when i saw them was scanty, to say the least. they looked too fat for my car.

 

but when i can mine into these parts and start auctioning them off to ppl here, then i will be doing so at a bargain.. im thinking 50 bucks for a brand new radiator should get some buyers.. but thats neither here nor there, im just babbling. thanks again.

[Pooparu]

Update to my story: I got every radiator fan switch that the auto part store had to offer and they were all the same size. So now I'm thinking that the radiator manufacturer put the wrong size plug in. I decided to do the footwork my self since the auto part store doesn’t care. I found the radiator manufacturer on line (Trans Pro) and called them yesterday. The operator put me in touch with the technical support, but they were out to lunch so I had to leave a message. Not surprised they didn't call back, I call them back to day and technical support was busy and so I had to leave another message. I'm sure I still will not get a call back. Is it that hard to get a radiator for this car; is it that exotic and rare? I think my last resort will be to go to the dealership and spend an arm and a leg, but I think in the long run it will save my sanity.:-\

[Pooparu]

Update #2: So I had a timing issue that I finally worked out thanks to the Subaru brotherhood here. I couldn't get the cam timing and the ignition timing jiving together, but after following some simple directions I just got it running today. It fired up first thing. I was so excided I almost pooped my self. So I went ahead and started to put all the little stuff back on. I discovered a small coolant leak coming from the passenger rear side of the motor torts the bottom. Also the power steering rack and pump leak, but the thing is running great. I figured I would head down to the exhaust shop and get a new cat and muffler put on a plug up the hole in the drivers side exhaust port off of the head. I went to pull the thing out and for some reason it feels like the brakes are sticking or something. I can get it moving but it pulsates and doesn't want to move very well. Now I have to put it back up and check all the brakes and see what the problem is. If anyone else has had this happen please give me a heads up on what it could be. Thanks and I'll update my progress as soon as there is some more.

[NorthWet]

...Is it that hard to get a radiator for this car; is it that exotic and rare?...

Well, yes. Most, if not all, radiator manufacturers no longer make a radiator for the XT series. (XT6s have been this way for a while.) If your old radiator was all metal (maybe even if it wasn't) you can have the old top and bottom straps (the steel brackets that hold the bottom pegs and the top mounting holes) and have them put on a similar GL/Loyale radiator. Same dimensions, just different mounting holes. I also responded to your other thread regarding the car not wanting to move.

[daeron]

might want to start a new thread with any new info or issues. that does sound like brakes are binding, make sure to check the handbrake cable.. but i havent had any problems with mine, so i cant really be of any help there.

[mikeshoup]

Well, yes. Most, if not all, radiator manufacturers no longer make a radiator for the XT series. (XT6s have been this way for a while.) If your old radiator was all metal (maybe even if it wasn't) you can have the old top and bottom straps (the steel brackets that hold the bottom pegs and the top mounting holes) and have them put on a similar GL/Loyale radiator. Same dimensions, just different mounting holes. I also responded to your other thread regarding the car not wanting to move.

Actually, XT radiators are pretty easy to come by. Aftermarket XT6 radiators though were NEVER mader. The hard ones to come by for the XT are dual core. I've only seen one brand sell those. Most if not all major parts chains can get you a single core XT radiator.

[NorthWet]

Have you checked for an XT radiator recently? I did about 2 months ago, and Modine and the other major manufacturers have discontinued them. Modine and the majors have also discontinued the 2-row cores for GL/Loyale Turbos, though it sounds like RadiatorBarn still can get them.

[Pooparu]

I last radiator did fit, but I guess that there were 2 holes for the thermo switch and I just happen to find the larger one first. I think the brand was radcor.:-\

 

 

Have you checked for an XT radiator recently? I did about 2 months ago, and Modine and the other major manufacturers have discontinued them. Modine and the majors have also discontinued the 2-row cores for GL/Loyale Turbos, though it sounds like RadiatorBarn still can get them.