Changing Timing Belt

[jmickelct]

Thanks AVK,

 

So you think that if I just keep cranking that both the sprocket marks *and* the TB marks will eventually line up? (and that there are multiple times that just the sprocket marks will line up?).

 

Got very lucky with the crank pulley, went out this a.m. and it basically fell out in my hands.... very happy....

 

Oh yeah... anyone know where the fly wheel "window" is on a 96' OBW 2.5 AT that I can stick a screwdriver in to lock the drive train down while putting the crank pulley back on? Saw the pics for the 2.2, but I cant seem to find anything like that on my unit.

 

Also, when I crank the engine over, I'm getting AT fluid from the small bottom hose I yanked from the transmission (drivers side). Can I just eat the fluid and top it up when I'm done? (versus I guess, trying to seal it off).

 

John

[jmickelct]

Hi Guys,

 

Got it buttoned up yesterday and the damn thing actually runs!!! (was pretty paniced after the cams spun on me...). A little squeal in the Vbelts but have that tighened up and I'm now officially back where I started! (that the one kind of thankless part of this kind of job, (especially since the belt I took out seemed as new as the one that went in, along with the plugs etc...), but one is not actually fixing something that is broke and making it better' rather just trying to keep things from going bad.

 

But all told, very happy that it runs smooth, seemed to have at least slowed down the multiple oil leaks, and (having replaced all but one of the idlers, the tensioner and all seals (after realizing that I put 3 of the cam seals in *backwards*!!!)), feel optimistic about driving it till the next belt-time.:-p

 

Thanks for all the help, especially Porcupine.

 

Cheers,

 

John

[BushmasterSI]

Find the flexplate access hole on the rear of engine. Remove dust cap, insert large screwdriver. This locks engine from rotating. Remove all bolts with old belt in place. This holds everything still. No expensive tool required.

 

rd

 

I haven't had a chance to look on my car yet, but could anyone shed a little more light on this? Where's the access hole? Is this access hole on 2.5 DOHC auto trans engines? Is the screwdriver going into the flywheel teeth?

 

Thanks,

I'll look on my car as soon as I get off work.

[johnceggleston]

I haven't had a chance to look on my car yet, but could anyone shed a little more light on this? Where's the access hole? Is this access hole on 2.5 DOHC auto trans engines? Is the screwdriver going into the flywheel teeth?

 

Thanks,

I'll look on my car as soon as I get off work.

 

if you don't have a haynes manual you will regret it.

 

top of engine, passenger side where the engine meets the trans. right next to the throttle body.

[rweddy]

if you don't have a haynes manual you will regret it.

 

top of engine, passenger side where the engine meets the trans. right next to the throttle body.

I would say if you have a hayes you will regret it, get a FSM or access to one on-line. Also PM me and I will send you a great end-wrench write up.

[BushmasterSI]

I would say if you have a hayes you will regret it, get a FSM or access to one on-line.

 

I agree. I tried Haynes with some of my past cars and wasn't too impressed so I tried Chilton's with my Loyale and wasn't impressed either. Both were lacking in diagnosis and in electronics. When I got my OBW I tried AutoZone's AllDataDIY online subscription service. It was ok, but it still lacked the diagnostic flowcharts and extensive electrical schematics. I just downloaded the FSM from SOA. It's what I've been looking for.

 

BWY, is this shown in the FSM? I spent a little time looking at the engine/trans/clutch sections and didn't see it. Do you know what section it's on in the FSM?

 

Thanks again!

[rweddy]

I agree. I tried Haynes with some of my past cars and wasn't too impressed so I tried Chilton's with my Loyale and wasn't impressed either. Both were lacking in diagnosis and in electronics. When I got my OBW I tried AutoZone's AllDataDIY online subscription service. It was ok, but it still lacked the diagnostic flowcharts and extensive electrical schematics. I just downloaded the FSM from SOA. It's what I've been looking for.

 

BWY, is this shown in the FSM? I spent a little time looking at the engine/trans/clutch sections and didn't see it. Do you know what section it's on in the FSM?

 

Thanks again!

Depending on the year and model they have a separate chapter or even book on the electrical relays and schematics.

[BushmasterSI]

Really? I haven't seen those. Anyhow, I'm happy with the FSM.

[Beyond Prime]

Well, I bought my first Subaru a month or so back (1995 Legacy) for my son to replace a car he totaled. He came back this weekend from college and said that the car overheated. So I replaced the thermostat thinking it was sticking. Well, that wasn't the problem, it still overheated and found coolant all over the ground the next morning. If figured it had to be the water pump. I didn't see your sight until this morning and used the Hanes book method of trying to get the crankshaft pulley off. They recommended using a chain wrench. What I found is the pulley must be a two piece because once I got the outside secure, I was able to turn the inside. I did get it off, but am now concerned. Is that suppose to be able to turn? The timing mark and the cotter key can't match now that it has turned. Thoughts?

[davebugs]

Please update your location with something useful.

 

You're gonna need a better tool than a chain wrench - and now you need a new harmonic balancer as well.

 

In addition to whatever you were originally needing to fix.

 

What engine, mileage, and know maintenance history?

 

Did you check the LITTLE hose coming off the water pump. Have you looked for the WP gasket leaking?

[Beyond Prime]

Yes, I realize now that the chain wrench wasn't the best idea. I guess I relied upon the Haynes book too much. I tried putting two bolts in the holes, but couldn't get enough leverage for it to work.

 

So my worst fears are correct? I need to replace the harmonic balancer?

 

It is a 1995, Legacy Wagon, with a 2.2 engine (none turbo).

 

I tried to see where it was coming from, but couldn't really find a location. As a part of replacing the thermostat, I replaced the hoses as a precaution, so it likely isn't that.

 

I checked the oil and nothing seemed to have gotten into the oil. Although, I guess I could still have a cracked head?

 

All things I will need to pursue more, if replacing the current things didn't work.

 

The car has about 130,000 miles on it and it looked like it was well maintained, as I got a whole folder of what was done with it. The timing belt had been replaced around 80,000, so I thought I would replace that along with the water pump (that should address a possible gasket leak). I have everything back together to the point of putting the pulley back on. That is why I am writing. To see if it is toast because it has spun. I would think yes because the timing mark would be off, but just checking.

Edited September 21, 2009 by Beyond Prime

[davebugs]

o.k. let me try this again. Where is Edgerton? I have no clue - and I'm sure many others don't as well. How about a city/state large enough that actually means something?

 

Yes - you need a harmonic balancer.

 

Make sure the new thermostat is in the correct way (I believe OEM's can only go in one way).

 

Usually in my experience if the hoses were o.k. and the car wasn't bottomed out and broke the plastic neck then it's the gasket that leaks. Hardly ever the pump itself.

 

You'll need a harmonic balancer for sure. After someone can actually tell where you live they may offer a used one that would be much less expensive than a new one.

 

You're gonna have to search around here to see the work around methods to get the crank bolt real tight if you don't have the correct tool.

 

The harmonic balancer doesn't have any timing marks on it - it just drives the accessory belts.

[Beyond Prime]

Well, thank you for the warm welcome. I put both my city and state (provided fields), but I guess only the city shows up. So I redid it and put the largest city by me with it's state in the same field. I hope this helps. Sorry, still learning the ways of this forum.

 

If there is no timing marks on the crankshaft pulley, then can it still be used? It isn't loose or anything. When I say it turned, it turned less than a quarter turn or so from the inside. My biggest concern was the timing mark being off to time it in the future. I guess it is better to be safe than sorry and just replace it.

[davebugs]

Welcome.

 

I do admire the fact that you found the search function and found this old thread before starting a new one.

 

It's just a pet peeve of mine when folks don't post where they are from.

 

There are members in your area who you may hear from now that may have a used Harmonic Balancer for instance. Or the tool to hold the balancer when tightening.

 

The "outer" piece of the harmonic runs the accessory belts. It'll also wear into the timing belt cover if allowed to wobble.

 

It still needs replaced. Just not quite as critical from the timing belt perspective. It alone won't ruin the engine (unless you don't get the bolt tight). But it could ruin the cover and/or not run the accessories properly. You know it's gotta totally fail soon. It still needs replaced.

[Olnick]

A warm welcome to you, Prime! Thanks for clarifying your location, it really can make a difference in the guidance and help offered. For instance, if I asked for help with studded snow tires someone could look at my location and offer appropriate information. (And might garner some fun answers!)

 

Re your harmonic balancer, replace it. If it turned, even less than a quarter turn, it's loose. Could last thousands of miles, could fail in 10! Don't take a chance.

 

Again, welcome aboard. Good luck and ask lots of questions.

[Beyond Prime]

Thank you for the help. I had heard good things about Subaru's, hence me buying one for my son to drive 4 hours one way with to college. Although that didn't work out so well this weekend. I think that is why I did a bit more shot gunning than I care for, as I was trying to get it taken care of so he could head back. Instead, my wife had to drive him up and drive back on Sunday so he could go to school and she could go to work.

 

From what I hear, this car should run for a while, so the extra parts that I put into it shouldn't be for nothing. With him up at school now, I have some extra time to look for a replacement harmonizer and make sure everything is 100% before taking it back up to him. So I might be back up here sooner than later, depending on how all that testing goes.

 

Thanks again for all of your help and hope I haven't been too much of a pain.

[davebugs]

These cars last a long time if taken care of. I fix and resell them until they hit about 200k for still decent money. They frequently go 250-300k with some care and maintenance.

 

Perfect for College kids with the AWD, room for hauling stuff (in the wagons) and they can take a hitch for a U-haul.

 

Keep the tires matched. When doing the timing belt do all the seals and components, and you should be fine.

 

Only other pointer is use the regular old NGK V-groove green spark plugs - nothing exotic.

 

If you wonder what the oil leak leaking onto the Ypipe is it's called a baffle or oil seperator plate NOT the rear main. Still have to pull the engine or trans just to redo the RTV on it.

 

Excellent resource here. And you have an advantage in that you already use the search function (unlike a lit of Newbie's). And now folks know what area you're in.

[Beyond Prime]

Well, I finally had some more time to work on it. I got it all back together up to the point of the crankshaft pulley. I wanted to make sure that no other damage was done to the engine before I went the route of buying a replacement pulley. Everything ran just fine, it kept cool, and nothing in the engine oil. So now time to proceed with getting a pulley.

 

Using the peep hole between the transmission and engine worked well, but I couldn't find the torque specs for the pulley. As a temporary measure I used 100, but does anyone know what it is suppose to be?

 

Thanks for all your help.

[davebugs]

Someone here will have the specs. I do them as tight as I can get them - probably 170-180 lbs but in my opinion that takes a real tool and not just a screwdriver stuck into the flex plate while the engine is in the car.

 

I get nervous about tightening something that tight with a "make shift" solution but many here do it.

[EvilDead]

Subscribing so I can easily find this thread later. Some really good info here.