daeron Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 OKAY... i just had some difficulty with tie rod ends, but i got them on.. I thought I came to the conclusion that it was a minimal difference between part maunfacturers, see my other thread....http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=63126 but now with it all together, the camber is opposite what it should be.. the tops of the wheels are pointing inwards. is this a solid indication that ive gotten the wrong part? or did i do something wrong? i measured the location of the tie rods properly, from the top end of the thread down to the tie rod end (not the locknut) and its put back on there in the right place, but thats just for toe-in isnt it?? camber isnt supposed to be adjustable.... i cant imagine it was like this before i took off the tie rod ends, (ie the camber issue happened when i hit the curb, i was going like 15mph!) so something i did must have been wrong, or the part was wrong. if its the wrong part, then i guess thats simple enough.. cant drive the bloody car.... i drive pizzas, and my GM is screaming down my neck to get in the store tonight... when I am the only one who ever cleans his store worth diddly squat. i dont care how bad he wants me in, if this is caused by a wrong part, im not driving the car... or could i??? i dont know what to do, i NEED to get to work to make some money..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 Tie rods simply can't change your camber - they can change the toe setting, but that is all. The camber will look weird if you have had it jacked up and haven't driven it yet.... or if the wheel is turned the bottom of the tire will tuck inward. Should be pretty straight up and down with the wheel pointing straight ahead. But again - tie rods can't change your camber. In fact, nothing can on a stock subaru - it's not technically adjustable. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 dats what i thought!!!!! ive driven it, thats when i noticed it! ill go drive around a little more. thanks for the reinforcement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 HAHAHAHAHA ok, now, i drove it around a couple blocks before my last post, so please forgive me.. i thought i had driven it enough that it wasnt an abnormality from being jacked up.... but im working at home, no proper jack/jackstands.. so i took two scissor jacks, one on either side, and blocked the engine crossmember with a cinderblock that had a piece of 2x10 on top of it. most of the weight was on the cinderblock, but both jacks were supporting too. I put the drivers wheel back on, because it had a new used tire on it... but the passengers side, i wanted to rotate the tire.. so i jacked both jacks up, pulled the cinderblock, replaced driver front tire, and then pulled that jack to the back ad pulled the rear passenger off, to swap with front passenger.. so two jacks on one side now.. then lowered it. even after driving, it didnt re adjust. i jacked each corner of the car up, and set it back down, and we were kosher on the camber. now i just have to cope with the fact that my new tie rod ends are rubbing the inner rim of the wheel which can only mean they arent seated deeply enough, which means i need to get different ones.... WTF should i do?? one side has a big lugnut from my datsun tightened down to hell because i buggered the castle nut on that side... and the other just has the castle nut on it, as far as i dared.. i tightened that side down with a datsun lugnut first, to avoid stripping the castle nut.. but it only went so far, and there is just NO putting the pin in. is this car not safe to drive, even to get up to work? is it safe enough to drive pizzas around for a couple nights so i can get some cash and get the proper tie rod ends?! is it as safe as those nuts hold, and i should check them as often as possible? nightly, hourly? im trying to skate the edge here, and i am totally clueless how far i can go. one thing i am very proud of about myself is i know when i dont know enough to continue.. thats why i ramble so much on this forum. thanks for indulging me GD, this steeering stuff is NOT my forte yet... i havent done enough work on it. obviously though.. im learning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 HOLY GOD strike that.... i just went for another spin around the block, got back, wheels are tucked in at the top again... and im getting a grinding occasionally on one side from the tie rod end hitting the wheel. i cant drive this. i really dont think so. poor GM, he just might cry when he hears this.... but how do i get tie rod ends?? ESPECIALLY without any money!??! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgd73 Posted August 19, 2006 Share Posted August 19, 2006 tie rods too long equally from center of steeering rack can bring top of tires in because wheels are toed out and dragging forcing it to. From the sounds of it, somethin isn't right with the tie rods.can adjust them in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted August 19, 2006 Share Posted August 19, 2006 How do the new ones compare to the old ones? Did you have both off at the same time, and did you put them onto the proper side? Are they for a 2wd/4wd? They are for an EA82, right? Not for a hatch, brat, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 19, 2006 Author Share Posted August 19, 2006 they are the right part, on the correct sides, respectively. i took em off one at a time. read my other post if you havent please, its too much to re type. i am coming to the conclusion that its the right part, manufactured to poor spec, and needs replacing with a RIGHT right part (well, plural..) as it stands, one wheel knocks slightly when the wheel attitude is right (or wrong) dependent on the steering, accel/braking, and direction of travel.. sometimes quiet, sometimes not, but its not TOO bad.... neither stud is pinned. one has a flat sided lugnut holding it on, the other has the (brass?) castle nut that came with it on it. there is no room on the thread to pin them. im gonna give her a talk before i pull out of my neighborhood onto the main highway and explain that theres no way i can fix her without her driving some pizzas around for the next day or two.. i will check it frequently, i have all necessary tools in the trunk....along with the old tie rods and some spare nuts, if needs be.... also will try to bring it to my brother's (the mechanic) shop tomorrow and see what he thinks, if he can squeeze me in. heh, if you want to tell me in big capital letters NO DAERON DONT DRIVE YOUR CAR YOU WILL DIE, please feel free to call me on my cell. (561) 255-8212. I cant take a collect call, but i swear, i WILL appreciate the warning. thanks for the feedback, thus far and continuing.. especially about dialing in the tie rods. i couldnt fathom the geometry abstractly enough to figure that one out. Will try that tmw too. i know that IF im off, i am adjusted a hair too far OUT and not the other way. as i said, im learning alot about steering and suspension finally.. because its breaking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 19, 2006 Author Share Posted August 19, 2006 okay, update (if anyone cares) im obviously still alive and let me start by saying thanks again to everyone who helped me. When i get in a bind with a repair job and a deadline and things start going wrong, i go all to pieces. too easily sometimes. its the closest thing to understanding a "panic attack" that i think ive experienced. I miss the obvious sometimes. this time it wasnt so obvious, but my communication was poor; so kudos to those who waded thru it and helped me nonetheless. I got to work, in a well lit parking lot, after driving it 12 miles or so and thinking about it (fairly) calmly.. looked at it, the toe in was off at least as much as the "camber." I figured i had some time to kill and some tools (slow night, my GM was just being a royal jerk egging me to come in) so i picked it up and started tweaking... and immediately everything i had been told clicked in the way it had failed to thus far. it was really BGDs explanation of the tie rod function that i needed.. but my 32 yr old mechanic brother from whom i got the soob, wasnt returning my call.... friday night. i forgive him, hes gonna be the father of my parents' first grandchild in a few months. SO long story short, i tweaked, and got it MUCH better aligned. its still out of whack, but in a much less bad way. (its not "better" its "less bad") tomorrow in the daylight, i may go up to the shop and use a hydraulic jack (them are nice.. and safe, too..) to facilitate re adjusting it to get it even better.. but i think i can figure that out enough. The underlying problem is, the ball joint studs appear to be manufactured to a poor spec... theyre just a little too large to actually pull up far enough into the bearing housing. I have cross referenced the part number a total of five ways, using three different info sources, and confirmed that.. they look identical to the old ones, and the measurements are mighty close. between threads, old was 9 mm and new 11mm, at the top of the taper old was 12 mm and new 13, at the bottom of the taper old was 14 bottom 15, but i used crummy calipers and the last discrepancy was a *bit* less than a full mm. SO i want to eyeball align it as good as possible, and try to get some cash to go buy better ones from another store. fone calls tomorrow, figger everything out.. but in the meantime, there is a slight rub on the inside of one wheel against the outer edge (read: cast housing, not pressed in portion of socket) of the tie rod end.. maybe a better alignment will make this go away as well, but i dunno.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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