xoomer Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 I was told that when I bought my 91 Legacy LS, that it didn't pass emissions. I have already done spark plugs, Denso's (because I don't like napa I wont get ngk) and a bosch o2 sensor, because the old one was funkie looking, I cant find an EGR valve on this car and Autozone says not required?? nor can I find a pcv valve... does anyone have any Ideas on how to make this pass emisions? Z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 if you have the failure sheet, get it scaned in and we can try to decifer it and point you in the right direction, not passing could be a whole lot of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoomer Posted September 14, 2006 Author Share Posted September 14, 2006 unfortunatly I don't have one, I was just hoping there would be a suggestion of what I could do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brus brother Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Could be as simple as a faulty gas cap seal or... your windshield is missing! Ask previous owner if possible or go fail (maybe) for yourself and then deal with the identified issue otherwise you are just roaming around in the dark and maybe replacing perfectly good parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Randomly changing parts not only may not fix a problem, but if generic ones that don't quite match OEM specs are used that can sometimes cause difficulties that weren't there before. Previous to OBD-II (before '95 models), on-board diagnostics was limited. However, it's a possible starting point; any significant fault should light the CEL (is it lit?). There's good info here on pre-OBD-II models, including how to retrieve trouble codes: http://endwrench.com/images/pdfs/EWPreOBDAug05.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 get yourself a haynes manual for the car, but the #1 reason for failuire is a bad o2 sensor. Without a fubnctioning o2 sensor the rest of the pollution controls are just there for decoration. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Go to any emissions place and give them the License plate number and $5 and they'll print out the last emissions test that was done for you. If more than two years ago don't waste your time/money and take it to the emissions guru located next to the emissions place on 6th Ave. S; he'll check it for you and if it's okay he usually doesn't charge anything; if it's not, he charges $40 plus tax to get it passed. If he can't get it to pass he'll usually tell you what your car needs. By the way, your car DOES have a PCV valve. Also, replace the air filter while you're at it; it's probably dirty if it hasn't been done in a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Denso's (because I don't like napa I wont get ngk) Z Napa isn't the only one with NGK plugs. B&B and G.I. Joe's carry NGK's. Denso's should be okay for a while but next time get NGK's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 an oil change can help too. Plus there are fuel additives that will help you get through the teste depneding on how much you failed by. If its a narrow failure, they can get you through, its a massive failure, you got find out what was wrong. A complete tuneup is PCV valve Air cleaner Wires Plugs and if it hasnt been done an o2 sensor (if the car has over 100,000 miles on it and a failed inspection). You really need the numbers so we can tell you where to look best nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 An if you buy a PCV valve, get an OEM one from the dealer; after-market valves seem to be a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoomer Posted September 15, 2006 Author Share Posted September 15, 2006 Replaced o2 sensor with a bosch replacement and it seems to run better, it idles about 500-800 when warm, (the old sensor looked to be VERY:eek: old.) I also learned how to fix automatic seatbelts Pull it apart and refead the whole thing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoomer Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share Posted September 16, 2006 Failed, Almost double Legal limit in everything... Anyone got an emmisions exempt Address I could use?? Seriously though I need to get this thing tabed.. The guy across from the emissions place said that I should just get a new motor. but The very nice guy (can never remember his name But Drives the red turbo brat)at Superior subaru Said that most likely the timing belt is the problem.. any other ideas?? And if it is the T-belt is the 2.2 an interferance motor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 Failed, Almost double Legal limit in everything... Anyone got an emmisions exempt Address I could use?? Seriously though I need to get this thing tabed.. The guy across from the emissions place said that I should just get a new motor. but The very nice guy (can never remember his name But Drives the red turbo brat)at Superior subaru Said that most likely the timing belt is the problem.. any other ideas?? And if it is the T-belt is the 2.2 an interferance motor? EJ22 up to and including 1996 model year is non-interference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manarius Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 Timing belt causing emissions failure!? What kind of bs is this guy trying to feed you. I'd like to know what kind of emissions testing he's doing. Gas cap check, tailpipe, or OBD reading. This can help us determine what he's finding that "fails." This guy's a funny mechanic if he won't give you reports. He's obligated to tell you what's failing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 Failed, Almost double Legal limit in everything... HC, CO, NOx, what? Has anyone determined whether the catalytic converter is functional? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 HC, CO, NOx, what? Has anyone determined whether the catalytic converter is functional? A jumped timing belt can cause a emissions failure, but the car wouldnt run better with just an 02 snesor then, it would still run odd. When was the last time a belt was changed. what were the values on the emissions, we really need to know this in order to help you out. It may be a bad converter, but we need those numbers. he has to give you those numbers, go to a differnt shop. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoomer Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share Posted September 16, 2006 A jumped timing belt can cause a emissions failure, but the car wouldnt run better with just an 02 snesor then, it would still run odd. When was the last time a belt was changed. what were the values on the emissions, we really need to know this in order to help you out. It may be a bad converter, but we need those numbers. he has to give you those numbers, go to a differnt shop. nipper No I have the numbers, I just left them at work., And a couple of people said converter, but The Subie Mechanic, Specializing in subies says timing, I'm just seeing if anyone agrees because a timing belt is cheep a Cat is not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 An if you buy a PCV valve, get an OEM one from the dealer; after-market valves seem to be a problem. Is this true? I picked one up at Canadian Tire and i doubt it OEM but it definitly seems smoother much smoother, before it would hesitate while taking off and make alot off exhaust noise, and vibrate. Think i should leave it? Edit: Forgot to menison when i changed it, it didnt have all those problems ,so should i just leave it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manarius Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 No I have the numbers, I just left them at work., And a couple of people said converter, but The Subie Mechanic, Specializing in subies says timing, I'm just seeing if anyone agrees because a timing belt is cheep a Cat is not Timing != Emissions failure. Timing = crappy running engine. I still think they're something up with this mechanic of yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 No I have the numbers, I just left them at work., And a couple of people said converter, but The Subie Mechanic, Specializing in subies says timing, I'm just seeing if anyone agrees because a timing belt is cheep a Cat is not how many miles on this and when was the last time the belt was changed? nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoomer Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 its got 224000 miles, I don't know, So that means its gonna get changed asap.. BTW: Emissions Results Cruise Limits are HC (ppm) 220 CO(%)1.2 co-co2 6 Cruise Emissions are 251, 2.38, 16.08 Idle Emissions 428 1.78 15.67 For a total FAIL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Looking at your test results it looks to me that you may have a intake air leak. Check the intake gaskets and check for any air leaks beyond the MAF sensor. There may also be some carbon buildup in the cylinders. You could try burning them out by sucking some Seafoam into the intake through a vacuum line while reving the engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Looking at your test results it looks to me that you may have a intake air leak. Check the intake gaskets and check for any air leaks beyond the MAF sensor. There may also be some carbon buildup in the cylinders. You could try burning them out by sucking some Seafoam into the intakethrough a vacuum line while reving the engine. Hydrocarbons [HC] that are created when your car's combustion process is incomplete. Carbon Monoxide [CO] which develops when your vehicle's air-and-fuel mixture doesn't have enough air in it. i agree with cougar, look for vacum leaks, cracked air hoses etc. Check your EGR valve if you have one. ALso you may juts have to go and apply for a waiver. Check your stse's dmv. You can get a waiver after you spend X amount of dollars trying to fix it. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 its got 224000 miles,Although Subaru engines can go that far, it could be tired if not well-maintained. Is there any visible smoke (under any circumstance) at the tailpipe? I don't know, So that means its gonna get changed asap..If you're seriously considering swapping the engine, throwing parts at the current one may not be the way to go. BTW: Emissions ResultsCruise Limits are HC (ppm) 220 CO(%)1.2 co-co2 6 Cruise Emissions are 251, 2.38, 16.08 Idle Emissions 428 1.78 15.67 For a total FAIL! Interesting results. The "co-co2 6" doesn't make sense to me. A CO+CO2 measurement is sometimes used to determine what is called "sample dilution"; an emissions test result wouldn't be valid if there's a leak or other reason that air is mixing with the exhaust gases. In that case, CO+CO2 less than 6% might cause the test to be ended, while anything over that considered enough to continue testing. If indeed 16.08% is a CO+CO2 measurement on your car, and the CO was 2.38%, then at that time the CO2 was about 13.7% (16.08 minus 2.38). That's in the range of possibility; a well-running engine exhausts somewhat over 14% CO2. High HC is often due to unburned fuel in the exhaust and can be caused by lean misfire (vacuum leaks, dirty injectors, etc.) or ignition problems (bad wires, coil, etc.). It can also be from a worn engine allowing oil to get burned (that's why I asked about visible smoke). High CO is typical when the mixture is too rich. If the ECU runs open-loop even if the engine is warm, that could do it. If the gas mileage is particularly poor, that could be an indicator. Since both HC and CO are high, the car has 224,000 miles, and you don't know its history, it's certainly possible that the cat is dead. Replacing the cat might get the car to pass inspection if it's bad, but if the engine is letting unburned fuel or burned oil get to the cat it might not last for long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 After reading OB99W's post, another thought came to mind. It may be good to check and see if the coolant temperature sensor for the ECU is working as it should. This may be causing the mixture to run rich if it doesn't see the temperature go up as the engine warms but also wouldn't throw a error code if the circuit looks ok to the ECU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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