gas guage or fuel consumption?

[nipper]

Coolant Temp does not screw with your gas mileage. Yours is working just fine. Get a new O2 sensor and stop dragging this thread on and on. Try some stuff out first before you go and just post more and more. Search some before you just keep going on asking questions. Coolant Temp and O2 are things even a total novice can do - you don't need to keep asking questions. Go to the parts store, ask for the part, buy it, put it on, it's that simple. We don't need to keep dragging on a thread about Coolant Temp and O2 sensors.

 

coolant temp or coolant temp sensor for your ecu?. Actual coolant temp DOES affect your gas milage. if the temo does not go above 182 degrees F the car will stay in open loop mode. In open loop the car is running at its least effecient. The computer sensors are not interacting with each other.

 

nipper

[Manarius]

coolant temp or coolant temp sensor for your ecu?. Actual coolant temp DOES affect your gas milage. if the temo does not go above 182 degrees F the car will stay in open loop mode. In open loop the car is running at its least effecient. The computer sensors are not interacting with each other.

 

nipper

I mean the sensor itself. The temperature of the coolant is vital to operation; the coolant temp sensor just makes your car act wacky(ie not start for a while) when it's warm. My point is that we're dragging out a thread about silly things like Coolant Temp and O2 sensor. These are basic sensors, not something we need 6 pages of spam about.

[johnceggleston]

I mean the sensor itself. The temperature of the coolant is vital to operation; the coolant temp sensor just makes your car act wacky(ie not start for a while) when it's warm. My point is that we're dragging out a thread about silly things like Coolant Temp and O2 sensor. These are basic sensors, not something we need 6 pages of spam about.

 

no one's forcing you to read or respond.

[ericem]

Exactly, he can drag on the thread for 10000 posts, until he solves his problem.

[WoodsWagon]

I mean the sensor itself. The temperature of the coolant is vital to operation; the coolant temp sensor just makes your car act wacky(ie not start for a while) when it's warm. My point is that we're dragging out a thread about silly things like Coolant Temp and O2 sensor. These are basic sensors, not something we need 6 pages of spam about.

 

And the sensor is what tells the computer that the car is up to temp. If the coolant temp sensor is defective, The computer stays in open loop mode. This means that it throws gas at the motor based on the maf, and ignores the O2 sensor. It does more than just affect starting.

The temp sensor will reduce milage.

 

Even a novice would understand that.

 

#1 rule to diagnosing a problem: don't just throw parts at it till it works. That's what jethrow at jiffylube does, not what a real mechanic does.

 

If it takes 20 pages for him to figure out how to fix the car, so be it. At least we helped someone, and they will be appreciative. Being a prick like you were doesn't help anyone.

[Soutthpaw]

There must be too many auto parts store employees on this board. Thinking one thing is the magic bullet to fix everything. One reason many technicians believe that auto parts stores shoud not be pulling codes from customers vehicles! here it seems there is a love for replacing the O2 sensor.

 

Here is what you need to do. Take it to a decent repair shop and have them do a drivability diagnosis for poor fuel economy. 1996 and newer vehicle use the ECU to control fuel and spark based on a variety of inputs.

You are being misled into probably buying and replacing known good parts.

when you reset an OBDII system what you are doing is erasing the LTFT data... (Long Term Fuel Trim) you also have STFT (short TFT) the car takes time to relearn thess values based on the driving. However they do not become set in stone... they are constantantly updating as you drive. all you are doing by trying to erase the stored data is destroying useful information that a good technician could use to diagnose your problem. That or you need a good scan tool, and the knowledge of how to use and interpret its data. a scan tool is much different from a code reader. as well as a lot more $$$

[BIGBLUE1212]

thanks everyone for your input i find it very valuable nd i respect that you are here to help i tried back probing the sensor and failed so im going to take it to my mechanic and if he cant find it im taking to to subaru

[Green96GT]

Sorry to drag this thread on ( ) but I just wanted to chime in about my 96 GT wagon. Last time I checked I was getting about 19mpg, too. And I think the fuel tank capacity is more like 11.5-12 gallons, not 15, at least it seems that way to me.

 

One prob I have with the fuel gauge is that it seems to read fine until I get to 1/4 tank, then it drops to zero very quickly. In other words the curve starts to drop dramatically. I assume it's a sensor problem, but I just live with it.

 

Sorry to Manarius for being such a plebeian

[a97obw]

O2 sensor is a joke.

 

Undo O2 sensor nut. Pull out old sensor. Unplug old sensor. Put nut around new sensor. Plug in new sensor. Tighten new sensor to the exhaust. It's that simple.

Mr. Manarius forgot to tell you that after you do this his way, you'll have to disconnect the wire to the sensor in order to remove all the twists in the wire because you hooked up the connector before you installed the sensor into the cat.

(I hope he took a nap!)

[Manarius]

O2 sensor is a joke.

 

Undo O2 sensor nut. Pull out old sensor. Unplug old sensor. Put nut around new sensor. Plug in new sensor. Tighten new sensor to the exhaust. It's that simple.

 

Mr. Manarius forgot to tell you that after you do this his way, you'll have to disconnect the wire to the sensor in order to remove all the twists in the wire because you hooked up the connector before you installed the sensor into the cat.

 

(I hope he took a nap!)

God, I wish people would think for themselves around here. Around the BBS, we don't tolerate stupidity. If you can't change the O2 sensor without asking for help of the specifics of how to do it, maybe you ought not to be poking around under the hood. I don't think I should have to spell out everything specifically. Fixing the car is trial and error on a lot of occasions, you don't need somebody to spoon feed you exactly what you have to do. Think a little bit here, my God, is that too much to ask? I'm 18 and I'm asking you older people to think, sheesh. Usually, it's the older guys telling us young people to not be ricers and do a little thinking, but around here it seems to be the complete opposite.

 

Sure, I can understand a question of "Will the ECU just automatically handle the new O2 sensor or should I reset it?" or something to that effect, but "How do I change the O2 sensor?" My God, we're not talking rocket science here.

[WoodsWagon]

I'm 18, I'm experienced, and i like helping people who are less experienced. If everyone was a dink to anyone who isn't technically advanced, the board would have no point.

 

" Around the BBS, we don't tolerate stupidity."

Mabe you should see it as ignorance, not stupidity. Where ever this "BBS" is, if you hate the ignorant people here so much, you should return.

[Manarius]

I'm 18, I'm experienced, and i like helping people who are less experienced. If everyone was a dink to anyone who isn't technically advanced, the board would have no point.

 

" Around the BBS, we don't tolerate stupidity."

 

Mabe you should see it as ignorance, not stupidity. Where ever this "BBS" is, if you hate the ignorant people here so much, you should return.

The bbs is the legacy forum dedicated to the 89-94 legacy's. We don't spoon feed everything to everyone, there's an expectation of a little brain behind the face. (http://bbs.legacycentral.org)

 

It's one thing to help those who are not experienced. But it's another to spoon feed someone how to replace the O2 sensor. That's what Haynes and Chilton's manuals are for. We're here for troubleshooting, not for how-to's of things that are really pretty basic.

[firstwagon]

Sure changing an O2 sensor is easy but if you never done it before you don't know that. What's that old expression "there are no dumb questions, just dumb answers" (or something like that).

 

Also a coolant sensor can certainly screw up your fuel mileage. As Nipper said, if your sensor doesn't read that the coolant is up to normal temperature then the ECU will stay in open loop. That will make you run rich and you mileage will suck. It's basically the same effect as a bad O2 sensor. Whether or not the coolant is hot or not doesn't matter. It's sensor that the ECU gets it's information from, not the coolant itself.

 

If the car doesn't warm up at all then you have a different problem, likely a therosat that failed open.

[johnceggleston]

one of the nice things about this forum is that there are people who are willing to help others. i don't know any where near waht others do, but i can repeat what i've learned for those who know even less.

 

thankfully some one was willing to take the time to educate me on piston slap, clutch packs (still learning about that one), and engine swaps.

 

a haynes manual is a great start , but when it comes to changing your plugs, it's liable to say "remove and replace". but here, you will find someone posting a picture of the socket, extention & ratchet arrangment necessary to do the job with less headache. oh yeah, don't forget the duct tape!!!

 

so thanks to all those who help.

[nipper]

Some of us take great joy in teaching and sharing ... not to mention it gives us something to do

 

nipper

[cookie]

Since I am old than most of you by 25 years or so I have seen the Internet come in as a handy tool. When I was a kid car information was often limited to the folks you knew or a manual.

For the last few cars I've had I could get information on them on boards like this and it is a huge help even if you have experience.

As an example I got code PO420. All my documentation and my manual said to change the cats. This was going to be a minimum of $800.

Somebody on the board told me they had changed the oxegen sensors and it worked for them. In the end my car was fixed in 15 minutes for sixty bucks.

I think this board may be as good a tool as any I have in the toolbox.

[BIGBLUE1212]

maybe we should give Manarius a medal he seems to be the all knowing guru of Subaru that cant be bothered by the little guy....such as myself.....oh forgive me oh great one for asking for help.....all i wanted was to learn. I'm sorry if that disturbs you so much. Forgive me oh great one.

 

Oh and i checked out everything and my engine and everything is fine everyone all my sensors work great. Its actually my gas guage only reading 2/3 of my tank. If anyone has heard of this problem before please share your info.

 

For Manarius please ignore this message.

[Manarius]

You're treating me like I'm doing something wrong here. All I'm aksing is that you think a little bit before you go and post "How do I replace the O2 sensor?" It's not a sin to think a little bit before you post, or even, God forbid, go try it and fail and then make a post asking for some help. Working under the hood isn't rocket science, and it'd be nice if people here would use a little bit of logic before asking questions that one could answer themselves.

 

My major in college is teaching, I have no problem teaching people, in fact, I teach people all the time and I enjoy it very much. But, at least the people I teach try to figure stuff out for themselves before they ask me. Or, they think about it and can't grasp any idea how to complete it before they come and talk to me.

 

It's one thing to teach how the ignition system works - it's another to tell someone to undo a sensor and screw a new one back in. It's pretty self-explanatory. We're not 5 year olds here, most of us are adults with minds, minds that should be able to do basic things.

 

[BIGBLUE1212]

if you do not like the way things are being discussed with this thread or this forum no one is asking you to participate....you do not need to continue posting negative remarks if you dont like the way I or anyone else goes about doing things.....by the way i did do my research I just wanted to know if there are any tricks or if anyone has had this problem before and it could be an unrelated issue.....so please if you dont like the way things are going no one is asking you to stay.

[nipper]

Personally, i have learned here and in life, never to assume that anyone has a skill untill i am corrected. i will ALWAYS start with the very basics untill someone tells me otherwise.

On any given thread, there may be somone here just learning his mechanical skills. Also it doesnt hurt to review basics, as its sometimes good to be refreshed on steps you may have forgotten, as well as a new way to doing something.

It's more then a bit self centered and pompus to think just because you know the basics that everyone else should too. I'ld much rather help somone who knows nothing and wants to learn then help somone that thinks they know everything.

 

nipper

[nipper]

Sorry to drag this thread on ( ) but I just wanted to chime in about my 96 GT wagon. Last time I checked I was getting about 19mpg, too. And I think the fuel tank capacity is more like 11.5-12 gallons, not 15, at least it seems that way to me.

 

One prob I have with the fuel gauge is that it seems to read fine until I get to 1/4 tank, then it drops to zero very quickly. In other words the curve starts to drop dramatically. I assume it's a sensor problem, but I just live with it.

 

Sorry to Manarius for being such a plebeian

 

Fuel tank is 15.9 gallons. If you feel adventurous run it down sometime, you will see.

Another thing you need to look at is does your fuel tank have any dents in it? That will screw things up too.

Do a search on gas gauge/fuel gauge you will see many threads and possible solutions The techron additive works well.

 

nipper

[hankosolder2]

Frankly, I see a bit of both sides here. I agree that people should take a bit of initiative solving problems by themselves and following basic workshop procedures- reading the manual, reading the FAQs, doing a search to look at earlier discussions of similar problems first, etc. On the other hand, your reponses were delibrately rude and provocative. I think it would have been possible to point out politely that it's a fairly basic procedure, rather than immediately setting your rhetorical phaser to "Kill." If others wish to spend time hand holding the less resourceful through a procedure-what skin is it off your nose? I mean, that question must have wasted a good 1/2K of bandwidth there.

Additionally, if you've changed an o2 sensor yourself, you'd know that it's not _always_ as straight forward as the shop procedure suggests. What do you do when the sensor is siezed solid to the manifold? Or you don't have enough clearance to get an 02 sensor socket on it? These are situations where discussing a basic procedure with others who have done it beforehand can save a lot of grief, and are completely valid questions to ask.

If someone asked you for help changing an 02 sensor in person, would you have responded the same way? I really hope not.

 

Nathan

 

 

You're treating me like I'm doing something wrong here. All I'm aksing is that you think a little bit before you go and post "How do I replace the O2 sensor?" It's not a sin to think a little bit before you post, or even, God forbid, go try it and fail and then make a post asking for some help. Working under the hood isn't rocket science, and it'd be nice if people here would use a little bit of logic before asking questions that one could answer themselves.

 

My major in college is teaching, I have no problem teaching people, in fact, I teach people all the time and I enjoy it very much. But, at least the people I teach try to figure stuff out for themselves before they ask me. Or, they think about it and can't grasp any idea how to complete it before they come and talk to me.

 

It's one thing to teach how the ignition system works - it's another to tell someone to undo a sensor and screw a new one back in. It's pretty self-explanatory. We're not 5 year olds here, most of us are adults with minds, minds that should be able to do basic things.