Torque bind and Tran luid light.

[sailhard]

'96 2.2 Legacy L automatic 108k

 

Ir's been binding since last spring. I get the 15 or whatever trans fluid light flashes at startup and the bind is noticable while parking in lots and in reverse. I tried the trans fluid additive, no luck. FWD fuse no effect.

 

My questions:

 

Does the flashing light evey time starting indicate that it is a failure OTHER than the clutch packs frozen up?

 

Does anyone get constant torque bind without the trans light flashing?

 

I'm wondering if maybe I just need that big solenoid ( B? ) or just have a bad connection to it....

 

I've been assumong I have that case casting problem I've heard of, i don't want to pull the tranny apart so I just drive it. Local Subaru tells me I need a $5000 tranny replacement without even looking at it.

:-\

[sea#3]

'96 2.2 Legacy L automatic 108k

 

Ir's been binding since last spring. I get the 15 or whatever trans fluid light flashes at startup and the bind is noticable while parking in lots and in reverse. I tried the trans fluid additive, no luck. FWD fuse no effect.

 

My questions:

 

Does the flashing light evey time starting indicate that it is a failure OTHER than the clutch packs frozen up?

 

Could be , but more than likely it's your Duty c solenoid

 

Does anyone get constant torque bind without the trans light flashing?

 

Yes, it can happen when the valve body for the clutch pack sticks or if the extention housing the clutch pack sits in wears

 

I'm wondering if maybe I just need that big solenoid ( B? ) or just have a bad connection to it....

Duty C solenoid #7 on attachment You could checking for continuity on that circuit

I've been assumong I have that case casting problem I've heard of, i don't want to pull the tranny apart so I just drive it.

 

 

You dont have to pull the trany to fix the clutch assembly , you just have to pull the extension housing Aproxx 2hrs labuor

,It can be pricey for parts depending on what it needs

 

 

Local Subaru tells me I need a $5000 tranny replacement without even looking at it.

:-\

 

SEA#3

[sailhard]

Thanks for the cool diagrams!

 

So the duty c solenoid is "inside" the transfer case, so all i can do ( without pulling the back of the tranny off ) is check the external wire connection to the duty c solenoid?

 

Is there a way to test the duty c solenoid?

[sea#3]

Go to code 24

Hope this helps

 

SEA#3

[nipper]

First off do a search on torque bind.

 

Secondly you have a pre 1997 1/2 tranny which is succeptable to inernal wear, and requires the AWD unit to be rebuilt/replaced for a cost around 800-1000 dollars.

 

There is more to the AWD besides the duty c solenoid. there are seals and a spool valve. SInce you have been driving for so long with TB it is possible that the tranny has been torn apart. The clutchpack is shot at this point, so replacing the solenoid is most likely a moot point. You can try to replace it but i think the damage is done.

 

There is no tranny additive to fix this, the first thing that shold have been done was to make sure all the tires match and are properly inflated. Second thing done should have been a tranny flush.

 

The flashing light tells you the last time you drove the car there was a fault. The fault can be a stuck, open or shorted duty c solenoid.

 

You can try to put the fuse in the FWD holder and see what happens, but again, i wouldnt get my hopes up.

 

Best bet may be to find a used tranny, rebuild the awd unit on the bench, then install it in the car.

 

nipper

[sailhard]

Thanks for the test procedure. I'll give it a whirl, but if it;s not a bad connection, I'll probably just do nothing.

 

regarding Nip's comments.

 

First off do a search on torque bind.

 

* been there done that last spring. Talk about a lot of conflicting articles...

 

Secondly you have a pre 1997 1/2 tranny which is succeptable to inernal wear, and requires the AWD unit to be rebuilt/replaced for a cost around 800-1000 dollars.

 

* yes I'm aware of the wearing issue but have done nothing about it.

 

There is more to the AWD besides the duty c solenoid. there are seals and a spool valve. SInce you have been driving for so long with TB it is possible that the tranny has been torn apart. The clutchpack is shot at this point, so replacing the solenoid is most likely a moot point. You can try to replace it but i think the damage is done.

 

* YES, I AGREE TOTALLY

 

There is no tranny additive to fix this, the first thing that shold have been done was to make sure all the tires match and are properly inflated. Second thing done should have been a tranny flush.

 

*Replaced all 4 tires ( needed anyway )and flushed tranny fluid/used gm additive when it started binding last spring. A dealer suggested the tranny additive and driving in tight circles both ways 100 times....(???)

 

The flashing light tells you the last time you drove the car there was a fault. The fault can be a stuck, open or shorted duty c solenoid.

 

* Yes. That is why I'm asking about testing the duty c solenoid.

 

You can try to put the fuse in the FWD holder and see what happens, but again, i wouldnt get my hopes up.

 

* As I wrote in my first post, I tried that first, no change.

 

Best bet may be to find a used tranny, rebuild the awd unit on the bench, then install it in the car.

 

* The general thought is, why bother fixing the awd-only portion of an automatic transaxle that has over 100k on it? I'm more inclined to drive it til it the tranny is toast, then just go with a completly rebuilt unit...or just get rid of the car when that happens.

 

I really love the car though, it's a real beater...I can fit my windsurfers inside it, easily put on a wetsuit inside it, it's awsome in the snow for getting to ski areas, I can carry unbelevable amounts of building materials in it, and the seats are incredibly comfortable for my aching back.

[Richard1296]

Where can I get a clutch unit (rebuilt or new) .

Calls to local Subaru dealers told me the unit

was no longer available complete.

I have one I would gladly replace because the

car is in excellent condition, just the AWD

doesn't work right. Works fine on a lift

and with the front wheels on a jack the

rear wheels will push the car. On slipery road

the rear drive does nothing , the front just spins.

I have 2 Subaru's so i know how AWD is supposed

to work.

 

Richard

[nipper]

Secondly you have a pre 1997 1/2 tranny which is succeptable to inernal wear, and requires the AWD unit to be rebuilt/replaced for a cost around 800-1000 dollars.

 

* yes I'm aware of the wearing issue but have done nothing about it.

 

There is more to the AWD besides the duty c solenoid. there are seals and a spool valve. SInce you have been driving for so long with TB it is possible that the tranny has been torn apart. The clutchpack is shot at this point, so replacing the solenoid is most likely a moot point. You can try to replace it but i think the damage is done.

 

* No S**t, Sherlock.

 

There is no tranny additive to fix this, the first thing that shold have been done was to make sure all the tires match and are properly inflated. Second thing done should have been a tranny flush.

 

*Replaced all 4 tires ( needed anyway )and flushed tranny fluid/used gm additive when it started binding last spring. A dealer suggested the tranny additive and driving in tight circles both ways 100 times....(???)

 

The flashing light tells you the last time you drove the car there was a fault. The fault can be a stuck, open or shorted duty c solenoid.

 

* Yes. That is why I'm asking about testing the duty c solenoid.

 

You can try to put the fuse in the FWD holder and see what happens, but again, i wouldnt get my hopes up.

 

* As I wrote in my first post, I tried that first, no change.

 

Best bet may be to find a used tranny, rebuild the awd unit on the bench, then install it in the car.

 

* The general thought is, why bother fixing the awd-only portion of an automatic transaxle that has over 100k on it? I'm more inclined to drive it til it the tranny is toast, then just go with a completly rebuilt unit...or just get rid of the car when that happens.

 

 

You know i've been noticing over the last few months how snotty some of the posts are getting, first off i am trying to help you , and th no s**t sherlock comment was UNCALLED FOR.

 

Now if YOU did do the reading on torque bind you WOULD have noticed that rebuilding the AWD unit on cars over 100,000, some close to 200,000 is perfectly justified. You would also see how to test the unit, and also find out that by putting the fuse in the holder and nothing happening that the solenoid is part of the issue.

Its funny, you remind of the kind of person that drives with the oil light on for several thousand miles then wonders why they need an engine.

For YOUR information i had this done on my car at 186,000 miles. If you had this taken care of when it first appeared you would most likely just need a solenoid. If you really loved the car you wouldnt have driven it this long with a MAJOR problem.

Also in your original post there is nothing about you having flushed the tranny.

I am more then happy to help anyone on this, since it seems on this board im the TB expert, but you just pissed me off.

So go have a good time trying to get it fixed yourself.

 

Good Day.

[sailhard]

Nipper, I'm sincerely sorry to have offended you. Thanks very much for taking the time to respond. Lighten up.

 

ps YANKEES SUCK!

[brus brother]

Maybe Nipster is just miffed because nobody noticed this was his 5000th post:clap:... no ataboys, no cards, fanfare, squat... after all I've done for you... so... ATABOY, GOOD JOB, BEEN SWELL, COULDN'T HAVE DONE IT WITHOUT YOU, HERE'S TO 5000 MORE! Now, back to work! PS when I first read TB expert, I thought you were talking about tuberculosis. Thank God torque bind isn't contagious.

Nipper, I'm sincerely sorry to have offended you. Thanks very much for taking the time to respond. Lighten up.

 

ps YANKEES SUCK!

[nipper]

Nipper, I'm sincerely sorry to have offended you. Thanks very much for taking the time to respond. Lighten up.

 

ps YANKEES SUCK!

 

yankees suck? now your just trying to get on my good side..mets rule....

 

nipper

[torxxx]

any tranny shop should sell the rebuild kits for the AWD. Its not a 800 dollar job. You can do it your self. Remove your y pipe and rear drive line. loosen engine mounts, put a hoist on the engine to hold the engine where it is.

 

go under the car and remove the tranny x-member and the tail shaft will sag down enough that you can get to all the bolts on the tail shaft. take out the bolts, pull off the tail shaft, make sure you unplug the wire going to the selinoid and theres your AWD clutch pack. there should be 6 steel and 6 fiber clutch discs in there. just make sure you have the end rings in the right place and replace the steel and fiber discs in the order they came out of the tail shaft.