robertwheeler Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 .... and bad coolant temp sensor. Got down to 36F tonight and its really running like a dog... I know the coolant sensor is going cause I have to hold the pedal al the way to start it sometimes... and i also dont have a thermostat.... would this make it run like 3 cyclinders? pop fizz... no power and so on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 Holding the pedal all the way open puts the ECU into flood-clear mode. Just so you know. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 would a bad cool temp sensor cause it to run like a bad misfire? I know the sensor is going.. the eletrode is comming loose. This sensor is inder the thermostat housing and has a single wire? Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 A bad thermo sensor will confuse the ecu and make it run uber rich, which could cause a running rough problem. I'd replace the t-stat asap, it will make your car run so cool that fuel will collect on the cylinder walls and that will ruin your cylinders in no time. also it doesn't pull adequate heat from the motor, so your sensor will read cold, but there will be parts of your motor that will be overheating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 A bad thermo sensor will confuse the ecu and make it run uber rich, which could cause a running rough problem. I'd replace the t-stat asap, it will make your car run so cool that fuel will collect on the cylinder walls and that will ruin your cylinders in no time. also it doesn't pull adequate heat from the motor, so your sensor will read cold, but there will be parts of your motor that will be overheating. Good advice , but the gods of humur have fun with me.. im broke and starting a new job tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 I think the sensor im thinking of is the sending unit for the gauge... which at worse would cause the gauge to not read.. The car runs great most of the time and sudenly runs really bad... not a new issue and never fully solved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 The car isnt runnung as bad today as last night. I have had to floor it a couple of times.... what could get causing the injector to make an apparent flood? I never get the 2nd bolt hole drilled on thermostat housing and as things always go for me.... the charger for my drill is blowing fuses... I might be able to charge it off the car though with some minor rewireing. Does the socalled coolant temp sensor exist in the 87gl? Is it purely the lack of a thermostat thats causing the car to use more gas , run like crap and sometimes blow black smoke? Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 what engine? 87 wagon is EA82 i think? if you ever get a check engine light you need to find the code. a bad water temp sensor should throw a code (but i've seen them not). additionally, i've never seen a failed water temp sensor. it's usually corrossion at the connection/harness. huge issue on %50+ of the subaru's i've had. i have a write up at http://www.xt6.net on how to permanently address this issue. basically install new wire and solder it directly to the water temp sensor. i have pictures and details there (and i think i posted it here as well). on multiple occaissions i've run subaru's without thermostats before and while i don't recommend it, it didn't cause any noticeable running issues at all. how old is the ignition system? plugs, wires, cap rotor? i'm guessing plugs/wires may alleviate this as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 28, 2006 Author Share Posted October 28, 2006 The plugs are just a few weeks. The wires about 6 months... cap and rotor about a year... maybe a bit less. I dont understand this.. its back to running great again. Do you have a link to your fiX? I looked but I missed it totaly. oh Yeah EA82 Turbo Thanks Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 30, 2006 Author Share Posted October 30, 2006 This is getting critical now... A cel comes on when I start the engine and then the car will run untill the thing is just too flooded to run. I noticed some sparking from one of the wire that are supposed to be life time.. My brother is going to bring me some old wires from my dads garage.... something to try anyway... the new set that I have to pay for anyway.... wont be in until tomorrow. The boot melted off the end of the wire near the cap (rear plug driver side) and I can see it arcing to the top of the cap and it feels like spegetti and if one is this way maybe they all are. Yeah... might need a new cap too... but I hope not. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I would suggest replacing the plug also that goes to that bad wire. The plug may be bad and if so, that is what caused the wire to go bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 30, 2006 Author Share Posted October 30, 2006 I would suggest replacing the plug also that goes to that bad wire. The plug may be bad and if so, that is what caused the wire to go bad. Sounds like a good idea.... but I have to wonder , a side from closing the gap Ive never had a plug fail like this.... these plugs are like 3 weeks old and all gapped to .040. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 The plug might not be the problem but it may be bad internally. If it is bad the spark will seek the least resistance to ground which may be through the plug boot. You don't want to go through another plug wire if the plug is bad so that is why I suggest a new plug be put in. The problem may also have been caused by not seating the wire on the plug properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 The plug might not be the problem but it may be bad internally. If it is bad the spark will seek the least resistance to ground which may be through the plug boot. You don't want to go through another plug wire if the plug is bad so that is why I suggest a new plug be put in. The problem may also have been caused by not seating the wire on the plug properly. Plug changed and wires changed.... one of the later came apart in my hand as I put the new ones on.... Napa just exchanged em for me and I diddnt have to pay. Thanks Robert Seems to have cured the major problem.... sometimes I still have to floor it to start it... but even then it starts after a few seconds... so I still have a minor problem somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Perhaps the wires were defective from the start. I think your model has a cold start valve. The starting problem may be from that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 Damm the problem is still there..... something is causing the plugs to foul very very severly... ANy Idea's? Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 The plugs are charcoal black.... I might try a heavy dose injector clearer and force it to run? Maybe something is forcing the injector to over feed... I have never seen anything like this before. Clue;s idea's suggestions? Im well stumped. Good wires , good plugs (cept they are black as night) Is this purely mechanical or is there some sensor that would cause it to flood this bad? In short... HELP Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertsubaru Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 The plugs are charcoal black.... I might try a heavy dose injector clearer and force it to run? Maybe something is forcing the injector to over feed... I have never seen anything like this before. Clue;s idea's suggestions? Im well stumped. Good wires , good plugs (cept they are black as night) Is this purely mechanical or is there some sensor that would cause it to flood this bad? In short... HELP Robert Did you put a t stat in it yet? Even my carbed car would run rich without t stat. If you cant afford one right now put a piece of card board over 50% of your radiator in front of ac condenser. This will make it run hotter,and if it helps the problem you know that its the lack of t stat. If so get a t stat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 If the coolant sensor for the ECU is defective it can cause the fuel to be rich since the ECU doesn't get the correct temperature reading of the coolant. This is a different sensor than the temperature gauge sensor and a fairly common failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 I have had the card board in a few times.... when it cut out on me this time it was near normal operating temp.... Exactly where is the Temp sensor for the ECU located? Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 Exactly where is the Temp sensor for the ECU located? Robert My info shows it is on the intake manifold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted November 1, 2006 Author Share Posted November 1, 2006 This is really hard to ID , There is a sensor for the gauge under the thermostat housing... Of course there is a fan sensor in the radiator. I looked at a picture of one at advance auto.... basic brass sensor with 2 wires... and some of the other post on here suggest its on the rear of the intake.... On the bright side... while running it with hi dose injector cleaner I think I found where the coolant leak is.... cant be sure in the dark but its flowing from 1 of 2 hoses right by the injector , if fact its blowing onto the heater hoses but not from the heater hoses Im pretty sure. Another respondant suggested that the problem with this sensor is more often a bad connection.... for the moment il move on that suggestion and also continue hi dose cleaners... If I sound calm.... Im really not.... just going through the steps. Thanks for all the kind advice. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted November 1, 2006 Author Share Posted November 1, 2006 I should also like to add at this point that my brother (the one who gave me subie) has kindly loaned me his mustang(86 maybe).... which by odd coincidence is in many ways in worse shape. But it gets me around... the clutch has a way differant feel and it needs to be adjusted badly.... I dont think my brother would understand... I had the same issue with subie. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted November 1, 2006 Author Share Posted November 1, 2006 Some progress I think.... I put two bottle of cleaner in the tank last night... didnt do much at that point... the CEL was on most of the time... After reading in this message area I cleaned the injector down the throat and cleaned the MAF sensor (Still cant find the Coolant temp Sensor). It took a bit to start and I got the most incredible cloud of white smoke.... after a few Min's the CEL went off and the idle started to even out some and evened out when I rev it..... its almost normal now but it still has to go pedal to the floor to start... which it does do. I have only taken it around the block a couple of times... IL be honest , this car scares me and has for a while. The Leak has re masked.... like it was never there , I have been pulling and prodding the hoses and it wont reoccur. First chance I get... im out of this car. Thanks Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwheeler Posted November 2, 2006 Author Share Posted November 2, 2006 Well I must have done something right.... havent seen a CEL since and its running pretty well. Too soon to be sure but the gauge seems to be going down slower.... taking into account that it was burning way too much gas before. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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