Subieguy Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 This is a new problem that has just started happening recently. I turn the car off but it stays running even after the key is out. The only way to get it to shut off is to stall it then it shuts off. Could the ignition switch be going bad? If so would one out of a 87 GL-10 work for it? Any help would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 Yes, my guess is that the ignition switch has gone bad. If you take off some of the trim covers underneath the steering column, you should be able to access the ignition switch connector. If you disconnect this connector the engine should stop. I would imagine the 87 switch would work, but swapping the key portion (as opposed to the electrical portion) is a minor pain due to the anti-theft snap-off bolts that they use to mount the switch housing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 30, 2006 Share Posted October 30, 2006 I suppose the ignition switch could be shorted but it seems that it would be hard to make that happen, yet it seems that is the case. It may also be a sticky ignition relay causing this to happen. I would think the switches would be interchangeable but I haven't done it so I can't say this for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted October 31, 2006 Author Share Posted October 31, 2006 Well I have been checking part #'s and the ignition switch is the same for at least 85-94. So I guess I will take the one out of my 87 colum and give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qman Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Chances are the connector has melted and is now shorting out. As Northwet described it is located under the steering column. Usually a pink connector but could be brown also. Comes down from the ignition switch. Also. there are screws that hold the electrical part of the switch to the keyed part of the ignition switch. You can replace just that part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 OK i finally changed just the electrical switch in my ignition today. Took another one from my 87 column. Worked perfect in my 87 too. It was quick and easy. I just removed the one screw and it came right out. Easy fix right? Well I still have the same problem. Maybe I need to replace the key portion too. It is funny how it does it. If you only let it run for a short time it will turn right off. But after 10 minutes or so it will not turn off with the key. Only stalling it will turn it off. Any thoughts on this one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeshoup Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Did you check the conenctor as was said above? Could be that a couple wires melted and shorted together. A lot of current runs through those wires... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 No I will have to go back and check it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Is it running normally, or chugging/knocking, what rpm is it idleing at, any lights on when you shut the key off???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[HTi]Dain Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Does it have a Turbo-Timer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Even tho its a GL-10, he never said it was a turbo. They did come without. And they never came stock with a turbo timer:rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 five bucks says the wires are somehow shorting out... acfter a while, you can feel that the wires all heat up even if the car is running normally.. there IS a significant amount of current running through that switch, after all. A simple fix might be to find which wire is turned "on" in the "on/run" position, and simply clip that wire.. then use that wire to switch a 40 amp relay, which would feed the circuit originally fed by that wire.. in other words, clip said wire, take the end of said wire attached to the ignition switch, and use that as a signal to turn a relay on, then connect the output of the relay to the other end of the wire that you clipped. That way, the ignition switch itself only sees a very LOW amperage flowing through it, and the car (meaning, anything in the car switched on by the key being in the "on" position) gets plenty of power in the ignition "on" position. search my name, and the term relay, and look at the subject lines for a subject that seems relevant, and you can find some info about junkyard relays out of a BMW that you could use for this... if you wanna pm me with any questions about it I will answer them gladly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 I have a problem with the "shorted wire theory" If this is the case when he stalls it, would not the dash lights (charge, brake, ect.) light up? Like when you turn the key to run but not start the engine. And in this condition the battery would go flat in short order. I'm with 4x4 Welder and ask if it is "run on" also know as "dieseling" This can be caused by carbon deposits or too fast an idle speed or too advanced timing or a combo of the abvove which cause the "run on". A clue here is , and I quote "It is funny how it does it. If you only let it run for a short time it will turn right off. But after 10 minutes or so it will not turn off with the key." It takes a while for the mentioned items to get hot enough to cause this dieseling. (carbon deposits glowing in the combustion chamber). Here is a simple test. Loosen the coil wire (big fat one) at the coil. Drive it for the required time. When it runs on. Pull the wire out of the coil tower. IF it quits this entire diatribe is for naught, an then I would guess that stray (shorted) voltage is coming from the alternator and holding the ignition relay closed. The engine is stalled, alternator output quits and the relay goes open thus no dash lights or battery drain. Or he just found the worlds first automatic turbo timer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 The car runs fine. No dieseling. Nice and smooth. I will try to check the wiress later today. I think I have a extra alternator sitting around so I can try that too. Non turbo car also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 The dieseling mentioned is after you turn the key to off. Also if it is "run on", there is a peculiar smell associated with the running on. Try the coil wire test. Should this cause the engine to stop then... The alternator could be internally shorted and causing the voltage which is holding the relay closed. This voltage would be output on the small "T" connector that is pluged into the alt rear. I believe you can reach this connector with the alt on the engine. I don't want you wasting time on the alt replacement without proving said WAG. See if pulling the small "T" connector causes the engine to stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 Ok i pulled the T plug and the motor stopped. Ok I figure it has to be the alt right? Changed it and it still stays running with the key in the off position. No it is not dieseling or running backwards. It just acts like I never turned the key off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Ok, it's an electrical feedback. Check the fuses, and also if the fan has been wired in to bypass the temp switch, make sure it's off an accessory fuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 Ok I have tried a entirely different ignition switch, changed the coil, changed the alt and checked all the fuses. Still does it. But I have discovered that when my dash lights are dimmer I can turn the car off no problem. But, soon as I rev the engine and the dash lights get brighter I can no longer turn the car off without stalling it or pulling the ignition fuse or unplugging the T connector on the alternator. Getting a little frustrated here.:-\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Hang on- your dash lights are on- all the warning lights, or just a few? Also, does the voltage regulator whine or buzz at lower rpms? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subieguy Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 No warning lights. Acts just like it has never been turned off. I cant hear any problems out of the alternator. They both sound fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 I must say good call to Skip for thinking of the alternator as the path for this trouble. Each of the warning lights are diode isolated from the switched side of the ignition line. To see if the voltage is backfeeding through a bad diode you can remove the warning lights to open the path. If voltage is leaking through that way, pulling out the bulb will open the line. Here is another thought after looking at my prints again. The warning lights are tied to fuse #9 so try pulling it out when the trouble happens. If it kills the engine we are on the right path to solving this mystery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Just some clarification here.. when you turn your key from "on" to "accessories" or "off," it behaves EXACTLY as though the key were in the "Run" position? NO warning lights (outside of maybe handbrake) correct? If we have established that it is not an alternator problem, or a dieseling problem (you DID try the coil wire test, right? pulling the coil wire while the engine was "still running turned off" killed the engine?) then the problem seems to lie in the keyswitch. Yet, you have replaced this to no avail, ruling THAT part out as a possible culprit. My vote totally lies with MOSTLY shorted wire, and after a little while enough current passes through to heat things up and complete the short. You mentioned that if you rev high enough to brighten your dash lights.. you mean, the gauge cluster illumination, etc, right? In other words, once you rev it enough to charge the system and fully assert its voltage.. your car cannot cut off. That might well coincide with the wire heating up from a given minimum amount of juice having gone through.... Try fiddling with the whole length of these wires. For that matter, have you felt aforementioned wires yet to see how hot they actually do get? its MIND boggling, to be honest... splicing a relay into the circuit really is a superior way of designing the system. It is alot more than a "quick fix," it is re engineering a low-budget economy car to have a feature that enhances reliability and longevity. I had to relay my starter because I had similar keyswitch problems.. My older brother, the ASE certified mechanic had a "starter problem" the whole time he owned the car, and it finally went critical on me.. which meant that when I turned the key, all I got was a *click* like I had a low battery. I installed a relay that was switched by the OLD solenoid control wire, and then ran a wire from that relay into the solenoid control terminal, and it has worked B-E-A-Utifully ever since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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