disable abs?

[mjm]

I've had a couple of experiences driving on a small amount of slush/snow where the ABS has kicked in causing the car to take much longer to stop than I thought it really needed. Is there an easy way to disable it (like pulling a fuse)? Or can it be adjusted? Car is a '96 Legacy.

 

Thanks.

[mtsmiths]

I've had a couple of experiences driving on a small amount of slush/snow where the ABS has kicked in causing the car to take much longer to stop than I thought it really needed. Is there an easy way to disable it (like pulling a fuse)? Or can it be adjusted? Car is a '96 Legacy.

 

Thanks.

 

You don't want to do that, assuming the ABS is working correctly I guarantee it can stop faster than you can. Ir's psychological, but get used to it.

 

Also, if you disable the ABS you will probably also void your insurance, and in some states be guilty of a crime.

 

Bad idea all around.

[nipper]

Well thats what ABS does. It doesnt shorten the stopping distance, and never was meant to (compared to dry). It allows you to maintain control of the car. It also allows for shorter breaking then when the wheels are locked up.

The only time that ABS is a negative is unplowed snow or loose dirt/sand.

There is a simple way to wire an on off switch, but it sounds to me that it was doing exactly what it was meant to do. ABS doesnt kick in unless the wheels lock up, and from the description you gave, it sounds like they did.

 

Remeber to leave plenty of room between you and the other car, be careful out there folks.

 

nipper

[Skid542]

MJM,

 

I totally feel you. ABS on slush/snow can be very aggrivating and definately causes longer braking distances. The problem, as I see it, is that if only wheel locks and happens to be the one with the sensor then the ABS kicks in and reduces the braking on the tires that are still gripping fine. I find stopping at stoplight/signs terrify sometimes since it's that last little tiny bit where a little lockage isn't a problem versus letting them roll another 15 foot. On asphault ABS is fine with me since I don't want to flatspot a tire but that's not going to happen in the slush/snow. Having had two previous non ABS cars, one being a 93' Legacy, they all stopped before my 96' OBW. I've often wondered the same question you're asking and keep us posted on what you do and your results.

[ericem]

Well on my 93 when u pulse the brakes manually momentarily it just disables abs, thats a quick way to shut it off.

[hankosolder2]

A few notes on this subject:

 

1.) Some of the early Audis with ABS had a dashboard switch to disable it. Owner's manual suggested disabling ABS when it was snowy out and on gravel.

 

2.) ABS greatly lengthens stopping distances on cars with faulty struts...as determined by a A/B tests on the same car. The ABS overreacts to the tires "dribbling" on the road and fractionally locking up under braking. This was determined by a German car magazine. I don't have the reference, but this was cited in the "BMW enthusiast's handbook" published by the BMW CCA.

 

3.) Cars equipped with ABS have a slightly higher accident rate than those without. (there are various theories out there about this, including that drivers are over confident with ABS, drivers are scared by the pedal kickback and let up on the brakes, or perhaps even that having steering control in a panic situation is NOT a good thing for some drivers.)

 

4.) Personal experience here; I did my own A/B test with a BMW 535i in snow/slush. Tried stopping -W- abs, noted where I ended up... went back to the same spot in the road, same speed, killed the ABS, was able to stop sooner. Not totally scientific, but lends some creedence to the ABS doubters.

 

5.) Nothing scrubs off speed like going down the road sideways!

 

IMHO, ABS is a useful driver's aid, but can definitely increase stopping distances in the snow. I think that anything which can increase stopping distances should be switchable from the factory, but understand the liability issues.

 

End of rant. ABS or not, slowing down and braking early are the best ways to play it safe!

 

Nathan

[nipper]

5.) Nothing scrubs off speed like going down the road sideways!

 

 

yes but it tends to scare on comming traffic

 

 

nipper

[hankosolder2]

yes but it tends to scare on comming traffic

 

 

nipper

 

Good one!

 

Nathan

[montana105]

which causes that Ford Falcon driver to instantly set his brakes and try to pump them to control his brake lock up not seeing he is headed right into you.

I use the Falcon as reference only to symbolize people that don't have ABS or understand it.

John

[nipper]

which causes that Ford Falcon driver to instantly set his brakes and try to pump them to control his brake lock up not seeing he is headed right into you.

I use the Falcon as reference only to symbolize people that don't have ABS or understand it.

John

 

You may have to start explaing what a ford falcon is first.

 

nipper

[ericem]

Yes please lol!

 

Oh and i remember one time, my dad told me he was driving on a combo of ice, snow, slush etc on a -20C day like 5F i think? And if the abs didn't kick in, his steering would have locked and would have hit a tree, but luckily he was still able to steer, and the abs acted like a traction control on his end, pretty astonishign considering the tires were Cheapo all seaons.

[montana105]

Ford falcon-early 60's to 70 model Ford,believe the Mustang was built on it's chassis.Basically smaller version of the Galaxies and 500"s. Not a bad car,and actually underrated for drag cars for the person with the money.Basically the size of the Chevy II or Nova of the age.

John

[nipper]

Ford falcon-early 60's to 70 model Ford,believe the Mustang was built on it's chassis.Basically smaller version of the Galaxies and 500"s. Not a bad car,and actually underrated for drag cars for the person with the money.Basically the size of the Chevy II or Nova of the age.

John

 

http://www.falconclub.com/

 

 

nipper

[mjm]

Thanks so much for the feedback.

 

I've never had a problem on clear asphalt with the abs (dry or wet). I should say that the abs modulator in the car is actually not the original one. It was replaced about a year and a half ago with one pulled from another subaru (my original unit was leaking brake fluid). But over the summers it seems to behave fine, and it takes some serious braking to trigger it.

 

I guess the deal on the slush is just that these couple of incidents have made me a bit nervous about the whole stopping ability of the car in these conditions - in both cases I was really going pretty slowly down the street, and the road was more messy than covered, but the car seemed to just sail through the stop sign (but was accompanied by the shuddering, so I guess it must have been braking some). Now of course I don't know what would have happened had the abs not engaged, and I realize that the abs might have been doing exactly what it was supposed to, but it was just my gut reaction that it took too long and that I would have been able to come to a stop sooner had the abs not kicked in.

 

The default I guess is that I leave things as they are, as at the moment I don't actually know how to disable or adjust the abs (I'm not really much of a mechanic.. so tinkering will require the help of a pro unless its super easy). I was just curious if there was an easy way of disabling it in case I am out on some ski trip and really start having problems, or if I should take it in to see if it needs adjusting. I certainly don't want to start voiding insurances or doing anything illegal anyway...

 

The strut issue is interesting (hankosolder2), also the single wheel sensor issue (skid542). Which wheel is the sensor on? Might tell you which wheel to take a closer look at. I also need to get a slow leak fixed on the front left tire, although the abs issue preceeds this.

 

Thanks!

[nipper]

You know all of us have skipped one vital question....

 

What kind of tires do you have?

 

 

nipper

[dmanaenk]

#1 Get decent winter tires

#2 check your struts

If 1&2 do not help - consider installing a switch.

[nvexplorer]

We've got 4 wheel ABS on our work trucks, 2 GMC Sierras and a F150. I get to drive through mud and snow plenty and the ABS definitly doesn't aid in stopping fast. If you manually pump the brakes it usually will disengage the ABS and lock up the tires.

My dad's 2500 Suburban also has ABS and its hell to get it to stop fast on ice with the ABS even when going slow already. Once again, manually pumping the brakes disables the ABS and most of the time it will stop faster, but steering is gone.

[camosuba]

Ford falcon-early 60's to 70 model Ford,believe the Mustang was built on it's chassis.Basically smaller version of the Galaxies and 500"s. Not a bad car,and actually underrated for drag cars for the person with the money.Basically the size of the Chevy II or Nova of the age.

John

 

We still have them here but they've evolved a little http://www.ford.com.au/servlet/ContentServer?cid=1137385392410&pagename=FOA%2FDFYPage%2FDefault1024&c=DFYPage

[johnceggleston]

perhaps in an empty parking lot with snow and slush... try braking hard , let the ABS do it's thing and then pull on the parking break. just remember to keep the push button depress so you can release it if needed. you should still be able to steer the front of the car (a little) but the rear will probably lock up. this may well create the WORST of both worlds.

 

or do some test to see if pumping will in fact disable the ABS.

[nipper]

Once again, manually pumping the brakes disables the ABS and most of the time it will stop faster, but steering is gone.

 

and once you loose steering, you loose control of the vehical. Like i said ABS is there help you maintain control of the car, not stop shorter.

 

 

nipper

[Seahag1978]

As I have mentioned in other posts on this issue, I love the AWD but hate my Baja's ABS brakes... I would rather lock and recover. My '86 BRAT goes out in the slickery stuff, and the Baja stays home.

 

No wonder there are so many wrecks, in some cars, they couple the ABS with full-time front wheel drive where you lose forward control... I have seen so many cars nose first into snowbanks because they didn't make the turn because of the FWD... yikes! I'd rather fishtail and recover too!

[montana105]

Hope I'm not beside you when your car decides to fishtail and you try to correct it. I think what Nipper is trying to say and I agree is that people believe ABs is a cure all and gives people a false sense of control,which causes people to drive beyond the conditions.It amazes me the amount of yahoos I see driving 35-40 in a 25 mph zone on ice and then wonder why their car wouldn't stop on a dime or had to use the aid of a curb or railing to keep them on the road,or worse yet use the aid of another vehicle to slow them down with a collision. Again ABS does not make you stop quicker,it helps you retain steering control in a panic situation and is not anymore dependable on ice or gravel then standard brakes in quick stop situations.I don't mean any disrespect to anyone here,I don't know your driving habits,but for those of you who still drive at or above the speed limit on ice or on gravel blame yourselves.Remember that speed limits are designed around optimal road conditions and here in Montana you can be fined for not driving to the conditions of the road.

John

[nipper]

I rented a top of the line volvo (there are some stories i need to save so i can paste them) last year. I had it for 10 days, it had all the bells and whistles and awd. It had traction control with an itsybitsytinsywheeny light to tell you when it kicked in. I had to read the owners manual to see what the light meant.

The roads were snowy, but didnt look that bad (on 80 in PA). I shut off the traction control. I almost turned white whne i realized how bad the raods actually were. The TC was masking how slippery the roads were by not allowing the usual warning signs to occur (spiunning tire or slight hydroplaning). Traction controlo may be all good, but it can't change the laws of physics.

The way ABS may make people feel overconfident (and them not understanding how it works), TC makes it worse and hides how bad the conditions are.

The feedback loop is gone.

 

Now if you want to disable your ABS you just need to put a switch in the line to from the fusebox that feeds the ABS. NOw i HGHLY recomend using a latching relay, so that everytime you start the car, you have to shut off the switch. Also you need this reset if anyone else besuides you ever drive your car.

 

ABS is still a huge godsend when one or two tires loose traction and the others dont. That is possible for 10 months out of the year for most people. ABS also helps on dry ground.

We can all find worse case sceanrios for when air bags suck, abs, seat belts, double locking doors are bad. But for the other 99% of the time they are good.

 

nipper

[WoodsWagon]

In snow and slush with conventional brakes, you can lock the wheels up and still get a lot of braking action because of the plowing the locked wheels are doing. The pile of snow/dirt ect. in front of the locked wheel helps stop the car. With ABS, the wheel is constanly unlocking and running over this hump, reducing the stoping force. I get really sketched out in my mom's outback, you slow down and a certain rate, ABS kicks in, and you can feel the car's rate of decel decrease markedly.

 

ABS is great on dry pavement, but it is a detriment on snow, where often you aren't "out of control" even if you have your wheels locked up. Having a disable switch would be nice. Which brings us to:

 

What wire would you cut and put the switch in to disable the ABS system? Having the system disabled, but the ABS warning light come on on the dash would be best.

[nipper]

In snow and slush with conventional brakes, you can lock the wheels up and still get a lot of braking action because of the plowing the locked wheels are doing. The pile of snow/dirt ect. in front of the locked wheel helps stop the car. With ABS, the wheel is constanly unlocking and running over this hump, reducing the stoping force. I get really sketched out in my mom's outback, you slow down and a certain rate, ABS kicks in, and you can feel the car's rate of decel decrease markedly.

 

ABS is great on dry pavement, but it is a detriment on snow, where often you aren't "out of control" even if you have your wheels locked up. Having a disable switch would be nice. Which brings us to:

 

What wire would you cut and put the switch in to disable the ABS system? Having the system disabled, but the ABS warning light come on on the dash would be best.

 

No your cutting it at the power to its brain. You wont get a light.

trace the wires yourself, but like i said use a latching relay/switch.

 

And also remember just because YOU dont feel your out of control, the next person that drives your car may be, and may be counting on the abs (like mom).

 

nipper