TarmacSuby Posted March 8, 2007 Share Posted March 8, 2007 Is it possible to convert a 1985 GL Sedan with the ea82t to a FT4WD using the parts from a newer GL turbo that came with FT4WD? Would this be a purely bolt-in process or would it be extensive with modifications required for it to fit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 Is it possible to convert a 1985 GL Sedan with the ea82t to a FT4WD using the parts from a newer GL turbo that came with FT4WD? Would this be a purely bolt-in process or would it be extensive with modifications required for it to fit? Physically, The 4eat may not fit the trans tunnel in an 85. They did not use the FT4wd until 88. I think it probably would fit with a little BFH coaxing. You would need to use the 25 spline front axles, a 3.7 rear diff, unless you're 85 is an Automatic 4wd, then you've got it already. You'll want the rear driveline from the turbo car, the length of the front section will be different. Also you need to swap the front crossmember from the turbo car to clear the exhaust. You will need the turbo exhaust or something fabbed. Also Aircleaner box and MAF. That's the physical differences. The real challenge is that you would need to install the Turbo wiring, ECU(eng. Comp), TCU(trans comp) and the 4 speed shifter. If the 85 is already automatic, you could use it shifter, and wire the "1st hold" through the 4wd switch. That is of course all for the Automatic "Fulltime" If the Fulltime trans you're lookin to use is manual, Ignore the TCU and shifter comments. But you will still need to do the ECU wiring for the turbo engine. I'D think better off to put good stuff from the 85 into the Turbo car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sister7 Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 How easy/hard it is depends. Is your car auto or manual? 4WD or 2WD? Is the tranny auto or manual? The final drive should 3.70 on both transmissions, but I could be wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeshoup Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 Physically, The 4eat may not fit the trans tunnel in an 85. I don't see 4EAT mentioned anywhere. If its a 5 spd FT4WD, and your current car is 4WD, the trans will bolt up with a swap of the diff and front axles. Engine is a bit more difficult. Crossmember, ECU, wiring, engine (duh!), exhaust upto the midpipe, replace the rubber fuel hoses with those FI rated, replace the fuel pump, etc. IMO, not worth it. Just get an EJ engine and an adapter plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 I don't see 4EAT mentioned anywhere. If its a 5 spd FT4WD, and your current car is 4WD, the trans will bolt up with a swap of the diff and front axles. Engine is a bit more difficult. Crossmember, ECU, wiring, engine (duh!), exhaust upto the midpipe, replace the rubber fuel hoses with those FI rated, replace the fuel pump, etc. IMO, not worth it. Just get an EJ engine and an adapter plate. Yeah, I would tend to agree. Crossmember is the straw on the camel for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 9, 2007 Author Share Posted March 9, 2007 Physically, The 4eat may not fit the trans tunnel in an 85. They did not use the FT4wd until 88. I think it probably would fit with a little BFH coaxing. You would need to use the 25 spline front axles, a 3.7 rear diff, unless you're 85 is an Automatic 4wd, then you've got it already. You'll want the rear driveline from the turbo car, the length of the front section will be different. Also you need to swap the front crossmember from the turbo car to clear the exhaust. You will need the turbo exhaust or something fabbed. Also Aircleaner box and MAF. That's the physical differences. The real challenge is that you would need to install the Turbo wiring, ECU(eng. Comp), TCU(trans comp) and the 4 speed shifter. If the 85 is already automatic, you could use it shifter, and wire the "1st hold" through the 4wd switch. That is of course all for the Automatic "Fulltime" If the Fulltime trans you're lookin to use is manual, Ignore the TCU and shifter comments. But you will still need to do the ECU wiring for the turbo engine. I'D think better off to put good stuff from the 85 into the Turbo car. Wait a minute... The 85 is a turbo. I was just wondering how hard it would be to convert my sedan, EA82 turbo from the pushbutton 4WD automatic to a full-time 4WD like the newer subies? Would that make it easier than what all you said or... ? However, what is the "first hold" switch? As for the statement about the EJ engine and an adaptor plate...? Is the EJ engine a direct bolt in replacement for the EA82T with the exception of the adaptor for the trans? Or would it be more worthwhile to swap an EJ and trans in together? Sorry for so many questions..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 well, let's see if i can cut through some confusion... If you have an 85 turbo that you want to try the newer tranny in, it should bolt right in. the only situation where it is much more complex than that is when the 4EAT is being installed into an earlier (pre 88?) vehicle; the trans tunnel was enlarged at some point sepcifically to be able to fit the 4EAT. The EJ swap is an engine swap. Nothing short and sweet about it, you are looking at custom wiring, FAR from a plug and play procedure. it is a relatively SIMPLE engine swap, but it is an engine swap, not upgrading your lightbulbs It requires a transmission adapter plate, some sort of crossmember work, the EJ's computer and wiring harness, and retrofitting all of that into your chassis. (never done it, but I have read alot about it) If you already have a turbo car, and the intake manifolds on the two turbo engines are the same, the rest of the stuff should be directly swappable as well. Hope this helps clear some things up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 Tarmac, is the donor FT4WD trans an automatic or a manual? Is the 85 an automatic or a manual? This needs to be clarified before any real concrete answers can be given. Right now it's all "if this then that" kind of answers. Note also that there are Changes in the engine mangement between the 85 and the 88. 85,86 are old design, with Flapper MAF, seperate knock control unit, and no wastgate solenoid on the turbo.(it opens directly from the intake pressure) 87+ integrated the knock contrlol into the ECU, change to hotwire MAF, and uses a solenoid to control wastegate operation. TPS is also different between the 2 styles. Most other parts however are the same. Also in 88 Cali turbos, and all 89 turbos, the EGR system is eliminated. Another note: some early 87 XT turbos used the old style turbo set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 9, 2007 Author Share Posted March 9, 2007 The 85 I own is a turbo pushbutton 4WD automatic. I was thinking about converting it to FT4WD using a newer trans from the newer turbo sedan. I was just going to use another automatic to replace it. Hopefully that would make it easier to do the swap. The EJ engine swap was just another thought. I can't go through the effort to do the rewire on the car to make it work since I don't have the free time or the knowledge let alone a shop to do it in.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 The 85 I own is a turbo pushbutton 4WD automatic. I was thinking about converting it to FT4WD using a newer trans from the newer turbo sedan. I was just going to use another automatic to replace it. Hopefully that would make it easier to do the swap. The EJ engine swap was just another thought. I can't go through the effort to do the rewire on the car to make it work since I don't have the free time or the knowledge let alone a shop to do it in.... Do you even have a donor vehicle for the "new" transmission, or are you just in planning stages? The four speed electronic auto trans will NOT fit in your car without cutting and changing the size of the tunnel. Easier to just use the car it came out of. Sorry, I forgot about the differences between the earlier turbo EA82s and the later ones... but more detail, more specifics are DEFINITELY needed in your posts to give you good info.. "the FT4wd transmission out of the later car" means diddly squat.. "the ft4wd 4EAT from the 89 GL-10 turbo" (or "ft4wd 5 speed, etc etc) means something. not to be rude or anything.. but we need data to function as the mentat for you.. and if you do not understand the Dune reference, then ignore my last line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 10, 2007 Author Share Posted March 10, 2007 Sorry about not being very specific but I am still in the planning stages so I don't really have a specific vehicle to grab parts from. But yes, I was thinking one of the newer GL-10 turbos, (88-89) that has the 4EAT and the FT4WD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Sand worms aside. Tarmac, you are young and new here. Please understand we are here to help you - help yourself. The tranny you now have is a 3AT Three speed Automatic Transmission It shifts by means of roatating parts/vacuum read no electronics. The tranny you want 4EAT AWD is 4 speed Electronic Transmission All funtions are controlled by a TCU. Transmission Control Unit - read electronics. To install this tranny in your car aside from the size difference, the VSS (vehicle speed sensor) must be swapped and the entire wiring harness for the tranny must be installed. The BIG question you need to answer is are you one with your DMM? and Do the words pinout and schematic mean good things to you? An easier and more fun in the end swap would be the manual FT4wd tranny from an RX of your vintage. A true ten (10) speed with AWD and a center diff lock. Grab the rear diff for some LSD action and ZOOOO000ooommmm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I think you will have an issue with the TPS. Even with all the other obstacles aside(trans tunnel, wiring the TCU, 25 spline axles, etc...) I think you will hit a snag wtih the TPS(throttle posittion sensor) The 4eat TCU uses signal from the TPS to determine shift charcteristics. The TPS on you're 85 is very different from the one used in the 87 and later models. If you put a later style TPS on you're engine then you're engine won't run right. If you simply don't wire in the TCU to the TPS then it will assume 5/8 open throttle all the time, and shift accordingly, so It would still drive. But it would be setting a trouble code on you. of course with no power light to display it who cares( If a code sets and no one can see it, is there really a problem? Trees falling..) I have thought of perhaps piggybacking a second TPS onto the back of the stock one.(i wanted to do this to use a Legacy Trans in my GL Turbo) But it would take drilling a hole in the back of the old TPS and extending the throttle shaft through to the second one. Only a thought. I haven't actually tried it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 10, 2007 Author Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yes I am new here.. I have been reading the forums since my friend first bought his subaru and started on here but I haven't actually had any question or posted much until now. How hard would it be to put the manual trans in considering there isn't a clutch or anything currently in there? How hard are those to put in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yes I am new here.. I have been reading the forums since my friend first bought his subaru and started on here but I haven't actually had any question or posted much until now. How hard would it be to put the manual trans in considering there isn't a clutch or anything currently in there? How hard are those to put in? pretty easy actually. You would just need to install a pedal assembly from a manual, and the shift linkage, along with the trans itself. You need to get a flywheel and clutch aswell, but that can be scavenged easily with the trans. There is a vaccum line going to the governor on you're automatic that would need plugged.(it would need plugged for a 4eat swap as well, since it doesn't use vaccum) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I try to be the nicest guy on the board (honestly) but sometimes my comments may come out otherwise, and if so I apologize. I was simply trying to point out that it IS a question that warrants more details, since a transmission swap is a job that warrants knowing all of those details. Those details have been covered more succinctly and thoroughly than I could have by Skip and Gloyale (Sand worms aside ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 11, 2007 Author Share Posted March 11, 2007 Don't worry. I didn't think anything of it... I just want my car running and I welcome all comments. Even any criticism that will come. (me being the noob) lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Frankly you have an early EA82 turbo with a 3 speed auto.... use it for parts and get yourself a later 80's FT4WD 5 speed car if that's what you want. The early EA82T's weren't all that in reliability, and you'll just blow the thing up if you run it hard anyway. Gen 1 heads, old style interior, and 3AT automatic = parts car. Manual conversions aren't for the un-initiated. I've done several conversions of various difficulty levels, and it's not something you want to start with. It will cost more than the car is worth, and more than you can buy a later FT4WD car for in WA. Don't waste your time. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 I'd suggest that unless you want to get into turbo tuning, that for more power you consider an EJ swap into a car with your transmission of choice. Much has been pioneered and troubleshot with such projects. You are in the middle of subaru heaven. There are many completed projects within a couple hours of you that you could easily view in person if you coordinate with the owner. I would suggest that you spend time reading the Retrofitting Forum posts regarding EJ swaps. There is a LOT to be read and grasped before you start on anything that has been discussed in this thread. Also -you're 18, as I see, and inexperienced as of yet - no offense, but don't get into something over your head. Unless you get really lucky with your parts cars, you're looking at a grand or two to accomplish any of these projects, and let's just say that when i was 18, I didn't exactly have money falling out of my (). I still don't and I have learned to at least double the forecasted time for any major project, just for safety. BTW a turbo car will cost you more in the end as they are much more finicky and higher maintenance. Good luck! Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TarmacSuby Posted March 13, 2007 Author Share Posted March 13, 2007 You are definitely right regarding the money part of it. I am slightly lacking the financial ability to do much of anything right now... Just moved a couple weeks ago and started a new job the exact same week = broke for the coming month or two. I have the GL-10 turbo sedan and it is going to be my daily driver if I can get it running again. After that I hope to either modify it or get a newer Suby to work on. I thank everyone again for giving me a bit of a better perspective on what I was trying to ask. Definitely keeps me from digging too deep into a project and getting myself buried instead. Not what I want to do at this point... Thanks again. So in final note.. Anyone have a newer Suby with the 5 spd FT4WD they want to get rid of?? (that was probably a dumb question since it seems that anyone that has that wants to keep it or find more of them. lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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