Mikevan10 Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 I am planning to swap out the automatic transmission on my 1992 Legacy this coming weekend. I have a used one on hand. Man are these things HEAVY! Anyway, my query at the moment concerns the "Seal Pipe" that goes (I believe) behind (or maybe over) the split oil pump shaft seal ring. I stopped my my local Subaru dealer yesterday to order the split seal ring and also the front tans seal. Those were the only parts I really intended to replace "while I was in there". The parts counter man advised me that whenever they (i.e. the dealer) replaces an auto trans, they replace this seal pipe (part number 31295AA003) because it tends to crush down to size when it is installed. In all of the recent discussions about replacing automatic transmissions on this board lately, I have seen no mention of this. The dealer wants $32.00 for this part and I have no desire to spend an unnecessary money on this job. Any comments on this, please! Thanks, Mike V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 i don't know what the "seal pipe" is. i would replace the torque converter seal and the ring seal (along the shaft) and leave it at that, that's all i've ever replaced on the auto trans side of things. i've never heard of anyone replacing anything else either. while the trans is out, it's easy to replace the rear output shaft seal as well that the driveshaft slides into. they are old and brittle and can seap ATF at this point. but they are also replaceable in the vehicle. if you're driveshaft has been removed for a couple days and sitting, make sure it's not rusty or dirty when you reinstall it. you know about the trickiness of seating the torque converter right? not doing it right will ruin your new trans. it's easy to mess up if you haven't done it before or don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avk Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 Maybe it's the pipe around the input shaft where it goes through the front diff. housing. FSM does say to use a new one, see here on p.4 (orig. page 67): http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/files/lee/18575.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hondasucks Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 MAke sure you get the input shaft fully seated, it can be somewhat tricky, that hung me up on a 90 Legacy I put a new motor in a few months ago, torque converter would NOT go in any farther so I thought it was in all the way, turns out it wasn't. Luckily it didn't damage anything and the car drives fine now, but that input shaft was a BEAR to get in. When it's in all the way, the O ring will be close to the stator support. (Stator support is the splined shaft that sticks out of the transmission that the input shaft slides inside of.) When the T/C is in all the way, the flats for the bolt holes will be just below the mating surface of the bellhousing. Engine should slide together with the tranny completely fairly easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 Maybe it's the pipe around the input shaft where it goes through the front diff. housing.FSM does say to use a new one, see here on p.4 (orig. page 67): http://www.subaru-svx.net/photos/files/lee/18575.pdf there is a ton of information on that page. there are two "seal pipes" mentioned, from what i saw...i'm not loading it again to check, ADOBE SUCKS..anyway, i've never replaced it and dont know anyone else that has either. i'd be more worried about the retaining clip that holds the pipe to the torque converter than the pipe myself...but i've never had to replace one of those either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 there are two seal pipes listed, on page 4 and page 25. it is possible it's the same part, but it only mentions replacing the seal pipe when rebuilding the transmission. i don't know that it's considered necessary, even by FSM standards when swapping the trans. that might be a "only when rebuilding" thing, i don't know. i have not and would not replace it. never seen that done before and i've never heard of it causing issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avk Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 I am not hands-on with this type of work, but had the impression that the original poster wanted to remove the oil pump, which would give access to the pipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 i think he just wanted to swap the trans. either way that seal pipe is an interesting read and even more interesting that the dealer mentioned it, i had never noticed that before. got me wondering if my ER and EJ FSM's are similar to that SVX info. should be identical on that part. wouldn't you ask the parts guy about for the parts? they don't always the service side all that well. kind of hit or miss, but they aren't actually the guys out there turning wrenches so he might have been confused about what you were doing or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikevan10 Posted March 20, 2007 Author Share Posted March 20, 2007 I believe the "seal pipes" mentioned on pages 4 and 25 of the service bulletin are one and the same. I also believe that, as someone suggested, this seal pipe would only be replaceable upon partially dismantling the transmission, which I have no intention of doing (unlesss I have to). I will comment more later after I examine my replacement trans (externally). At this point, can anyone clarify which part exactly is the "ring seal" (I believe this is some sort of split ring - possibly graphiite?). Is this the part that is shown on page 25 of the service bulletin, between item numbers 13 (the seal pipe) and 11? And is what spomeone referred to as the "torque converter seal" item 18 on this same illustration (on page 25)? Thanks, Mike V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 yes, you have the torque converter seal right. it looks like you might be right on the ring seal, but i'm not sure. i can't seem to positively identify it on those sheets. the ones i've ordered have always been called "ring seals" based on the dealer parts look up software. you shouldn't have a problem...i have not and noone else that's tried to get one has either...getting the "ring seal" from the dealer. it can be tricky to find on those parts explosions and it didn't immediately pop out on those diagrams though. it may be the part you mentioned. it is a graphite (best way i can describe the material) type seal that's a complete circle that's been cut. it is not a clip. i've seen some mangled (twisted and wrecked) and very brittle ones, i like to replace them if i'm taking the trans out. be sure to look at the old one and remember where it goes, i do recall being confused one time on where it was supposed to set on the shaft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikevan10 Posted March 21, 2007 Author Share Posted March 21, 2007 OK. I did some inspection of my "new" transmission. Here are my comments and questions: The Tranmsmission Input Shaft (the actual input shaft, not part of the torque converter or oil pump drive) has a small O-ring near the torque converter end. I plan to replace this. The torque converter has a larger diameter tube extending from the rear (i.e. trans side) of it. This tube has the slots cut out of the end of it that engage, and drive, the oil pump. This tube has kind of a wobbly connection to the torque converter itself. I assume this wobbliness is normal. Correct? The wobbly tube has a split, square section, ring near the trans/oil pump end of it. This ring is made of a hard material. Perhaps graphite. Perhaps Teflon. I assume this is the "ring seal" everyone likes to replace. Correct? I carefully re-installed the trans input shaft and then the torque converter. I rotated the torque converter while applying axial force to it until it pushed "home". I am fairly (like 99.999%) positive that the last 1/4 inch that it slid was when the slots in the end of the torque converter tube engaged the lugs (for lack of a better term) on the oil pump. Once I reached this condition the plane of the engine side of the tabs that you bolt the flex plate ("flywheel") to was about 1/16" forward of the plane of the bell housing mounting flange. Does this sound like the torque converter and the trans drive shaft are properly, and fully, installed? What is considered the "hard" part of this assembly task? Getting the trans input shaft fully seated? Getting the torque converter (actually the oil pump drive tube) fully seated? If you, before attempting to install the trans onto the engine: 1. Insert and fully seat the trans input shaft, then 2. Insert torque coverter and make sure you have the 1/16" dimension mentioned above, and 3. Don't let the torque convertter slide back out during the transmission mounting process, WHAT IS SO DIFFICULT/TRICKY ABOUT THIS JOB? Am I missing something? Am I wrong in my thinking that I have the torque converter fully home? Thanks guys for your comments. I REALLY appreciate it!! Mike V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikevan10 Posted March 21, 2007 Author Share Posted March 21, 2007 Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that I am now convinced that the "seal pipe" that the Subaru parts guy suggested that I replace is INTERNAL. My assumption is that this guy remeberss that when they REBUILD a trans, they replace that pipe. I consider it not applicable to a trans swap. Mike V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikevan10 Posted March 22, 2007 Author Share Posted March 22, 2007 Guys! I am on the verge of starting this little project. If the rain holds off (I am forced to work outside in the driveway) I will start tomorrow night. Sorry to be a nag but I would REALLY like some feedback on my second to last post (above). Am I on the right track or am I fooling myself thinking I have it figured out? (I am talking about the assembly/installation process, NOT the question about the "seal pipe" which is a non-issue). Thanks again! Mike V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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