wtdash Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 '90 Legacy 4WD wagon. I bought the car w/136k and now has 139K. The 2 issues below haven't gotten any worse or better. I did do a complete flush of the tranny @ about 137K - no difference. Issue #1: When the car sits overnight or all day it does not move for 5 seconds or so after moving to D. It always eventually works and w/in 30 seconds it works fine. If I go home for lunch (3-4 hours of sitting), it's fine. There are no issues in normal driving - either in town or on the highway @ 75 - it shifts correctly. Fluid level is full. I found this online (http://consumerguideauto.howstuffworks.com/1990-to-1994-subaru-legacy-2.htm): Automatic transmission: If the transmission is slow to engage after being parked, the torque converter is draining down and a new cooler line with a check valve must be installed. (1990-91) I've called 2 Subaru shops and they've never heard of this issue and the parts department can't find the 'cooler line w/a check valve' in their parts books. Issue #2: When the car is warm or cold, and accelerating moderately a 'whirring' noice comes from the front. It occurs in all gears (or seems to) and occurs @ 2500-3000 RPM. It doesn't do it when the go pedal is floored or when lightly accelerating. I thought maybe it was a heat shield rattle, but ruled that out. The sound doesn't cause any problems w/accelerating - performance isn't affected. I did put the FWD fuse in for grins, and it's not as noticeable but still there. If you have any ideas feel free to enlighten me. I'm currently shopping for a 4EAT to have handy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 Doesn't sound entirely unlike the issue on the early phase II 4eat's with slow to engage in drive but then is fine after that. Something about internal seal shrinkage preventing the rapid buildup of pressure or something. Do you have that ATF filter thingy installed? I haven't heard of that 'check valve' but a cheap/easy way to put something like that in would be to get a perma-cool filter mount from SummitRacing (about $15) and put an oil filter that fits the mount on there and put it in series with the cooler (just make sure the oil filter has an anti-drain back valve; most do - though not the OEM Subaru oil filter I don't think). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 [...]Issue #1: When the car sits overnight or all day it does not move for 5 seconds or so after moving to D. It always eventually works and w/in 30 seconds it works fine.[...] Issue #2: When the car is warm or cold, and accelerating moderately a 'whirring' noice comes from the front. It occurs in all gears (or seems to) and occurs @ 2500-3000 RPM. It doesn't do it when the go pedal is floored or when lightly accelerating. [...] Torque converter drain-down could explain #1, failing front pump in trans might explain both #1 and #2. Other things also might be causing #2. Can you be more precise as to where the noise seems to be coming from? See:http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=73929 http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=74486 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 Torque converter drain-down could explain #1, failing front pump in trans might explain both #1 and #2. Other things also might be causing #2. Can you be more precise as to where the noise seems to be coming from? See:http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=73929 http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=74486 I can't pinpoint the sound as it only does it while driving (I can't get either step-son to ride under the hood:)) - it doesn't make the sound just revving the engine in Park or N. Maybe more towards the front left-driver side? I've tried to record the sound, but neither my cell phone nor digi-cam can pick it up, and I don't have anything else w/a mic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted May 15, 2007 Author Share Posted May 15, 2007 Doesn't sound entirely unlike the issue on the early phase II 4eat's with slow to engage in drive but then is fine after that. Something about internal seal shrinkage preventing the rapid buildup of pressure or something. Do you have that ATF filter thingy installed? I haven't heard of that 'check valve' but a cheap/easy way to put something like that in would be to get a perma-cool filter mount from SummitRacing (about $15) and put an oil filter that fits the mount on there and put it in series with the cooler (just make sure the oil filter has an anti-drain back valve; most do - though not the OEM Subaru oil filter I don't think). I looked last night for the filter, as SVXpert has 'em for sale, but there's not one on my car. I did call another local shop specializing in Subes and they had heard of the issue (#1) and it'd cost about $150 to fix - labor and parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVX_commuter Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 I had a 91 AWD Legacy wagon when it got to 230k miles it stsrted to stall when shifting from P to D. The torque converter was locked up for some reason. I gave the car to a friend and he drove it for another year. Now he's going to run it in a demolishon derby!!!! Well any way I have had good response to AT problem with Lucas AT additive. When I change the ATF I always drop the pan, pull the pipe, remove the filter, clean the filter, clean the magnet. I do this evry 30k miles on my AT cars. Seems to work well:) This way i get to see if there is anything in the filter and how much 'fuzz" is on the magnet. Take care, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 '90 Legacy 4WD wagon. I bought the car w/136k and now has 139K. The 2 issues below haven't gotten any worse or better. I did do a complete flush of the tranny @ about 137K - no difference. Issue #1: When the car sits overnight or all day it does not move for 5 seconds or so after moving to D. It always eventually works and w/in 30 seconds it works fine. If I go home for lunch (3-4 hours of sitting), it's fine. There are no issues in normal driving - either in town or on the highway @ 75 - it shifts correctly. Fluid level is full. I found this online (http://consumerguideauto.howstuffworks.com/1990-to-1994-subaru-legacy-2.htm): Automatic transmission: If the transmission is slow to engage after being parked, the torque converter is draining down and a new cooler line with a check valve must be installed. (1990-91) I've called 2 Subaru shops and they've never heard of this issue and the parts department can't find the 'cooler line w/a check valve' in their parts books. Issue #2: When the car is warm or cold, and accelerating moderately a 'whirring' noice comes from the front. It occurs in all gears (or seems to) and occurs @ 2500-3000 RPM. It doesn't do it when the go pedal is floored or when lightly accelerating. I thought maybe it was a heat shield rattle, but ruled that out. The sound doesn't cause any problems w/accelerating - performance isn't affected. I did put the FWD fuse in for grins, and it's not as noticeable but still there. If you have any ideas feel free to enlighten me. I'm currently shopping for a 4EAT to have handy. #2 is probably the front pump, The dealy is something you can live with you, but the whirring noise (the front pump) is not. Shopping for a tranny isnt a bad idea. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted May 24, 2007 Author Share Posted May 24, 2007 Update: Taken to 2 shops. First one, a dedicated tranny and muffler shop, said it would be $150+ to fix the check valve, and they couldn't find the noise, but it's not in the exhaust. They suggested i go to the shop below. 2nd one was a Subaru-only shop (they service and sell used Subes and have a super-nice '97 OB for sale ). They said not to bother fixing the check valve (I left it overnight for them to test cold) and the noise was "rocks stuck in the heat shield" (if so why didn't they remove the shields to verify???) or noise in transmission ("Thanks for sharing" :-\ ).They suggested I'll need a new/rebuilt tranny....I'm waiting for them to call back w/a quote. It's the 2nd time I've been there and neither time have I been too impressed w/their diagnosis. So, for now I'll keep looking for a used one and drive it 'til it starts to die. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 i wouldn't assume that whirring noise is transmission related. it could be, but at the age of this vehicle lots of bearings up front can whine. power steering pump, alternator (most likely), a/c, water pump, timing pulleys....all have bearings that can make noise. an easy test is to remove the drive belt and see if it goes away. you won't have a/c, power steering and your alternator won't be charging so you'll run straight off the batter. but if it's doing it consistently you'll know right away if it's related to any of those items. you could at least just try the alternator, i've heard plenty of whining alternators. i've seen a number of vehicles have the delay you speak of and not end up ever getting terrible worse or needing replaced. all that to say, you're doing what i would do. keep an eye out for a good deal on a trans and not assume the worst just yet. i would not get a rebuilt, not worth the cost in my oppinion of course. i wouldn't be too excited about that 97 legacy, they are nice...but they have the 2.5 HG issue engine, i got two sedans at my place right now (one with 83,000 miles)...getting new headgaskets. you're better off with your 2.2. don't run it hot and your 2.2 stands a better chance of running longer than that 97 legacy engine before loosing a headgasket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted May 30, 2007 Author Share Posted May 30, 2007 I pulled all the belts and the noise is still there, so still unknown. I did try to remove the heat shield under the front cat (as suggested by Subie shop), but the bolts are rusted/heat welded? so that won't be done anytime soon..no rattles coming from it regardless. I did put 800+ miles on the car over the weekend, w/out incident. Car ran perfect, shifted great going up/down 2 passes and got 28+ MPG @ 70 mph (OR) - 75 mph (WA). I'll drive it as is and keep an eye out for another tranny. Thanks all for the feedback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 I agree a rebuilt isnt worth the mega bucks. The majority of these trannies go for ever it seems, so a used one is a safe bet. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njdrsubaru Posted July 31, 2007 Share Posted July 31, 2007 i got the same problem going on... as far as i can remember the noise is due to a failing TC... it will last for awhile but eventually the noise will get louder and somehow tranny fluid will start to pour out of the TC... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtdash Posted July 31, 2007 Author Share Posted July 31, 2007 Replace tranny...see this thread...if interested. http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=77466&highlight=4eat+install Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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