porcupine73 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Hi. '00obw, auto trans, 119k miles: twice in the past few weeks I have had a no crank situation. Like hit the key to start and nothing, can hear the relay click in the dash. Have had this car for two years and it's never done this. The first time last week I was messing around hitting the starter with hard object, was ready to try jumping the starter solenoid with a lead when I remebered seeing on here about the 'neutral safety switch'. I was getting nervous about anyone seeing me in a Subaru with the hood up, so I moved the shifter just a little and poof she fired right up. phew. Get that hood back down. Then today when leaving work it did it again: no crank. I just touched the shifter and then it cranked. Should I choke it up and replace this neutral safety switch? Is this thing like on the AT itself, or is it under the shifter somewhere? Didn't see much info in the manuel but maybe I'm not lookin the right spot. Or does it just need adjustment? I confess I did not search first.... edit: also today when it wouldn't crank I noticed a faint smell of chicken, but it's probably not related.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Hopefully by just making an adjustment the switch will work. It should also start by moving the shifter in the neutral position. I think the switch is in the area near the shifter or it may be under the car near that same area. It may also be on the side of the tranny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Its on the transmission, its called an inhibitor switch i do belevie. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 14, 2007 Author Share Posted June 14, 2007 Great thanks for the info, I'll look into it, especially if it starts getting worse. I don't want this thing to leave me stranded. Though in an emergency from what I see if you have it in park with key in run and jumper that solenoid wire on the starter to +12V it should start? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 No need to do that, just put it in neutral. In every car with a NSS ive seen ( i was born in 61) for some reason if they wont start in park, they will always start in neutral. i think its because the contacts go through neutral and keep them clean, as opposed to park where it just pushes the crud up on the contact and not through the entire sweep. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 14, 2007 Author Share Posted June 14, 2007 Ah....ok thanks nipper I will try to remember that so I don't panic next time it happens... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RallyKeith Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Just to be sure, the next time it happens don't touch the shifter. Try repeatedly trying to start the car, like once or twice a second for about 5-10 seconds. If it all of the sudden kicks then it is an issue with the contacts in the starter. My 96 with 195k on the clock does this, and I'm pretty sure I still hear the click in the dash when it doesn't turn over. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 14, 2007 Author Share Posted June 14, 2007 OK will do. The first time it happened I did bump the key quite a few times. Actually it was kind of confusing that first time because my coolant temp was at 209 deg. F. and after I'd hit the key, but no starter action, the fans would turn on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 edit: also today when it wouldn't crank I noticed a faint smell of chicken, but it's probably not related.... Did you check for stray chickens under the hood? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 26, 2007 Author Share Posted June 26, 2007 OK it just did it again today when leaving work; hasn't done it for nearly two weeks. Turn key to start and just the click under the dash, no crank. So rather than touch the shifter, I turned the key to start once again, nothing. Then turned the key again and it started. So maybe it is the contacts then. I'll have to pull it out this weekend and see what it looks like in there. But that first time it did it a couple weeks ago I hit the key probably a dozen times and nothing. Then when I touched the shifter it started. Though actually I think I had just banged on the starter with an umbrella first so maybe it made the contacts contact. (This is when I realized a few items missing in my car emergency toolset). Maybe I should put an indicator light off the starter solenoid so I know if the solenoid is getting it's signal power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Maybe I should put an indicator light off the starter solenoid so I know if the solenoid is getting it's signal power. Thats not an unusual thing to do. Mechanics will do that sometimes. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biglittledog Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 You may have already done this...it's old testament stuff from when cars were simple: Turn on your headlights when it won't start and see if they dim when you turn the switch all the way. I had an inhibitor switch problem in my Nissan PU and the headlights would stay at full brightness so we knew it wasn't the starter motor. I hooked up a voltmeter (you could use a continuity tester) to the starter solenoid and found no power there and it was a safety switch circuit. Unfortunately this means you have to stop and test it while its failing...usually not convenient! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOMAD327 Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 Was there any more resolution to this problem? my 99 2.5 automatic did this for the first time this morning (for the wife). Turn key three times with a relay click but no crank, each time (not starter solenoid clicking, small relay clicking). Start normally on the fourth try, and run perfect for the rest of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 I haven't done anything about it yet. It only does it once every few weeks. I'm not yet sure if it's the starter contacts or the neutral/park switch. The last time it did it, I just kept bumping the key to run about 8 times and then it cranked. Next time it does it, I plan to be ready at the shifter to try moving it a little or getting it into neutral to see if that makes it crank immediately. I have noticed and don't know if it's related that once in a while every few weeks, I can't get it out of park. That solenoid jobby does not pull in for some reason. I have to mess around with the shifter a little to get it going. At that time it is not even energizing the solenoid. I know because I have the trim around the shift console off right now and I can push the solenoid manually to get it out of park but it has no pulling force at all. Most of the time the solenoid clicks just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 I[...]I have noticed and don't know if it's related that once in a while every few weeks, I can't get it out of park. That solenoid jobby does not pull in for some reason. I have to mess around with the shifter a little to get it going. At that time it is not even energizing the solenoid.[...] If your '00 is like the '99, the inhibitor switch does more than "neutral safety" and back-up light switching. In the '99, it also connects to transmission control, closing different contacts for each gear, as well as closing contacts when in "Park" that connect to the AT shift-lock control module. From the symptoms, it's possible the inhibitor switch is mispositioned, or there's some "slop" in the shifter and the switch isn't being thrown fully to park position, or the switch itself is worn/dirty. Another possibility, although less likely, is corroded connector terminals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 OK thanks I'll have to take a looksee and figure this out eventually or wait for it to get worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted August 25, 2007 Author Share Posted August 25, 2007 OK well every couple weeks or so this no crank happens. The last few times it happened, I moved the gear shifter and it seemed like when I started to try to pull it down out of park it started. However I also have had it crank if I just hold the key for like 8 seconds without touching anything. I finally got around to putting an indicator lamp off the starter solenoid connection. I tested it and when it cranks the indicator lamps illuminate. I'm assuming if it's no crank and I don't see the lamps come on, then it is not the starter contacts. If it's no crank and I do see the lamps come on, it is something in the starter, maybe the contacts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted August 25, 2007 Share Posted August 25, 2007 Ok so we confirmed your ignition switch is good. That leaves the (replaceable) starter contacts. They are cheap enough to just throw in the car and see if the problem goes away. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted September 8, 2007 Author Share Posted September 8, 2007 I finally got around to putting an indicator lamp off the starter solenoid connection. I tested it and when it cranks the indicator lamps illuminate. Okay so finally today it did the no crank again. The lamps I installed did not illuminate, so the issue must lie somewhere upstream of the starter. It started immediately when I put the shifter into neutral, so I suspect maybe the neutral/park switch as someone said might be dirty or out of adjustment? I was looking under there last week and it looks like an exhaust member would have to be dropped to really get access to the switch? I see a position adjustment screw with a white mark on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 Prbbly just as much work to change the contacts. This is a fairly common issue as the starter ages. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 If you can get at it to just adjust it slightly that will probably fix it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted September 8, 2007 Author Share Posted September 8, 2007 Ok maybe I will try the adjustment. I can see the slotted portion on the switch body with some white mark on it. It has been happening so infrequently it's taken a few months just to pinpoint the issue. I see this is a $100+ item. Now, I may have, um, in the past, soaked down this area with silicone spray and penetrating oil to free up the shifter linkage. Maybe the switch did not like it.... (When it won't crank, there is no power to the starter solenoid.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 (When it won't crank, there is no power to the starter solenoid.) The switch is in series with the wire circuit to the solenoid so a break in the connection means no action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted July 29, 2008 Author Share Posted July 29, 2008 I think it is time to try the adjustment. The vehicle just threw a P1101 yesteday. DTC P1101 - NEUTRAL POSITION SWITCH CIRCUIT HIGH INPUT DTC DETECTING CONDITION: Two consecutive driving cycles with fault TROUBLE SYMPTOM: Erroneous idling I note now that when putting it in neutral or drive, I have to push foward slightly on the shift lever, otherwise the P or N is not lit up on the dash. I"m guessing this is what upset the ECU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 I think it is time to try the adjustment. The vehicle just threw a P1101 yesteday.DTC P1101 - NEUTRAL POSITION SWITCH CIRCUIT HIGH INPUT DTC DETECTING CONDITION: Two consecutive driving cycles with fault TROUBLE SYMPTOM: Erroneous idling I note now that when putting it in neutral or drive, I have to push foward slightly on the shift lever, otherwise the P or N is not lit up on the dash. I"m guessing this is what upset the ECU. High input = short Replace the switch nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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