Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 I started working on patching some of the rot on Buck I found while doing the brake swap...patched the one spot no problem.the other one I thought would do better from repairing it from the inside...so I took out most of the interior on the one side of the car. While taking out the seat belt the lower attachment desides it no longer wanted to stay attached to the car:( ...then after getting everything out and out of the way..this is what I found: . This ...I dont think can be fixed with so sheet metal and pop rivets can it??? I dont have a welder and dont know how to weld..and my welding friend sold everything and closed his shop ( due to a motorcycle injury ).. Is it time to just give up trying to keep my Loyale...let alone keep him in as nice a shape as possible?? I knew Rocky was a rot heap when I got him....he is just turning out nicer then planned...But Buck has always been my baby...So am I allowed to cry right now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durania Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 :eek: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 It looks worse now..I started poking around and cleaning out the actual wheel well part...nothing ther..only thing holding it together was where the udercoating remained...everywhere it was wore off there is a complete hole through...looks like entire inner wheel well should be replaced....dont even want to pull the other side and see what that looks like. After poking and prodding: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 Other side..not much better..just that the seat belt mount didnt rip out of what was left of the inner wheel well..:-\ :( :( . I just want to curl up somewhere and cry right now....Well I guess Rocky is back into full service till I figure out what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reveeen Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 There is two kinds of "stuff" going on there: 1) structure 2) filler panels The structure keeps things in one piece and transmits energy in the structure, the filler panels keep the elements out. In the first picture the door frame (un-rusted) is the structure, the rusted panel beside it is filler. I can't see the strut mount structure, but what I can see (the part from the lower frame rail to the box section under the rear side window seems to be intact, picture 4) so in the lack of any more definate pictures I'm going to guess the structure is ok and just the filler is gone. Ok so the question becomes how to fill the holes in the filler panels. Sheet metal is flat and hard to mould into these shapes without heat (though I guess you could pound it with a hammer, and with some constructive cutting and fitting, you could pop rivet the pieces in there). What I do here with non structure repairs of this type is clean them up at least 4" around the hole(s) (or as much as you can to shiney metal) and use fiberglass cloth/resin to fill the holes. I do *think* you should verify that the strut mount is still able to carry the forces placed on it before filling, or wasting any time on filling the panels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Dang Connie, thats rough. Yeah, you can cry some:-\ Now.....stop crying and get to work. Reveen has it spot on. Clean it up as much as possible and learn glass, seeing how you wont be able to do any welding. Glass is easy, just a little messy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 I am getting ready to take a grinder to it..to clean it up..then use some aluminum sheeting I have and pop rivets..Only concern is on the pass side..where the seat belt would mount...I would need something stronger then aluminum to re-attach the mount too right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 I agree. Unless you have kids, the rear seatbelt is not too critical.(unless you got passengers) I'd clean it up as good as possible, and patch in new metal/glass(probably a combination of both would be good) I just parted out an 86 that was still driving fine and standing solid, and it had Waaaaayy... more rust than that. I would however adjust you're mindset to the fact that neither of you're Soobs are really fit to live forever. The damage has already been done. They don't call it cancerous rust for nothing. The salt gets into every crevice and will continue to rust the body out. Unless you could cut out every single bit of rust, thoughrouly wash all nooks and crannies of silt and road grime, repaint everything, and then never drive him in an east coast winter ever again. Barring that, just keep the structure solid and the elements out, and focus you're attention on keeping them running good. Cars are kinda like dogs. You grow to love them like family. They become friends and you love them. But never the less you will outlive you're dog, and no amount of love will change that. 99.9% of us will outlive our Subaru's. You just have to enjoy the time you have and keep him as healthy as you can for his time. Eventually you'll have to let him go. (or get a rust free body to transplant him into) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom63050 Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 You should also look into Rustseal, formerly called POR-15. It's a paint that you put directly onto rust. It bonds with it and stops it from spreading. Seems to dry nice and hard, like it strengthens the metal. http://www.kbs-coatings.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reveeen Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 No matter what method you choose to repair what you have it would be prudent to give it a heavy coat of paint post repair, and undercoat the s*** out of it. The seatbelt can be hung off of a piece of flat iorn securely fastened to the structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 fiberglass is SUPER EASY to work with... I have never gotten over my intimidation of sheetmetal/riveting repairs (its mostly a fear that I wont be able to shape the sheetmetal right) but fiberglass is a piece of cake. I replaced the rusted out floorboard in my Z with fiberglass, and to quote my old man "it is strong enough that (if you could) you could jump up and down on it." Cry, yes.. but cry by way of letting the demons out, not by way of doing the demons homage. This is not a RIP BUCKY, its just .. a lump Raise your hand if you have a dog who has developed a benign fatty tumor somewhere at some point, LONG BEFORE the dogs health went downhill! *raises hand* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzcon Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 You should also look into Rustseal, formerly called POR-15. It's a paint that you put directly onto rust. It bonds with it and stops it from spreading. Seems to dry nice and hard, like it strengthens the metal. www.kbs-coatings.com I'm with Tom63050, on the Rustseal. I use Rust converter. I got it at Autozone. It's sold under several different names, but it all does the same thing. No matter how much you grind on it, there will always be some rust, kinda like mold spores. After you finish, coat it with rust extender and it will stop it. You can spray it on or paint it on; on heavy areas like you have I would paint it on. If you pop rivet sheet metal, have rtv between it and whatever you're riveting to. It keeps the moisture out so the rust can't start up. We do this on aircraft repair; between the rust extender and the rtv, you can slow it down, if not completely stop it. The rust extender was developed, by the Navy, to seal their ships and became available to the public in the 80's. Good luck. ~Myles~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 If you feel that you cannot repair it on your own, this is the place to come for ideas. If its something you don't want to tackle, I have a final resort for you, and possibly the help of other board members as well as myself. I know that there are a LOT of EA82s out here on the opposite coast from you in awesome condition (look at my coupe for example). Since they are also cheap, it might be worth looking into a replacement for Bucky. Remember, Bucky will always live on in parts donated to a new EA82 or to other board members that, if knowing the story, will be more sentimental to them. I know how you feel Connie, my first Subaru ended up being 10x worse then Bucky. I got it after it had sat in a field with water in the crankcase for 8 years or so.It also didn't help that it was under a bunch of pine trees and had a crappy aftermarket sunroof that leaked the whole time. In theory, its not about giving up, its becoming more about safety, especially since the seatbelt mounts are getting pretty bad. Yes its hard, I've been there (my RX) but when worse comes to worse, its about your safety, not the vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 dont forget about my car. You know what my rust pictures look like, and that wasn't even an Expose, that was just what shows to everyone on the interstate! However, as I have said time and again, none of it is structural in the least. I don't name my cars, but they definitely have souls.. and when this soob finally goes away, its soul will be transplanted into the new one. Patch the Buckster up, and start imagining the day when you get to fly out to colorado on a cheapo ticket to pick up the new wagon that some forum member scoped out for you, and picked up for you... and drive it home. plane ticket, 150 if you arent lucky.. gas, 3-500, new soob, ~1000.. old soob for parts, (rear disc conversion :-p) and a frankenstein bucky?? priceless. That is my advice. Buck has several good years in him yet, and you will look great driving in him until his time comes, but the times come. Meanwhile, get out the grinder, the POR-15, and some 'glass, and make the Fibronic Subaru! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLoyale Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Aww man, That's the sadest thing i've seen!! :( :( :-\ I don't think you'll be able to fix him with some sheet metel and rivets!? I feel really bad about that now! Yeah Roland isent like that, The wheel walls are great i've just got the rear driver door that's the worst and the rear qurtor panles on the bottem so...... Thats really bad Connie. Does your hubbie have any idea's??? Later, Tom...................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Don't just bondo or fiberglass over that. You need patches welded in. Messing around with the wheel wells and the coilover mounting points is not a good thing to be doing. Remember, this is an EA82 wagon, so the entire weight of the car is supported by the wheel well. That is structural. And yes, the rear coilovers can punch up through and put the car in instant low rider. Connie, you should also take a screwdriver to the body right where the front of the rear subframe attaches, right at the back of the floor pans. This area: If you fix it, weld it. See if you can borrow or rent a mig welding setup. Mig welding has to be the most forgiving setup for beginners. If something goes wrong, you just let go of the trigger and everything stops. It's really easy to learn, and you can fix the car a lot better than you ever could with rivits and bondo. I used to use the same technique to fix my rust. Now I'm tearing those patches off as the rust spreads and welding in replacement patches. Make the leap to welding, you won't regret it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virrdog Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Where is BGD73 when you need him? I'll fill in: Pop riveted aluminum is stronger than steel something something... it might rip your frame apart something something.... certain colors of paint add more energy something something... I swear blue is stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 MorganM took the rear seat out of the PoopenVagon because the seatbelts tore out just like yours. there were huge holes in the floorboards all over the place, one of the rear tow points FELL off the thing. car had 150k miles on it when the speedo cable broke.....5 years ago or so. it's been a MN car it's entire existance. nothing major has failed yet. including 5 years of hard wheeling on the rocks of the iron range of northern MN, it's fair share of air time. with a BYB lift kit (framerails tweaked numerous times). now, that thing is a total POS (there's a reason I didn't charge it's current owner anything when I passed it on). my point, rust at that level will be virtually impossible to get rid of. BUT, I don't think for a second that it's grounds to give up entirely. certainly not reason to stop loving him any less. Just another sign that he's seen better days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waimaks Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Do you guys have like.... Any safety inspections overthere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phizinza Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I give you permission to cry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 25, 2007 Author Share Posted June 25, 2007 Do you guys have like.... Any safety inspections overthere? Some states do some dont..Pennsylvania ( where I am from and where I bought the car 4 and a half years ago) yes...Connecticut ( where I live now) doesnt. Old Buck passed PA inspections with flying colors..and he still passes emmissions with flying colors..Plus...from an inspectors point..that would be very hard to spot. I only found it when I was doing my brake swap and started poking at another spot....Plus the undercoating in the wheel well hid this all. The other side..from the outside looked fine..it wasnt until you pulled the interior out that you could see what the damage actually is. The structural parts are still good and very very solid.if I could roll Buck over and take a pic of the underside of him...y'all would be impressed especially in the front. Shame was..befor I went out to start this whole project I told Tommy that I think Buckys days are becoming numbered.But since he isnt a car guy he doesnt understand or even care( he still hasn't even gone out to look at what I found..just kinda shrugged when I told him and said So?)..as far as he is concerned drive it till it dies ...dont fix what aint broke... and will probably be happy when my Loyale goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 25, 2007 Author Share Posted June 25, 2007 Where is BGD73 when you need him? I'll fill in: Pop riveted aluminum is stronger than steel something something... it might rip your frame apart something something.... certain colors of paint add more energy something something... I swear blue is stronger. :lol: I was thinking the same thing:lol: :lol: ..I was actually wondering..by grinding all this out ..will my alt fail now????maybe when I do fix it and paint over..should I use yellow and add 10 hp? Will this throw the perfect balance of my 3 main bearings off?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosens Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 And yes, the rear coilovers can punch up through and put the car in instant low rider. We did it to the infamous touring wagon while ripping through Pine Barrens for the ?? 4th or 5th time. Just the top punched through a little,but enough to say bye bye to the car. My opinion,don't waste any more time or money on it.Use it.Deal with the moldy smell,obviously you have already on rainy days.Get a few of those fat paychecks from your new job and go 2.2 !!! Something pre-97,cheap and effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzcon Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Taking a screwdriver to the floorboards isn't a bad idea. When they 1st started car inspections in St. Louis, back in the late 60's, they didn't do body inspections, still don't as far as I know. My Aunts sister-in-law, rushed her kids out to her husbands fishing wagon, which had passed inspection 2 weeks before and headed out on I 55. No seatbelt laws, in fact no seat belts, in a lot of cars. Her 3 year old jumped off the back seat and fell thru the floorboard. He was killed instantly, by the undercarriage of the car. I was pretty young at the time, but I remember how it changed what we did in the rear seat of the car. From then on we sat quietly. Opt for safety and don't allow children in the car, unlesss you're sure the rear floorboards are safe. Bucky is one of my favorite cars:-\ I'm so sorry. I'll cry with you. ~ Connie ~ ~The Con of Buzzcon~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 gaaaahhh...connie, stop working on your cars and just wait for them to brake, see what happens? seems like trying to do preventative maintenance is a curse on yours....grr.... i've seen struts go through the rear as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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