davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 My 2.2 Outback has 180,000 miles. I got a 201 code for misfire #1 cylinder. Checked all the usual stuff. No good. Checked compression on #1 and I got zero. Valves do not appear to be sticking. Haven't noticed any problems with oil, coolant, or overheating. Any ideas? Thanks, Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 "checked all the usual things" Like what? Also did you check your timing belt, make sure all the timing marks are where they are supposed to be.. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Hi davcoz and welcome! Did you check any other cylinders and get compression? (Like is the gauge working properly, engine warm, throttle blocked wide open?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrturbo Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 I agree with porcupine. I almost did the same thing once and almost gave up on an engine like that once. Turned out to be a junk Actron gauge. Also make sure the little schrader valve is in the end of your hose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 It's unheard of to get zero compression from all 4 cylinders..... good point about the gauge. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Sorry to argue with the Nipper but my EJ25 mind you had zero in all four pots when this took out the some valves in both both cyl in both heads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Sorry to argue with the Nipper but my EJ25 mind you had zero in all four pots when this took out the some valves in both both cyl in both heads How are you arguing? My first post said "did you check your timing belt" nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 quoteth das Nipper "It's unheard of to get zero compression from all 4 cylinders." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 quoteth das Nipper"It's unheard of to get zero compression from all 4 cylinders." Well untill he responds with what he found, on a subaru it is, unless you loose the timing belt. Sheesh ill remember not to answer these things till i have my 3rd cup of coffee.... :-p nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 In support of your statement The EJ22 in question --> a 96 Is not interference therefore it is unlikely for it to loose comp in the entire lump even if the belt breaks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 "checked all the usual things" Like what? Also did you check your timing belt, make sure all the timing marks are where they are supposed to be.. nipper Let me tell you the whole story. This engine has always run incredably smooth. So smooth that a few times I actually didn't know it was running. I got a check engine light the other day. The engine started running rough and then cleared up. The next day I drove to work and it ran fine. It started running rough again and the check engine light would blink. It stopped blinking when it started running OK. I checked the OBD and found it was missing on #1. I changed plugs, wires, checked both sides of the coils, checked the injectors and all was fine. Checked compression on #1 with throttle wide open, 0 compression. Checked the compression on #3 and got 180 lbs. Removed the valve cover and all valves are working. Can the belt slip and screw up one cylinder and not another? Tonight I'm going to bring the piston to TDC on number one and put compressed air into the cylinder to see if I can find out where it's going. If it comes out the exhaust or air intake I'll replace the head. If it bubbles out the radiator it should be a HG. If it comes out the dip stick hole I'll be looking for a new engine. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 did you test the other cylinders and what did you get? testing one cylinder, one time isn't great information. typically it's good practice to test all the cylinders 2 or 3 times to get a solid read on what's going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 did you test the other cylinders and what did you get? testing one cylinder, one time isn't great information. typically it's good practice to test all the cylinders 2 or 3 times to get a solid read on what's going on. Checked number one and number three at least three times. 0 from #1 and 180 from number 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 sorry, i posted that while you were posting as well, so i didn't see your response before i hit "reply". what's the mileage? if #3 got you 180, it doesnt' sound like a timing belt. did you turn the engine over by hand with the valve cover removed? i would make sure it's all turning properly, timing belt, cam and valve train. and make sure the timing belt is properly tensioned. you can partially get at the timing belt by removing the side covers only, just 3 bolts or something like that. was the car ever overheated, run out of oil or leaking oil? a leaking injector will damage your cylinder walls and piston ring...but that is rare. another rare possibility is a timing tensioner is failing. i've seen them appear fine static but deflect and give under load....i doubt it though, that's a very rare case. just thinking of easy things to check before assuming bad engine mojo. the leak down test should tell you a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 i'm voting for the timing belt, which it seems he has not looked at yet. There is zero indication of a HG failure. HG's dont kill the car, they will still run, but will over heat. Pull the covers and inspect the timing belt, make sure all the marks lign up, then we can start looking at other things. BTW, when was the timing belt last changed? How many miles on the car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 sorry, i posted that while you were posting as well, so i didn't see your response before i hit "reply". what's the mileage? if #3 got you 180, it doesnt' sound like a timing belt. did you turn the engine over by hand with the valve cover removed? i would make sure it's all turning properly, timing belt, cam and valve train. and make sure the timing belt is properly tensioned. you can partially get at the timing belt by removing the side covers only, just 3 bolts or something like that. was the car ever overheated, run out of oil or leaking oil? a leaking injector will damage your cylinder walls and piston ring...but that is rare. another rare possibility is a timing tensioner is failing. i've seen them appear fine static but deflect and give under load....i doubt it though, that's a very rare case. just thinking of easy things to check before assuming bad engine mojo. the leak down test should tell you alot. The engine has 180,000 miles on it. The belt is not very old. I had my wife hit the starter with the cover off the right bank and looked at everything working. It all worked just like it is supposed to. The engine never overheated, never ran out of oil. In fact it has never gone over 5000 miles without an oil change. I'm hoping for something like a bad valve lash adjuster or something simple like that, but I'm afraid it's a hole in the piston and I'm not going to split the case. I'll replace the engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 be sure to check your timing marks and the tensioner. are the marks staying dead on? you still doing the leak down test? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 chek the timing ........ nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 be sure to check your timing marks and the tensioner. are the marks staying dead on? you still doing the leak down test? The car still runs. It just runs rough. The number one cylinder is completely dead. When I remove plug wires from the three other cylinders I get a noticable drop in RPMs. When I remove the plug wire from number one nothing happens. I will check the belt tonight. What I don't understand is how the belt can slip and not affect the other cylinders? Believe me I hope that's it!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Do you know anyone with a borescope that you could peek down through the plug hole? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uniberp Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Do you know anyone with a borescope that you could peek down through the plug hole? I've never seen inside the valve covers, but be sure you are seeing the valve itself actuate and not just the rocker or cam moving? It's hard (4me) to imagine absolute zero compression unless there is a stuck open valve, a holed piston or a busted off rod. Even with shattered rings you would get some pressure reading, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 Do you know anyone with a borescope that you could peek down through the plug hole? I've been trying to find one. So far no luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davcoz Posted June 28, 2007 Author Share Posted June 28, 2007 I've never seen inside the valve covers, but be sure you are seeing the valve itself actuate and not just the rocker or cam moving? It's hard (4me) to imagine absolute zero compression unless there is a stuck open valve, a holed piston or a busted off rod. Even with shattered rings you would get some pressure reading, I think. The valves are working. I saw the actual valve stem. Had to use a mirror to see the exhaust valves. I gently placed a long slender screwdriver on top of the piston and cranked the engine. The rod is intact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 It's hard (4me) to imagine absolute zero compression unless there is a stuck open valve, a holed piston or a busted off rod. Even with shattered rings you would get some pressure reading, I think. A valve can have a chunk burned out of it. See http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=59287&highlight=burnt+valve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 I think the exhaust valve is damaged, going by previous posts on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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