ron917 Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 My 17 year old son (18 in 2 months) needs a car. A local used car dealer has a '97 Impreza on the lot. Red 2 door coupe, 120 K miles, auto trans, 2.2l engine. I think it's the Brighton, didn't look to see if it has power windows, etc, but it has no spoiler. It's Sunday, so the dealer wasn't open, but I took a good look around. Body and interior look good, tires match and appear new. There's a fair amount of oil on the crossmember and oil pan, probably needs some new seals or gaskets. Asking price is $4295 and includes a 6 month/7500 mile warranty. Is this an interference engine or not? I know it changed sometime around 97, but not sure when. Unless the dealer can prove otherwise, I will assume it needs a timing belt, water pump, oil pump reseal, etc. Any specific problems to look for in this car? I know to check for torque bind, check the FWD fuse, CEL bulb test, etc, and all the other typical used car stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75subie Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 if he can drive stick, i've got a 97 impreza OBS wagon you can have for $1300. it has 58k. see my post in the MP for details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timintc Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 My 17 year old son (18 in 2 months) needs a car. A local used car dealer has a '97 Impreza on the lot. Red 2 door coupe, 120 K miles, auto trans, 2.2l engine. I think it's the Brighton, didn't look to see if it has power windows, etc, but it has no spoiler. It's Sunday, so the dealer wasn't open, but I took a good look around. Body and interior look good, tires match and appear new. There's a fair amount of oil on the crossmember and oil pan, probably needs some new seals or gaskets. Asking price is $4295 and includes a 6 month/7500 mile warranty. Is this an interference engine or not? I know it changed sometime around 97, but not sure when. Unless the dealer can prove otherwise, I will assume it needs a timing belt, water pump, oil pump reseal, etc. Any specific problems to look for in this car? I know to check for torque bind, check the FWD fuse, CEL bulb test, etc, and all the other typical used car stuff. I bought a 97 outback impreza for my wife this spring and she loves it, it has 116K on it, and the guys we bought it from, Subaru Guys, in Traverse City MI, did the head gaskets, timing belt and all the parts associated with that before we purchased it, and we paid 4500 for it. Id recommend doing a carfax on it and if everything checks out with that id say go for it, its not a great deal but its pretty much market value for that car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 $4295 is a bit high for that mileage. I bought my wife's '97 model L (one notch up from the Brighton which is the base model--if it has window cranks it is a Brighton) 1-1/2 years ago with 120K miles on it for $3995 with no warranty. It had some minor issues but nothing major until recently (transmission doesn't like to rallycross anymore ). I don't think you can go wrong with Jon's car. The Impreza is just too much fun to drive and pretty bulletproof. I think my wife's car's problems stemmed from poor maintenance on the part of the previous owner(s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manarius Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 Interference: Yes. Is it worth that much? No. 2000-2500 at best. It's a 10 year old car with 100+k on it. It may also be the Brighton and that means it needs to have a low price. They're good cars, just check for the usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 Sorry, I didn't answer your other question. Yes, the '97 model year was the beginning of the interference engine. I don't remember the timing belt interval (used to be 60K, went to 105K I believe). If there are no records of the timing belt having been done in the last 30K, I would play it safe and do it soon (certainly before the short warranty expires). Also, make sure the warranty would cover the engine repairs if the timing belt broke in that time frame. In either event, have the water pump replaced with the timing belt since it likely won't last until the next belt replacement and the labor for a water pump is almost the same as the timing belt replacement. I personally don't like automatic transmissions, but if it's a manual gearbox expect the clutch to need replacement in the next 50K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 I'm taking a survey of '97 Imprezas. When you look at the car, can you check the VIN plate (drivers side inner fender) and look at the transmission number (if it's a manual only....not interested in automatics). If the tranny number is not TY752VA5AA would you copy it down for me and send me a PM? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 A brighton model in 97 would still have the ej18 under the hood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 A brighton model in 97 would still have the ej18 under the hood.Boy that's a surprise since the EJ22 showed up in most Imprezas in '96 maybe earlier. Certainly something to check for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 The lack of power, and me not knowing that an ej22 would swap right in was the sole reason I didn't buy a 97 brighton back in '00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 EJ18's get a bum rap. Only real difference is you need to shift more often. I rallycrossed a '94 Impreza last year and was beating most of the EJ22 cars on a regular basis. Out of 26, I finished 5th for the season. Only reason I didn't finish higher is my inexperience and not the EJ18. This year in my '97, I'm running fourth for the season. Not much of a difference. Comparing the EJ18 to the EJ22 in my '97 is that the EJ18 revved more freely and needed 4th gear up the longest, steepest hills on the freeway rather than 5th. Don't make the mistake of putting 15" or 16" tires on an EJ18 (it'll become a "stone"); leave the 14" tires on it and it'll be fine. Besides, an EJ18 in the hands of a teenager probably makes a lot more sense. The other difference between the two engines is the EJ18 gets significantly better gas mileage. In any event, check out the engine; if it is an EJ18 it's all the more reason to negotiate a significantly lower price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted July 16, 2007 Author Share Posted July 16, 2007 Wow, lots of good responses! Thanks everyone! 75Subie, I found your post over the in Market Place. My son doesn't drive a stick (yet), but your price is tempting. Regarding the 2.2 vs 1.8 discussion, the car has a 2.2 sticker on the back of it. cars101.com says that the 2.2 was standard with the auto trans, even on the Brighton. I agree that the dealer's asking price is high. Edmunds True Market Value is $3020. I'm going to try to get a test drive and thorough inspection today. We'll see where it goes from there. Thanks again, everyone! This forum is the best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 Good luck with whatever you purchase. However, a bit of advice from someone who's taught three sons to drive: Teach him to drive a stick! You (and he) will be happier for it. He'll be able to drive any car in the future, stick or not. Gas mileage is about 20% better. More control with a stick than automatic, especially on "challenging" surfaces like snow or ice. And best of all.....It's more fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75subie Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 i have to agree with Ed. its nice knowing that if i ever have any problems with my car, i can just barrow my father's or sisters as they both drive sticks, and nothing else. its alot easier learning when you are new to driving because most people who have driven auto their whole life are too lazy or not compelled to learn how to drive a MT. it really adds to the driving experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 Teach him to drive a stick! You (and he) will be happier for it. And best of all.....It's more fun! +1 to that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted July 17, 2007 Author Share Posted July 17, 2007 Went to check out and test drive the red Impreza yesterday afternoon. We're going to pass on this one, it's got some issues. On the good side: - body and interior are in good shape - the engine is smooth and quiet - tranny shifts nicely - AWD works properly - suspension is good - fluids are all fresh - tires are new and matching - clean Carfax report On the bad side (in order of least to most concern): - driver's headlight bulb is missing, the socket is melted, not a big deal, this is common - the gas guage seems to be inoperative - oil leak, and/or power steering leak, lots of oil on the crossmember, on top of the engine near the PS pump, drips off the oil pan, not sure which fluid it was - CEL is on, could be simple, could be a major problem, didn't ask to get the code read - there is an ugly grinding and vibration from the rear end in tight turns That last one is the deal killer. Not clear if torque bind is involved. It will do tight circles at idle with no hopping or braking effect, but there is a periodic GRONK! GRONK! noise and vibration. It was also evident when turning a tight corner, first noticed when pulling out of the dealer's lot. Whatever it is, it sounds expensive. 75Subie, my wife said "no" to your car when she read about the previous crash damage. She's convinced that previously wrecked cars will never be safe. Our search continues. Thanks to all who have provided input. BTW, a manual tranny is not out of the question. We don't currently have a manual tranny car, so my son hasn't learned to drive stick yet. If we find a good car with a manual, he'll learn soon enough. He has no trouble with the clutch on the lawn tractor, so I doubt it will be a problem in a car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinsUBARU Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 A brighton model in 97 would still have the ej18 under the hood. Yep And Ron, wouldn't that warranty cover the issues you report? By the way, an innacurate Impreza gas gauge is very common. I used to refuel my 95 every 320 miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75subie Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 75Subie, my wife said "no" to your car when she read about the previous crash damage. She's convinced that previously wrecked cars will never be safe. huh, i guess i better stop driving it immediatly. it must be a death trap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted July 18, 2007 Author Share Posted July 18, 2007 The engine in the car I looked at says EJ22 on the block casting. It's a 97 Brighton automatic, manual windows, locks, etc, and no spoiler. cars101.com says that the '97 Brighton auto came with the EJ22 standard. The '97 Brighton manual got the EJ18. And Ron, wouldn't that warranty cover the issues you report? By the way, an innacurate Impreza gas gauge is very common. I used to refuel my 95 every 320 miles. I would think that the warranty would cover the issues. But, the story I got from the guy was that he was the owner's brother, watching the store while the owner was on vacation, and the owner would take care of all that stuff under the warranty when he got back. Sorry, no, I'll take a pass on this one. If I don't find anything else, I'll check back when I can talk to the owner directly, and make sure everything is fixed BEFORE I buy it. There are plenty of other cars out there, and I'm in no hurry. huh, i guess i better stop driving it immediatly. it must be a death trap! Women can be illogical, espcially concerning thier children. After 22 years of marriage, I've learned that in many cases it's best just to say "Yes, dear!" and move on. The old saying is true: "If Mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 Yep And Ron, wouldn't that warranty cover the issues you report? By the way, an innacurate Impreza gas gauge is very common. I used to refuel my 95 every 320 miles. If the dealer refused to deal with those issues before putting the car up for sale, he's either clueless or has very little intention of following up within the terms of the warranty. Definitely not worth the hassle. There are lots of Imprezas out there with more potential and less price. It's just a matter of biding one's time until the right car comes along. We "looked" actively for over 6 months before finding my wife's current daily driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron917 Posted July 18, 2007 Author Share Posted July 18, 2007 That's my feeling exactly, edrach. It took quite a while to find my '99 Outback. There are billions Subarus around here (only a slight exageration). Trouble is, most of the used ones are only a couple years old (lease returns), and therefore expensive - might as well buy new, but not for a kid's first car. Most of the cheap ones are pretty well used up or trashed in some way. Except for leases, it seems that most people hold on to Subies until they're scrap. Searches on craigslist, etc, bring up a fair number of candidates. Unfortunately, most are more than an hour away. I just have to find the time to go look at those, or wait for something to show up nearby. Worst case, I give the kid my '99 Outback and buy a new one for myself. But I really like not having a car payment, and my current Outback meets my needs perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 My three guys all learned to drive on "beaters" and occasionally on the "family" car for special occasions. They did okay, but I couldn't see it in me to have them learn on the "family" car. Anyway, back to our search. I looked on the USMB, nasioc, Craigslist, and autotrader searching for a 5 speed, AWD, Impreza wagon for my wife. Even planned a "getaway" weekend with her in Portland (190 miles one way) with three leads for Imprezas while we were there. First two were gone minutes before we got there; the third one was junk (IMHO) on a dealer lot---sort of like the one you recently saw; too much wrong with it and too high a price. Anyway, we enjoyed the weekend and kept looking. Finally, after about six months of looking I pulled up Autotrader (my search radius was 300 miles!) one Sunday evening and found a '97 with 118K on it for $3995. The dealer was only 4 miles from our house! I called the next morning at 8:30 and got the owner/salesman (small, independent car lot) who told me the car was still there and he opens at 10AM. I was there at 9:45. It looked pretty decent; just a cracked tail-light lens on one side. I took it for a ride to where my wife looked at it. She asked me what I thought; I didn't find anything major wrong and she liked the color; she didn't need to drive it if I liked it. I went back to the carlot, gave the man a small deposit, took all the information on the car and headed for the credit union. Came back at 2PM, signed all the papers, and my wife and I picked it up at four after she got off from work. And the rest is history. You'll find what you want soon enough. They are scarce but they are out there. Best of luck in your search and I hope it won't be a long one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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