86BRATMAN Posted August 1, 2007 Share Posted August 1, 2007 I'm looking at one. Rust free body, I mean absolutely rust free. Like west coast rust free. Did I mention it was rust free.... Anyways, its cheap, $400 with a parts car. Converted to coilover suspension, light blue(like my hatch). Alloy wheels, slight wear on the driver side seat. Push button 4wd 5spd, spider intake(yeah I know its stock in that year). Straight body with exception of a dent on the passengers side fender. Other than that there is one somewhat major problem. No pictures because i'm an idiot and forgot my damned camera... The problem lies with its running conditon. It only runs on 2 cyls reports the owner. I looked at it today, the timing belts are intact. And everything under the hood seems in order, for what I know about these cars anyways. My time looking about it was cut short by a rain storm. I'm getting the car, no question. Whenever I can manage to get my friend with the trailor free enought to drive over an hour each way on 1.5 lane roads to get to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted August 1, 2007 Share Posted August 1, 2007 Pics man, pics! Sounds just like my red XT. I would look at the disty/cap/rotor if the belts are ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 1, 2007 Author Share Posted August 1, 2007 I wish it looked as good as your red one. Your car is absolutely amazing. This one has paint fade on the mirrors and door handles. But my jaw literally dropped when I saw what this old fella called a "decent shape" car. By the time I realized I 'd forgot my camera I was took far out into the middle of nowhere from my house to get back, and still get there with daylight to spare. That'll teach me... Once I get back(maybe a week or so) with the trailer I'll get some pics. I'll check the cap and button. First thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 1, 2007 Share Posted August 1, 2007 try the thumb-on-the-sparkplug-hole compression test, too... and bring section of tubing that you can jam one end into your ear, and fish the other end around the intake gaskets, listening for a leak on the non running side. Wild guess.. driver side cylinders are running, but not the passenger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 1, 2007 Author Share Posted August 1, 2007 The owner says the timing belts are fine. A quicky inspection showed they are both there, each side had belt covers removed with the center section still there. I couldn't verify if it was in correct time while at his house due to negotiation of price, not wanting to show incredible interest, and rain. The way he talked, I was honestly afraid if I figured out what was wrong while he was there that he wouldn't want to sell it. He quite literally owns more subaru's than was in the picture of Connie's cookout. All but 4 were ej series, so there is the possiblilty of him not knowing how to correctly time an ea82 motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john in KY Posted August 1, 2007 Share Posted August 1, 2007 . He quite literally owns more subaru's than was in the picture of Connie's cookout. All but 4 were ej series, so there is the possiblilty of him not knowing how to correctly time an ea82 motor. Nice notion but I somehow really doubt that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 1, 2007 Author Share Posted August 1, 2007 A man can dream can't he:grin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 Bump to the top... Pictures will be posted tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 which two cylinders were firing and which two were dead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 did you get it? still contemplating? i'd start by seeing which two clyinders aren't "working", check compression. the headgaskets on these aren't all that hard to do really and can easily be done with the engine in the vehicle. dealing with rusty exhaust bolts is the most annoying part. air tools makes it super nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 We went and got it yesterday evening. Not uploaded any pics yet. But it would seem that its running down on one cyl. not two, I could be wrong and haven't messed with it a whole lot. But the old guy I bought it from had messed with the bloody wiring so much because he thought it was a fuel injector problem that I have no idea which plug goes to which injector. And I did notice that at least one of the plug wires is junk. But I need to get a good battery in the car before I can do a whole lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 I jumped it off and ran it for about the last 25 minutes, no overheating, no coolant level drop in the radiator. Timing is correct. Getting spark to all cyls. Injectors 1 and 2 are not firing. I'm waiting on getting my multimeter from dad's house(if its still there, haven't used it in years). But the brake tubing test confirms neither of the front ones are clicking. But, both the rears, 3 and 4, are clicking and the car is running off them. Car has set for a while, maybe they are stuck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Check wiring at terminals 51 and 52 (both W/Lt.Blue wire). Those wires actually tie into one, and then split again before the main engine harness. the fact that it is both of the rear cylinders indicates it must be tied to the grounding action of the ECU through terminals 51 and 52 Read the codes, and go from there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 Its the rear cyls that are opperating, what terminals do I check for the front? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 it's rare for a soob to have injector issues like that, sounds like he has a good starting point for you. i do recall some very interesting posts on fuel injector testing, but never having done it i can't recall the details. i wonder if an inductive timing light could sense the wiring enough to see if the injectors are getting a signal or not? i know those signals are hard to see, don't think you can do it with a basic multimeter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 I think I have a pair of ea81t injectors, would plugging them in and "listening" tell if they are getting signal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 should be able to look at the electrical plugs and see. fuel will spray everywhere of course if you do it out of the car. could probably swap injectors that are on there. swap 1 with 3 and 2 with 4. be ironic that both are doing the same thing though, i'd follow GLOYALE's suggestions if they both have a common ground or relay or something. that would make more sense and is more probable statistically speaking (excuse the dork in me). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 Went and pulled the codes... Why am I not surpirsed... Code 14 Fuel Injector No. 1 and 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Its the rear cyls that are opperating, what terminals do I check for the front? Cyl 1+2 are on terminals 49 and 50. White wires. Both in the bottom corner of the connector that has 3 rows(all the others have 2 rows) What I would do is disconnect both of those injectors, Then disconnect the ECU plug. Using a long test lead measure continuity end to end from term 49,50 the the ends of those wires at the injector. Make sure there is zero or very near zero resistance. If there is a break in the circuit this will tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 Do you have a link or a picture for the ecu pinout. I don't have the fsm just yet(waiting on a reply from svxpert). And the handed down chiltons manual is well, useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 here you go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I don't really know the MPFI system on the soobs so well, but this kind of problem is sort of universal on fuel injected vehicles, and I know that alot of what I know about other cars is relevant through reading other peoples experiences. I just haven't done any work myself, so after writing most of this I came back up to the top and put in the little disclaimer to test for whole harness continuity, you could also unplug both ends of the harness, use a paperclip to short between the two connectors in question on one side, then check for continuity between those connectors on the other side. If you get good continuity, then you know without finding or making a long lead wire that your wires are good; if not, then you need to get a long lead wire and check each side independently. There should be a resistance level check to run on the injector as an electrical check; there should also be a dropping resistor somewhere that controls the positive power supply to all four injectors. The way the injectors operate is thus: the system maintains a constant fuel pressure versus the intake manifold pressure via the pressure regulator. The injector (I believe) a 5 volt solenoid that opens a valve to spray fuel pressure out through the nozzle and into the airstream. The ECU switches the ground to the injector; the 5VDC comes from the dropping resistor. You should be able to test for DC voltage on the injector plugs that ARE working, and get pulses of some DC voltage (I may be wrong on the 5 volts figure, but its usually lower than twelve.) Some multimeters wont pick this up; a timing light may, but there is a specific type of light you should plug in. If anyone knows for certain what the operating voltage of the injectors is, then a bulb of that voltage could be found (low watts) to use as a test light.... I am thinking a flashlight bulb ought to do. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 Thank Daeron... You have me scratching my head going, huh? Lol, I get the basic principal of how it operates, just I have no experiance whatsoever of troubleshooting problems in the fuel injection department. I tested continuity through the engine harness and all wires checked out. For the car harness(which BTW WTF were they thinking putting the ecu in the trunk???) I do believe I've got an issue with the ground wires from the ecu to the injectors. I ran out of light before I could recheck all my findings. But pins 60 and 61 both peg the ohm meter. I didn't know which one controlled which injectors so I checked them both. I am also aware that my meter is very simple in function and quite possibly older than me. So I may try to borrow a new one from my friend at advance tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 But pins 60 and 61 both peg the ohm meter. I didn't know which one controlled which injectors so I checked them both. I am also aware that my meter is very simple in function and quite possibly older than me. So I may try to borrow a new one from my friend at advance tomorrow. Pins 60 and 61 are should be grounded. They are just grounds for that circuit in the ECU, but they don't actuially provide the ground to the injector. Pins 49,50,51,and 52, are the ones that ground the injectors. Here is another Diagrahm , of just the FI wires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 Since 60 and 61 are supposed to be grounded, and 49 and 50 checked out, or seemed to with the meter I have. Is there a chance that part of the resistor has gone bad? If so where is it for me to check? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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