LuvScooby Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 Hey everyone! I'm getting ready to start back on an older project that had me stumped a while back. I bought an 87 1/2 XT turbo gl10.(Not running) The turbo engine and turbo extras have been removed and replaced with a N/A ea82. I don't have any idea who did this, or how many years ago it was done. I have done all of the tune-up items on the car, and set the timing by the marks, and replaced the fuel pump. The car still will not even try to run. I have spark, and I have fuel at the injectors, but I do not thing the injectors are being told to pulse. I do not know if the car has ever run since the swap was done. I just wondered if there was anyway I could tell if the ecu was the origional turbo ecu. Does anyone know how to identify this? This car has a near perfect body, nice interior, and is loaded with options, and I would love to be able to put it back on the road. It barely has 100k on the body...its a shame for it just to sit there as it has for at least 5 years now. Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated. I'd like to put a 2.2 in it, but surely that would be a huge undertaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 yep i did the exact same thing. 87.5 XT Turbo to non-turbo...that's called castrating a unicorn so i'm told. i do not have it running yet, but i think it was only because i fried the ECU by installing battery cables backwards. i grounded the fuel pump and it ran fine. i have to go but i'll look into this more and i have lists of part numbers for ECU's in this computer i can post later. and i'll be getting mine up and running soon. check for spark, check for the fuel pump and check for codes at the ECU. turn the key on (don't try to start it, just key on) and you should hear the fuel pump prime. or put it in diagnostic mode (i think plug the green connectors in from memory) and the fuel pump should prime every second. check this stuff and let us know. is the gas old and bad? if it's over 6 months to a year then it's suspect. gotta split...more later, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuvScooby Posted September 19, 2007 Author Share Posted September 19, 2007 Hey Gary. Yep, the pump cycles. It builds lots of pressure, but never seems to pass thru the injectors. I never smell gas. There is definately bad gas in the tank, but I have no idea how much...it smells very old, but I can't even get it to hit on starting fluid. I just don't know if the ecu was ever swapped or not, or if the harnesses are correct. I have spark, and fuel at the injectors. I read the codes, but its been several months back, and I will have to recheck them. I remember that there were a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 i recall some minor wiring differences across years, i guess you have no idea what the replacement motor came out of? i'll have to check my notes...i was getting really confused between distributor, ECU and wiring changes from 86-87-87+.....so it's hard to remmeber details. but mine fired up without much issues, i had to hardwire the fuel pump. so i think you may have a non-swap issue. i'd definitely want to address that bad gas to start with. have you check compresssion and for spark? no check engine lights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j2coe Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 did you try a noid light to test and see if the injectors are getting a signal? or you can just pull one and see if they are spraying but thats the dangerous explosive way to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 this is your starting point: I read the codes, but its been several months back, and I will have to recheck them. I remember that there were a few. you need to tell us those codes. i also wonder if there's a way to verify you have an 87.5+ engine instead of an 87 or earlier EA82. that could be problematic. or ordered FSM's for 87 and 88 models to see the wiring differences, if i remember i'll try to look at them soon, i don't have them with me but i do recall small differences. but thats the dangerous explosive way to do it. ssshhhhhh!!!! be quiet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 the 87.5 Turbo ECU part number ends with 290 the 87.5 non Turbo ECU part number ends with 320 but like i said, start with the check engine lights and codes you said it had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petersubaru Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 wouldn't you also have to change out the turbo fuel injectors to non/turbo F/injectors..much like the difference between the N/A MPFI and turbo MPFI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I may be completly off but doesnt the turbo motor have lower compression than an N/A motor? So if you were to take the turbo off you would be left with a complete dog of a motor..unless you swapped in N/A pistons then you would just have an N/A motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I may be completly off but doesnt the turbo motor have lower compression than an N/A motor? So if you were to take the turbo off you would be left with a complete dog of a motor..unless you swapped in N/A pistons then you would just have an N/A motor. The turbo engine and turbo extras have been removed and replaced with a N/A ea82. :-p but seriously... Get a friend to turn the key, while you sit under the hood with a large screwdriver. Take the handle of the screwdriver and put it against one ear, and then put the tip of the screwdriver against the base of one of the injectors. Be careful not to let the screwdriver bang your eardrum out, but get your assistant to crank the engine while you listen; you should hear a very audible "click" if the injectors are opening, if not then you likely have a problem with wiring, or possibly the dropping resistor. I know nothing about the MPFI setup on the soobies.. so I cannot help you trace the problem further than that, BUT it should be enough for you to figure whether they are firing or not. I would add a healthy dose of sea foam to a fresh tank of gas, and change the fuel filter as a pre-emptive measure, since you may have pushed some sludge into it. Hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuvScooby Posted September 20, 2007 Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 I'm pretty positive this is a post 87 engine. It does have the spider intake, and of course the multiport heads. There are no provisions for a turbo on the current engine, and the exhaust has been properly swapped to a N/A y-pipe. My fuel pump comes on when I turn the key, and I have removed the post filter fuel line and pumped gas from it when the turning the key, so I think I'm good there. Is there a way to siphon the gas from the filler neck, or is there some sort of baffle that would prevent me from doing so? I was unable to get a hose in far enough to get any gas out. I have verified that I have spark...for sure. I'm fairly positive I have compression, but would not swear to it...had a little trouble getting my compression gauge fittings to seat properly. I have no clue if the injectors are the right ones or not. I cannot remember the codes...I will try to check this weekend. The engine turns over really well...if that means anything. I've learned a great deal from the 88 that I have, and I will try to double check all of the basics on the 87 now. Maybe I made a mistake somewhere. I suspect ecu/injector issues. Stay tuned!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 i can't stress enough how important those codes are before we start guessing and mentioning the dozens of possibilities out there. i don't know, but i'm betting the entire engine was swapped...intake manifold and all (that's what i did), in which case it has an entire non-turbo set up including the fuel injectors. so i would guess they're not a problem, but not seeing it i can't promise that. I may be completly off but doesnt the turbo motor have lower compression than an N/A motor? So if you were to take the turbo off . yes, you are completely off - the entire engine has been swapped so it's just like any other non turbo EA82 on the road today. some would consider it a dog, but it's not what you're suggesting...with turbo pistons still in it. at least that's what he's saying, i can't see the motor myself of course i'm assuming the information posted is accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuvScooby Posted September 20, 2007 Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 I'm gonna try to get the codes tomorrow!! I'm gonna go so far as to say that, yes, someone did a full swap on this one. The drivetrain now looks just like the one in my 88DL. There is no mechanical turbo stuff left in the engine compartment...at least nothing major. There is a relay or solenoid that ticks like crazy sometimes...its on the passenger side inner fender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 yes, you are completely off - the entire engine has been swapped so it's just like any other non turbo EA82 on the road today. some would consider it a dog, but it's not what you're suggesting...with turbo pistons still in it. at least that's what he's saying, i can't see the motor myself of course i'm assuming the information posted is accurate. Sorry. Guess thats what i get for scanning instead of reading. :-\ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 that clicking relay, can you take a picture of it? there are some fan and a/c relays over there. but i know mine had some turbo related items over there, i think i removed them all. i may actually get to work on mine some tomorrow and may check it out. Sorry. Guess thats what i get for scanning instead of reading. :-\ sorry for what? trying to help and doing the same thing we've all done!?!? silly rabbit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j2coe Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 not to be hijacking here since I will post this if I can figure out if it was actually what was done but, in theory what happens if a turbo was put on a non turbo MPFI? since the turbo engine with out the turbo ( from what I am reading here) lose power from the low compression will a normal comp ratio motor be way over compression with a turbo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 will a normal comp ratio motor be way over compression with a turbo? i think you started another thread right? and i thikn i replied to it. depends what boost you're running. if it's low boost you'd be okay, but there are still things to consider for it to be reliable and last. but yes, it would be very easy to run it too high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j2coe Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 we should compair ECU #, this one is an 87 DL and now looks like a non turbo that had a turbo swapped in. So it most likely has an ECU that isn't set up for turbo I'm going to compair it to my other turbo GL-10 and RX, but it would be interesting to see what your XT has if it was originally a turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 EA82 ECU's change part numbers like diapers, his turbo ECU definitely will not be the same as your non-turbo ECU. i posted part numbers for 1987.5 XT ECU's on the first page of this thread if that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j2coe Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I'd read bits and pieces of the thread, but hadn't seen the numbers since they weren't complete. I'll have a look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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