Blown head gasket(s) Updated w/ Road Test

[Heironymous Josch]

UPDATE:

 

So, during the late hours of the night, I finished the head job on my 83 GL Sedan. In retrospect, it was pretty easy, although it didn't seem that way during. The car had its first grueling road test today - the daily life of an outside salesman, which usually includes 100 miles of about town driving. I put it through its paces with a mixture of stop and go, in-city & highway driving. I've made sure to check the fluid levels throughout the day. Everything is holding steady: oil, ATF & Coolant. The tally of work includes a new thermostat, water pump, radiator and head/intake/exhaust/valve cover gaskets. I have a few questions, though, for you gurus and subie lovers alike:

 

1. Is the second line on the temp gauge (slightly less than halfway) the marker for normal operating temperature? My needle stays glued just slightly above that line but still below halfway up the gauge. It varies slightly but not much at all and never gets at or below that second line. Is this okay or am I running a tad hot?

 

2. Is it typical for the oil pressure to bottom out at idle. At long lights, the OP, drops way down. Obviously, pressure is lost at lower rpm's but the needle dips down just above the red. Is this normal?

 

3. Would it be a good idea to recheck the valve adjustment? I check the valves on my SOHC Honda motorcycle every 3 months or so. Having had the heads machined, installed new gaskets and adjusted the valves about 100 miles ago is it a good idea to check it again?

 

4. Is there anything else I should keep an eye on for the next several hundred or few thousand miles?

 

It's going to be a long time before I can drive without looking down at the temp gauge every 10 seconds but I'm sure my faith will build with every mile of service this little beater gives me. Thank you, everyone, for your help!

 

Josh

 

ORIGINAL POST:

 

DAMN IT!!! Note to self: never take a person on their word in a business deal. I bought an 83 GL FWD AT w/ a tantalizingly low odometer reading of 109k. Got it dirt cheap because it needed a radiator. "Yeah, I never rode it hard or had any problems with it overheating. One day I just started losing fluid from the radiator." So, after zero success sourcing a replacement radiator (you try finding a rad with a 25" x 13 3/4" core & AT in/out for these cars, doesn't exist) I choked it up and paid close to what I did for the car to have the radiator repaired and pressure tested. This was the first muttering of the term, "pot committed." Tested well, installed the unit, it ran well but was still losing coolant from somewhere. The green goo was coming out of the overflow, so I figured maybe the cap was bad. One special order at the parts store, $10 and a week later the cap was installed. No change. While the rad cap was on order, I found a CV axle at a junkyard and fit it with new boots. I decided to pay to have it installed because I was feeling lazy and figured they could peek at the cooling system while they were at it.

 

With the car off and the system pressurized, it was holding pretty well, losing about 2 psi over 5 minutes, not enough to cause an overheat. Under a vacuum, all went to hell. Rapid loss of vacuum pressure from 25 psi to 0 in about 6 seconds. Not a good sign. So now, we topped off the radiator with coolant, pressured the system and started the car. Billows of white smoke out the tailpipe. Best case scenario - blown head gasket(s). Worst case scenario - warped/cracked head(s). Questions for the gurus:

 

1. Given it's a solid EA-81 w/ 109k miles, is it worth fixing? I have $700 in the car now.

 

2. Given the "pot committed" mentality, I'd be willing to dump another $700 into it for the fix. Do you think it's realistic that I'd find a mechanic willing to do it for that?

 

3. I've never replaced a head gasket on a car but have rebuilt the top-ends of several SOHC Honda motorcycle engines. I'm by no means a professional but am an accomplished amateur mechanic. Is this a job I can do myself?

 

4. Being a "boxer" design, can the heads be removed without pulling the motor?

 

5. Is there anyway to test which head the problem is coming from? It may be both but If there's a test and it's only one, I can save some time and money. I was thinking about removing the exhaust header and repeating the pressurized running test to see which cylinder the white smoke comes from. Would this work?

 

6. If I tackled this on my own, what's the best manual to work with?

 

Any input would be awesome guys. I'm a tight spot. I can afford $700 or so to repair the car if I have to pay someone to do it but I want to consider if I can find a better car for that $700. The fact that it only has 109K miles on it is a huge factor for me. I've heard these little EA-81's will go 300k. Any input would be great. Thanks for reading.

[idosubaru]

there's some concern as to how badly it was overheated by the prior owner, but most of the time you're go to go by just installing new headgaskets. unfortunately there's no way to verify whether the block or heads are cracked, but usually they aren't.

 

don't replace just one, whatever caused that one to fail also stressed the other one. i tried that once, bad idea. didn't take long for the other one to go, just do them both.

 

the FSM is the way to go, the USMB will likely be your best resource though. and they can definitely be done in the car, i recommend it myself. air tools are a big plus.

[[HTi]Johnson]

DAMN IT!!! Note to self: never take a person on their word in a business deal. I bought an 83 GL FWD AT w/ a tantalizingly low odometer reading of 109k. Got it dirt cheap because it needed a radiator. "Yeah, I never rode it hard or had any problems with it overheating. One day I just started losing fluid from the radiator." So, after zero success sourcing a replacement radiator (you try finding a rad with a 25" x 13 3/4" core & AT in/out for these cars, doesn't exist) I choked it up and paid close to what I did for the car to have the radiator repaired and pressure tested. This was the first muttering of the term, "pot committed." Tested well, installed the unit, it ran well but was still losing coolant from somewhere. The green goo was coming out of the overflow, so I figured maybe the cap was bad. One special order at the parts store, $10 and a week later the cap was installed. No change. While the rad cap was on order, I found a CV axle at a junkyard and fit it with new boots. I decided to pay to have it installed because I was feeling lazy and figured they could peek at the cooling system while they were at it.

 

With the car off and the system pressurized, it was holding pretty well, losing about 2 psi over 5 minutes, not enough to cause an overheat. Under a vacuum, all went to hell. Rapid loss of vacuum pressure from 25 psi to 0 in about 6 seconds. Not a good sign. So now, we topped off the radiator with coolant, pressured the system and started the car. Billows of white smoke out the tailpipe. Best case scenario - blown head gasket(s). Worst case scenario - warped/cracked head(s). Questions for the gurus:

 

1. Given it's a solid EA-81 w/ 109k miles, is it worth fixing? I have $700 in the car now. It's up to you, being an automatic, that might create more problems down the road, maybe not though. Keep the auto tranny filled with atf and regular servicing.

 

2. Given the "pot committed" mentality, I'd be willing to dump another $700 into it for the fix. Do you think it's realistic that I'd find a mechanic willing to do it for that? It shouldn't cost more than $200 in parts to do just a head job.

 

3. I've never replaced a head gasket on a car but have rebuilt the top-ends of several SOHC Honda motorcycle engines. I'm by no means a professional but am an accomplished amateur mechanic. Is this a job I can do myself? Yes, I did a head job without having any experience with car engines. Before you buy the parts, remove the heads and check to see if they're warped or pass a pressure test (done by a machine shop usually.) Then figure out the price of the machine work, then decide if it's worth it. I paid $100 for two heads to be machined.

 

4. Being a "boxer" design, can the heads be removed without pulling the motor? You can remove the heads without pulling the engine and it isn't much harder with the engine being in the car. If it was an EA82, that's a different beast.

 

5. Is there anyway to test which head the problem is coming from? It may be both but If there's a test and it's only one, I can save some time and money. I was thinking about removing the exhaust header and repeating the pressurized running test to see which cylinder the white smoke comes from. Would this work? You could do a compression test on all the cylinders. Rent/buy/borrow a compression tester for an engine, one that threads into the spark plug hole. You can get a cheap one that would work at Harbor Freight, autozone or napa might lone ya one.

 

6. If I tackled this on my own, what's the best manual to work with? Just get a Chilton's manual or a Haynes manual, most people prefer chilton.

 

Any input would be awesome guys. I'm a tight spot. I can afford $700 or so to repair the car if I have to pay someone to do it but I want to consider if I can find a better car for that $700. The fact that it only has 109K miles on it is a huge factor for me. I've heard these little EA-81's will go 300k. Any input would be great. Thanks for reading. You should be able to do the whole job less than $300(PLus $100 or so if you need to surface the heads.) But once you get that thing on the road, you'll feel a great sense of accomplishment, especially if you do the work yourself.

Parts you'll need are:

 

Head Gaskets (I go with fel-pro perma-torques)

Valve Cover Gaskets

Intake Gaskets

Those are the bare minimum you'll need. I'm sure some people will add to or correct me, that's the safeguard of a forum.

Some people will say that if you're in there, you should replace the water pump, reseal the oil pump, and replace the thermostat. Hey, if you want, go for it, but those can be done seperately at a later time. But you have to wonder why the car overheated. Was it the thermostat, waterpump, or a dumb@ss prior owner that forgot to keep his coolant levels up.

 

 

Good Luck,

[HTi]Johnson

 

EDIT: How dare I not say to use the USMB to do the head job, we're all here to help, won't even need a manual. Dang it.

 

OH yeah if you do it yourself, there's a little hose under the intake manifold, you'll see if once you start removing the intake. You should replace it before you put it back together.

 

[Heironymous Josch]

Johnson']Parts you'll need are:

 

Head Gaskets (I go with fel-pro perma-torques)

Valve Cover Gaskets

Intake Gaskets

 

Some people will say that if you're in there' date=' you should replace the water pump, reseal the oil pump, and replace the thermostat. Hey, if you want, go for it, but those can be done seperately at a later time. But you have to wonder why the car overheated. Was it the thermostat, waterpump, or a dumb@ss prior owner that forgot to keep his coolant levels up.

Those are the bare minimum you'll need. I'm sure some people will add to or correct me, that's the safeguard of a forum.

 

Good Luck,

[HTi']Johnson

 

EDIT: How dare I not say to use the USMB to do the head job, we're all here to help, won't even need a manual. Dang it.

 

OH yeah if you do it yourself, there's a little hose under the intake manifold, you'll see if once you start removing the intake. You should replace it before you put it back together.

 

 

Thanks [HTi]Johnson!

 

Any good resources for those parts? Also, I've been researching threads and found some nightmare stories about the freeze plugs "popping." Should I replace them as well while I'm in there? Also, I have a new t-stat but the bolts on the housing were REALLY DAMN TIGHT and I really didn't want to snap a bolt, being that the housing is in a bad spot to get a tap in if I did. Also, what's strange to me is the color of the water/coolant in the cooling system - perfectly clear. When the car runs, it pumps coolant out of the overflow. I'm assuming this is from engine compression leached from a head gasket forcing coolant out the radiator. Shouldn't the coolant be grimy somewhere in the system? I've drained the system at least a few times throughout this whole process and it seems to run clean. I have yet to drain the oil and look at it. I'm hoping it's not too milky; I would like to hope I don't have to worry about the bearings.

 

Also, the hose your referring to, is it some sort of one-off part I'm going to need to order or is it an autozone pick-up? And, is driving the car in the meantime going to cause any more damage? If I keep topping off the coolant, the car stays at normal operating temperature in about town driving.

 

Thanks for your help. I can't begin to explain how helpful you've been.

[daeron]

change your oil now.

 

Drain it into a cat pan, or similar open pan, and let it sit. examine it for signs of milkiness or water, or antifreeze.

 

I had to do the headgaskets on my EA82 under similar circumstances; however, i was getting brown nastiness in my radiator, and changing my oil revealed that NO water or antifreeze was leaking into the oil... I put about 10K miles on the car in this situation before changing the head gaskets, and have put about 7K on it since then with no problems.

 

Secondly, chiltons SUCKS. It may be better for an EA81 owner than an EA82.. but they still suck. I THINK theres a link to an EA81 FSM here http://www.ch601.org/engines.htm but there may be better versions elsewhere. (not an ea81 owner, sorry :-p)

 

Finally, do it yourself. if you can rebuild the top end of a motorcycle engine you can do this. I had never done engine work more major than a timing belt change (personally; i have a large family and we are all gearheads, so I have "sat in" on race engine builds... just never DONE anything on my own) and it took me one day to tear down, and one day to rebuild, my EA82.. short, easy days at that. The pushrod engine should be even simpler and easier.

[GeneralDisorder]

So, after zero success sourcing a replacement radiator (you try finding a rad with a 25" x 13 3/4" core & AT in/out for these cars, doesn't exist) I choked it up and paid close to what I did for the car to have the radiator repaired and pressure tested.

 

That's just silly. There's plenty of sources for EA81 radiators. radiators.com for instance.... and there's lots more. Any auto parts place can order you one for around $100 to $120. Last one I bought for my Brat was right around $120 at my local parts store.

 

Billows of white smoke out the tailpipe. Best case scenario - blown head gasket(s). Worst case scenario - warped/cracked head(s). Questions for the gurus:.

 

EA81 heads don't crack. They can warp and even if they did not spend the $80 (~$40 per) and have them milled flat regardless. If they show they are flat and you want to get away cheap use some 600 and 1200 on a sheet of glass to finish the cleaning.

 

1. Given it's a solid EA-81 w/ 109k miles, is it worth fixing? I have $700 in the car now.

 

I would. It will be cheap and you will learn a lot doing it. Very easy engine to learn HG's on. Quite possibly the easiest you will ever do.

 

2. Given the "pot committed" mentality, I'd be willing to dump another $700 into it for the fix. Do you think it's realistic that I'd find a mechanic willing to do it for that?.

 

Stop being a wussy! Get out your tools and do the job yourself. You'll save a ton of money, you'll gain valuable knowledge about your car, and you'll be investing in tools that you can use again instead of throwing money away having the job done by someone that doesn't care, and would probably just love for you to come back with more problems.

 

3. I've never replaced a head gasket on a car but have rebuilt the top-ends of several SOHC Honda motorcycle engines. I'm by no means a professional but am an accomplished amateur mechanic. Is this a job I can do myself?

 

Yes. You need basic hand tools, 10, 12, 14, 17, 19, and 21mm sockets, ratchets, and you'll need a cheap ($10 at HF) torque wrench. The parts you need will be under $100 for all of them. Fel-Pro for the head gaskets (Autozone), and Dealer ONLY for the rest.

 

4. Being a "boxer" design, can the heads be removed without pulling the motor?

 

Yes. The heads come right off. There's plenty of room. There are some access holes in the frame rails that you use to remove the rocker arm assembly bolts. Other than those everything is accesible from above or below.

 

5. Is there anyway to test which head the problem is coming from? It may be both but If there's a test and it's only one, I can save some time and money. I was thinking about removing the exhaust header and repeating the pressurized running test to see which cylinder the white smoke comes from. Would this work?

 

You ALWAYS replace both HG's. Don't even think about doing only one or I'll fly to Colorado and make you my biatch

 

6. If I tackled this on my own, what's the best manual to work with?

 

Factory Service Manual. Barring that - Haynes is a LOT better than Chiltons.

 

Any input would be awesome guys. I'm a tight spot. I can afford $700 or so to repair the car if I have to pay someone to do it but I want to consider if I can find a better car for that $700. The fact that it only has 109K miles on it is a huge factor for me. I've heard these little EA-81's will go 300k. Any input would be great. Thanks for reading.

 

If you do it yourself you can easily pocket $500 of that.... maybe a little less if you have nothing in the way of tools other than a pair of tweezers and a butter knife.

 

GD

[Bill90Loyale]

You ALWAYS replace both HG's. Don't even think about doing only one or I'll fly to Colorado and make you my biatch

GD

And you definitely DON'T want to be GD's biatch!

[[HTi]Johnson]

Yeah, good points. I was told that Chilton's were better than Haynes, or is that for the electrical diagrams? I forget. I use RockAuto for my head gaskets. They're around $18 each, for the fel-pro permatorques. And for that hose, it's just an 1/8" or so line abour 6 inches long. Nothing special.

 

Yeah, being someone's biatch probably sucks, so replace both.

[Heironymous Josch]

That's just silly. There's plenty of sources for EA81 radiators. radiators.com for instance.... and there's lots more. Any auto parts place can order you one for around $100 to $120. Last one I bought for my Brat was right around $120 at my local parts store.

 

 

 

EA81 heads don't crack. They can warp and even if they did not spend the $80 (~$40 per) and have them milled flat regardless. If they show they are flat and you want to get away cheap use some 600 and 1200 on a sheet of glass to finish the cleaning.

 

 

 

I would. It will be cheap and you will learn a lot doing it. Very easy engine to learn HG's on. Quite possibly the easiest you will ever do.

 

 

 

Stop being a wussy! Get out your tools and do the job yourself. You'll save a ton of money, you'll gain valuable knowledge about your car, and you'll be investing in tools that you can use again instead of throwing money away having the job done by someone that doesn't care, and would probably just love for you to come back with more problems.

 

 

 

Yes. You need basic hand tools, 10, 12, 14, 17, 19, and 21mm sockets, ratchets, and you'll need a cheap ($10 at HF) torque wrench. The parts you need will be under $100 for all of them. Fel-Pro for the head gaskets (Autozone), and Dealer ONLY for the rest.

 

 

 

Yes. The heads come right off. There's plenty of room. There are some access holes in the frame rails that you use to remove the rocker arm assembly bolts. Other than those everything is accesible from above or below.

 

 

 

You ALWAYS replace both HG's. Don't even think about doing only one or I'll fly to Colorado and make you my biatch

 

 

 

Factory Service Manual. Barring that - Haynes is a LOT better than Chiltons.

 

 

 

If you do it yourself you can easily pocket $500 of that.... maybe a little less if you have nothing in the way of tools other than a pair of tweezers and a butter knife.

 

GD

 

GD, thanks, all great info. Unfortunately, I do have a freak radiator and there doesn't seem to be a radiator manufacturer that has caught on to it. radiators.com was the closest having one that was the correct core length (25") but only 12" tall (1 3/4" short). Every auto part data system shows the correct radiator for an 83 GL Sedan FWD AT Non-Turbo 1.8 as having a 23" core. Why radiator.com does have a 25" core that isn't tall enough, I'll never know. Today, I did manage to find a used parts dealer in Utah that was nice enough to measure the one he had and it came up a match but he's awful proud of it ($100 + shipping). Hell, a new one should be around $100 - $150 if I could find the right size. Perhaps someone down the line replaced the rad with one from another model or year. :-\ But it doesn't seem that a radiator any smaller would mount without the in/out's getting in the serpentine system. The other catch is my car has factory AC which doesn't even show up as an indicator in parts searches and accounts for the added width of the serpentine system and the thus the radiator. I suppose an alternative would be to remove the Compressor and tensioner for the AC and install a 23" rad which are abundant.

 

Any who. You don't have to make me your biatch, I'm confident I can do the job and I have tweezers, a butter knife and all the other tools necessary for the job. You made me laugh. Thanks for taking the stress off my friend.

 

Josh

[GeneralDisorder]

I guarantee you don't have a "freak" radiator. There may be differences in how they are measured, but measurements are not important for the purposes of an EA81.

 

ALL (and yes, I know it for a fact) EA81's use the same radiator. They changed from a large cap to a small one in 83 but it doesn't matter - either one will fit in either core support.

 

All EA81's have a three groove crank pulley for optional AC and Power steering. These cars are quite predictable and I do know exactly what you have. I gaurantee my information is more accurate than any parts store or system on this. I know more than the dealership parts guys almost every single time....

 

GD

[Heironymous Josch]

Thanks for all the input guys! I purchased the fel-pro headset from NAPA which came with head gaskets, valve cover gaskets, valve seals and intake gaskets. While I was there, I picked up a new water pump, thermostat & gasket, and a radiator cap. I installed the above listed components, minus the headset and found some surprises!!! After removing the t-stat housing I found serious white deposits on the bottom and sure enough the gasket was ripped to shreds at the same point. Apparently the compression from the motor found another escape route. Since the rad only takes 5 minutes to remove, I figured I'd pull it to have a quick shot at the water pump. During the process I found a pretty serious cut in the AT feed hose coming from the radiator. Turns out the cut was rubbed there by the compressor pulley. So, after some research I found out that the car wasn't equipped with factory AC but a factory upgrade that allowed the later installation of AC. This upgrade must have included a radiator with in/out's for ATF and a loop to cool it and was wider to accommodate the extra belt, pulley and tensioner. So, when some wiseguy got the AC installed, the feed line to the radiator wasn't routed well, was too short and rubbed on the pulley.

 

Solution:

 

Remove AC compressor and tensioner, pick up uber cheap used radiator with 23" core, replace damaged ATF line, remove heads, check for warping, machine as necessary, re-install and enjoy my car for the winter!

[GeneralDisorder]

The radiators were not replaced for dealer installed AC. It's the same radiator as the non-AC models (which it was before the kit was installed by some dealership). The cooler lines may have been extended as part of the kit but not the radiator itself.

 

A plain old EA81 radiator (pay no attention to the measurements) will fit any model of EA81.

 

GD

[Heironymous Josch]

I guarantee you don't have a "freak" radiator. There may be differences in how they are measured, but measurements are not important for the purposes of an EA81.

 

ALL (and yes, I know it for a fact) EA81's use the same radiator. They changed from a large cap to a small one in 83 but it doesn't matter - either one will fit in either core support.

 

All EA81's have a three groove crank pulley for optional AC and Power steering. These cars are quite predictable and I do know exactly what you have. I gaurantee my information is more accurate than any parts store or system on this. I know more than the dealership parts guys almost every single time....

 

GD

 

Have you ever had to replace the radiator on an 83 GL Auto w/ AC? radiator.com stocks two different core lengths for a reason. If ALL EA81's used the same radiator, there would be big problems for everyone else in the world with a 23" core length radiator that wanted to install AC. My ATF line is already being rubbed by the compressor pulley with an added 2" lateral space, there is no legitimate way someone with a 23" core could avoid the problem based on the angle of the tube exiting the radiator. Every EA-81 having a three-grooved crank pulley isn't indicative of every EA-81 factory installed radiator being the same. Even if there were to be only a very small fraction of "AC ready" cars planned to roll of the line in 83, having the same crank pulley for every car would make good manufacturing sense. Because of the width constraints, the only item that would need to be one off for an "AC ready" car is the radiator. Why radiator.com has the wrong height for the AC-specific 83 GL baffles me, but they at least recognize that there were two types.

 

You, I will acquiesce, know more about subies than I. I have areas of "expertise" and they aren't in subaru radiators. I just see what I've got in front of me here. If there was only one size radiator for all EA-81's then the radiator in my car now was from another vehicle. Are there other mid-year subies with a wider core, the same mounting pattern and the exact same height? Because the bottom support grommets on my car nestle up inside the base if this radiator like a finger in a butthole. You can't sum it up to "measuring differences," no matter where you stick your tape, you won't end up with a 2" margin of error. If all EA-81's had the exact same radiator (the cap size aside) than why does the nation's largest radiator distributor have two different core lengths listed for it? If every EA-81 had the exact same radiator (we'll assume this radiator to be the 23" core length as I've found this unit to be overly abundant and cheap), how could a bloke expect to install AC without his belts eating a hole in his ATF lines? And, lastly, I found what I'm assuming is the original center dash console in the trunk and it has a big black sticker that says, "This car was factory equipped for the addition of Air Conditioning." How many EA-81 drivers out there have this sticker? I haven't been around many EA-81's, so I don't know the answer to this question. I'm curious if this is a rare factory setup that included a wider radiator.

 

Unless you worked in the factory throughout 82 - 83, you don't know that all EA-81's had the same radiator. Perhaps Subaru toyed with a wider core radiator before realizing that it was cheaper and more practical to output the same size radiator with more suitably angled ATF pipes to avoid the compressor's belt. I'm not trying to square off with you here but as a physics major, personal "matter-o-fact-ness" doesn't bode well with me. I'm more attracted to logic and logic, reason and burden of evidence seems to indicate that indeed two factory radiator sizes were produced for EA-81's and the one in my car was the rarer of the two. That's why radiator manufacturers don't make it and you've never heard of it. I could be wrong and would whole-heartedly admit to it if you could show me why but "I know more than the dealership parts guys" isn't gonna do it.

[Heironymous Josch]

I'm not arguing that not any EA-81 radiator will work but that it does appear that I have a factory installed radiator that's wider than most of them out there. I found a junk dealer with an 83 GL that slapped his tape on the radiator while he was on the phone with me. I said, "now, I'm sure you already know, but measure between the inner part of the seem ballasts, the inner-most points of the tanks." He did and came up with the exact measurement of 24 13/16." So, at least one other person out there had an EA-81 with a different radiator.

[[HTi]Johnson]

I'm not arguing that not any EA-81 radiator will work but that it does appear that I have a factory installed radiator that's wider than most of them out there. I found a junk dealer with an 83 GL that slapped his tape on the radiator while he was on the phone with me. I said, "now, I'm sure you already know, but measure between the inner part of the seem ballasts, the inner-most points of the tanks." He did and came up with the exact measurement of 22 13/16." So, at least one other person out there had an EA-81 with a different radiator.

 

Crazy, ever think of getting a small oil cooler for the ATF lines to run through. It could be mounted up in front of the other radiator. No special radiator needed.

[Heironymous Josch]

Johnson']Crazy' date=' ever think of getting a small oil cooler for the ATF lines to run through. It could be mounted up in front of the other radiator. No special radiator needed.[/quote']

 

That's a smashing idea!

[GeneralDisorder]

You may have an aftermarket unit already. The transmission cooler lines are often incorrectly angled on aftermarket radiators.

 

Never has anyone on this board (to my knowledge) found more than one model of radiator used in EA81's. Even the Turbo's used the same radiator. A "2WD Auto with AC" makes no difference to the equation. The car rolled from the factory "equipped for installation of optional AC" - it will say so on the dash as every other EA81 does.... They wouldn't use a seperate radiator because it would needlessly add to the cost of the AC kit. And I've seen the AC kits - they don't come with one.

 

My conclusion is that your radiator was replaced at some point with a poorly fitting aftermarket unit. Thus the problem with your cooler lines.

 

GD

[Heironymous Josch]

You may have an aftermarket unit already. The transmission cooler lines are often incorrectly angled on aftermarket radiators.

 

Never has anyone on this board (to my knowledge) found more than one model of radiator used in EA81's. Even the Turbo's used the same radiator. A "2WD Auto with AC" makes no difference to the equation. The car rolled from the factory "equipped for installation of optional AC" - it will say so on the dash as every other EA81 does.... They wouldn't use a seperate radiator because it would needlessly add to the cost of the AC kit. And I've seen the AC kits - they don't come with one.

 

My conclusion is that your radiator was replaced at some point with a poorly fitting aftermarket unit. Thus the problem with your cooler lines.

 

GD

 

That would make sense and that would mean that a prior radiator failed as well. I'm getting a bit more worried; it's sounding more and more like this car was driven hot. I'm almost done pulling the heads; once I am, I'll do a thorough inspection and throw a feeler gauge on 'em. Today, I'm going to need the torque specs and tightening pattern and I was unable to find a parts dealer that has the book for this car in stock. I've got a friend who's dad runs a subie shop, I'll try calling him.

[daeron]

Secondly, chiltons SUCKS. It may be better for an EA81 owner than an EA82.. but they still suck. I THINK theres a link to an EA81 FSM here http://www.ch601.org/engines.htm but there may be better versions elsewhere. (not an ea81 owner, sorry :-p)

 

 

I just went and double checked.. there is an EA81 FSM available for download right there.

[Heironymous Josch]

I just went and double checked.. there is an EA81 FSM available for download right there.

 

Excellent! Thanks!

[GeneralDisorder]

It's only the engine section and the engine parts manual. Not useful for the rest of the car.... and not terribly useful otherwise unless you are into rebuilding EA81's.

 

GD

[Heironymous Josch]

According to the FSM, it turns out there were at least two different radiators for the EA81's. One with a 23" core and one with a 25" core. See below.

 

 

now, do you suppose I'll be okay w/ a 23" replacement? Because I can't find a 25".

[GeneralDisorder]

Interesting - all aftermarket radiators come with the AT cooler so they should fit an AT car no problem.

 

The difference must be that the stock AT radiators have the cooler, but the *stock* MT's don't have one at all. They all fit the same though so as long as you route the AT cooler lines properly you should have no problem at all.

 

Radiators get replaced all the time, and mixed and matched all over the place. Since no one has ever complained here that an aftermarket didn't fit their rig you should be fine with any aftermarket that comes with the AT cooler lines (they all do from my experience). You may have to lengthen the lines a bit, but that's no problem with a few $ of hose.

 

That said, the 3AT is a peice of trash, so you might just consider swapping it out for a 5 MT if you really like the car.

 

GD

[Heironymous Josch]

Interesting - all aftermarket radiators come with the AT cooler so they should fit an AT car no problem.

 

The difference must be that the stock AT radiators have the cooler, but the *stock* MT's don't have one at all. They all fit the same though so as long as you route the AT cooler lines properly you should have no problem at all.

 

Radiators get replaced all the time, and mixed and matched all over the place. Since no one has ever complained here that an aftermarket didn't fit their rig you should be fine with any aftermarket that comes with the AT cooler lines (they all do from my experience). You may have to lengthen the lines a bit, but that's no problem with a few $ of hose.

 

That said, the 3AT is a peice of trash, so you might just consider swapping it out for a 5 MT if you really like the car.

 

GD

 

I've been trying to source a 5 spd MT, haven't found one locally at a good price yet. I've never heard an AT clunk as loud as this one does going into reverse. I've been told that they all did that. I need a new center dash console any way, if I swapped to manual before replacing the console for an AT, that could work out well.

 

How tough is a tranny swap in comparison to this head job I'm doing right now?

 

Also, I got the heads out last night. Both gaskets were in bad shape, especially drivers side. I cleaned up the mating surfaces and threw a straight edge on them and saw no visible warping. I'm going to have them tested w/ a feeler gauge just to be sure. Any tips for the re-install?

[Heironymous Josch]

Well, the heads are warped. .003 at the middle. Now I've got to find a machine shop with good prices and quick turnaround time. Thanks for all your help everyone. This little $200 car is getting plenty of love. It's lucky I see the potential!