alternative 5 lug recipe in the works.

[s'ko]

Ok so I realize that the simplest way of doing a 5 lug is to use XT6 parts.

 

with these parts getting hard to find, I am looking for alternatives for the 5 lug set up.

 

From what I found the bearing size of an EA81 EA82 (including XT6)is

Front = 1.378 in /35.001 mm bore, 2.8346 in / 72mm O.D.

Rear = 1.2598 in /32 mm bore, 2.2835 in /58 mm O.D.

 

EJ bearing size is

Front = 1.6535 in/42mm bore, 2.8346 in/72mm O.D.

Rear = 1.4961 in/38mm bore, 2.5591 in/65 mm O.D.

 

So it looks like an EJ FRONT hub will press into a EA82 FRONT bearing w/o any problems. Kinda pointless b/c you can't use EJ brakes w/EA82 hub assemblys and the EJ stuff can be bolted directly to the front w/o major modification. This will mostly focus on the rear wheels. So a bearing with 38mm bore and 58mm O.D. bearing would work in the rear.

 

Online search at various bearing houses have come up w/nothing. If anyone can help with that it would be great.

 

If you machine down the EJ hub to 32mm. This is 2mm on each side. I don't have an EJ rear hub lying around to get measurements so if someone has one, can you please measure the thickness of the part that goes into the center of the bearing.

 

So I am thinking that the simplest way to do this is to get the EA82 re-drilled to 5X100. The XT6 rear hub is essentially a EA82 hub that is drilled to 5x100.

 

BW

[PoorManzImpreza]

The rear xt6 hub is NOT essentially a re-drilled ea82 hub it has a different offset, different thickness, different wheel studs, hub centering ring for wheel and brake discs. What it is, is DIRECTLY compatible with ej equipment ej brake discs mount PERFECTLY on xt6 rear hubs the xt6 hub is the correct offset for an ej backing plate mounted flush on an ea trailing arm, with appropriate centering and bolt pattern adaptation to allow the EJ shoe e-brake system 2 sit perfectly within the ej brake disc..All these things make the xt6 hub or a clone of it the best choice for our ea cars..

Now one could re-drill an ea hub 2 5x100 bolt if one simply desired to run a 5 bolt wheel..But far easier would be 4x115.4 (or whatever older Nissan and Suzuki bolt pattern is) or 4x100 (Toyota newer Nissan 4 bolt and Honda small car) and much higher wheel selection would be available..

Two mm might be removable from an ej rear hub but what about the depth of the ea rear bearing? I'm pretty sure than the hub won't go all the way through the ea bearing and thus getting an ej axle in there would be impossible..

I've been through this over and over and the more I mulled it over the more it pointed me towards xt6 hubs as being the absolute correct solution 2 our 5 bolt requirements..Just too many things already done for us in a factory Subaru part..Has anyone thought about a group buy of xt6 hubs from Japan?

Keep up the research..Because I for one would love an alternate solution..

Kaz

[Gloyale]

.Has anyone thought about a group buy of xt6 hubs from Japan?

 

Yes, but they don't make them anymore. And there are very few left in Subaru warehouses anywhere. Supposedly less than 20 sets as of last year sometime

 

Here is a thread about it.http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=72556&highlight=news+XT6+hubs

[s'ko]

Poormansimpreza: Thanks for the input.

 

There is another thread going on in the Old Generation forum for an adapter. Based on the a picture that RenaissanceMan put up with the 4x140mm holes compared w/the 5x100mm holes. If you were to redrill the hub to 5X100, you have to weld up two of the 4X140 holes to get it work right.

 

I am leaning more torward 5X100 b/c that's the same as my Impreza and the BRAT.

 

BW

[Numbchux]

I don't see how the bearing size and hub size are related. as there's a piece in between....the spindle.

 

if you put EJ-sized bearings in an EA trailing arm, you might be able to put an EJ axle (has the spindle as part of the CV, like an EA front axle) through the bearing. assuming the track is the same.

 

and the XT6 hub is drastically different than an EA82 hub! DRASTICALLY. I'll have the rear end of my wagon apart tomorrow.....I'll take pictures (and also of the 4-lug stuff sitting on the shelf in the shed)

[s'ko]

I don't see how the bearing size and hub size are related. as there's a piece in between....the spindle.

 

if you put EJ-sized bearings in an EA trailing arm, you might be able to put an EJ axle (has the spindle as part of the CV, like an EA front axle) through the bearing. assuming the track is the same..

 

The reason I looked at the bearing sizes was in the hopes that I could find a bearing that could be pressed into the EA trailing arm and have the EJ hub pressed into that. So the magic number would be a bearing that has a 38mm bore and 58mm O.D. This would fit the EA trailing arm and the EJ hub. EJ bearing's O.D. is 7mm too big.

 

and the XT6 hub is drastically different than an EA82 hub! DRASTICALLY. I'll have the rear end of my wagon apart tomorrow.....I'll take pictures (and also of the 4-lug stuff sitting on the shelf in the shed)

 

Great. Pics would help in solving this problem.

[Numbchux]

The reason I looked at the bearing sizes was in the hopes that I could find a bearing that could be pressed into the EA trailing arm and have the EJ hub pressed into that. So the magic number would be a bearing that has a 38mm bore and 58mm O.D. This would fit the EA trailing arm and the EJ hub. EJ bearing's O.D. is 7mm too big.

 

ok, I had forgotten that the EJ hubs do press into the bearings, and don't ride on the spindle like the EA/ER ones do.

 

but then you're opening the axle "can". I mean, yes, the front track is the same....but is the rear? is there enough clearance in the EA trailing arm for an EJ axle to fit?

 

 

I know a few local guys.....I'll see if I can scare up enough parts to try a few things.

[Numbchux]

pictures. didn't get a chance to take pics of the 4-lug hubs....but here's my XT6 stuff:

 

 

and the rotor slips on over that:

 

 

and the 4-lug hubs from a different source:

 

you can see, they're very different!

[idosubaru]

looks like you took pictures of mine - new lug stud here and there and the axle end sawed off for EJ wheels!!!

 

how does that rear hub 5lug part come off, had someone remove them for me (away, in another state) not too long ago. do the bearings have to come out/apart for that piece to come off?

[Caboobaroo]

Nope, undo the axle nut and it slides off the splines.

 

So I had a thought on this whole deal. Since we basically can't get hubs, why not make them, we have the pieces to do it! It would require making a jig to hold everything in place while it was welded and then made sure it was true but why don't we try taking the splined center from the old 4-lug setup and welding on the 5-lug top? It would definatly take some time and some skill but as I see it, we're starting to run out of options.

 

Another thought, does the EJ rear hub slide onto the EA rear axle? If so, then why don't we machine down the EJ rear hub (on the back where it touches the wheel bearings) to the same height as the ER hubs?

[discopotato03]

Caboobaroo I think it would be easier to use an EA drum and machine some off the inner or bearing end of the splined section .

 

It looks like the XT6 was designed in a transition era when disks were changing from tacky bolted behind the hub to over the wheel studs on the outer side . Obviously the later system needs the hub flange to be offset inwards to allow for the depth of the disks hat section .

So if you could offset the modified drum/hub inwards and machine its outer face to take a concentric insert or sleeve , the disc and wheel would run true . Because the hubs depth through the splined section is less you could fit a thick washer or spacer between the split tapered collar and the big nut .

 

Cheers A .

[s'ko]

I am swapping e-mails w/the guys from crossbreed perf. I am asking it they will sell just the rear hub and not the entire set up. If it's cheap enough or if we can get a group buy together, it might be a cost-effective alternative.

 

BW

[discopotato03]

Bratgeebra marketed about 20 of those kits from memory and the rights have been taken over by someone else in QLD Australia . I was lucky and got one of Gee's last kits .

 

If I was in the US I'd be doing my damnest to find a set of XT6 bits and a set of spares .

 

If I was going to make anything it would be a custom rear stub axle to accept the std rear outer DOJ on the inside and an early Liberty (Legacy over there) std 5 stud hub . The costly part of the Crossbred hub was the internal splining of the new hub , internal splines are more expensive to produce than external ones . The transition stub axle and a suitable bolt on backing plate to mount the rear caliper is the easiest new part solution IMO .

 

Cheers A .

[the_postie]

I had some pics of the spline part of the ea drum machined out and the legacy hub spline machined off and then the two joined by keying and welding.Any machinist/fitter could do this.

[discopotato03]

I'd really like to see the pics please .

 

Cheers A .