The Dude Abides Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Ok ive talked about this before but ill rehash it again. 1988 Suby DL Wagon SPFI Push Button 4wd I find that i have troble shifting from gear to gear. Now this only happens after its been warmed up after a while. When i first start out in the morning it works find but as i get closer to work and the car warms up more it becomes incresingly harder to shift from gear to gear. Its almost grinding into each gear. After its been warmed up i cant put it into reverse without turning the car off. Which is the only way i can put it into reverse and almost 1st gear but again only after its been warmed up. Ive heard syncros, clutch cable, tranny forks. It does have a new clutch in it though. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 hows your tranny fluid? Maybe time to replace? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 26, 2008 Author Share Posted March 26, 2008 hows your tranny fluid? Maybe time to replace? ohhh good one i didnt think of that. But its a manual tranny are you able to check that with a dipstick. I didnt think manuals came with one. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLCraig Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 It sounds like a combination of clutch cable and syncros. Your problem with shifting into reverse is likely to be the cable. Trying adjusting the cable and remember there should be some free-play with the clutch petal when you are done and try to not over-tighten the cable. Give that a try and see if that helps the rest of your shifting issues too. If you find that you still have some shifting issues, try changing the gear oil. A lot of people have found that Redline 75W90 NS, helps syncros to work correctly. The NS means that the oil dose not include the friction modifiers for limited slip differentials. You should feel some improvement within the first 30 miles. If Redline is too expensive for you, research the transmission cocktail on Nasioc or bbs.legecycentral, or try draining about 1/2 quart and adding some ATF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLCraig Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 ohhh good one i didnt think of that. But its a manual tranny are you able to check that with a dipstick. I didnt think manuals came with one. Ben Subaru Manual transmissions have a check stick. It's hidden by the spare tire and it's on the right side of the transmission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 26, 2008 Author Share Posted March 26, 2008 ohhh good one i didnt think of that. But its a manual tranny are you able to check that with a dipstick. I didnt think manuals came with one. Ben Wait a minute. Manuals dont have fluid in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenley Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Wait a minute. Manuals dont have fluid in them. They may not have tranny fluid parse, but they do have gear oil which you should indeed replace yearly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 26, 2008 Author Share Posted March 26, 2008 It sounds like a combination of clutch cable and syncros. Your problem with shifting into reverse is likely to be the cable. Trying adjusting the cable and remember there should be some free-play with the clutch petal when you are done and try to not over-tighten the cable. Give that a try and see if that helps the rest of your shifting issues too. If you find that you still have some shifting issues, try changing the gear oil. A lot of people have found that Redline 75W90 NS, helps syncros to work correctly. The NS means that the oil dose not include the friction modifiers for limited slip differentials. You should feel some improvement within the first 30 miles. If Redline is too expensive for you, research the transmission cocktail on Nasioc or bbs.legecycentral, or try draining about 1/2 quart and adding some ATF. Well at 200000 thousand miles i dont think the gear oil has ever been replaced. I have no idea on how about to do that. Or where even to get gear lube. Why not get power purple, i heard that is good for rearends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Well at 200000 thousand miles i dont think the gear oil has ever been replaced. I have no idea on how about to do that. Or where even to get gear lube. Why not get power purple, i heard that is good for rearends. Replace it! Its def time if it has never been replaced. There is a drain plug on the bottom of the tranny. I think its a 17mm if i remember correctly. You can get gear oil at any auto parts place or even walmart. 75w90 should be what you need. Not sure how many quarts the 5 speed 4wd tranny takes but my 2wd took 3 so its that or more. To fill it you just fill it up in the same tube from where you check the gear oil..passenger side of tranny on the top. A side note, since its been so long since its been changed you may want to do the ATF flush. Run ATF in your tranny until it smooths out. Then drain and fill with gear oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[HTi]Johnson Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Don't run complete ATF...maybe a half of a quart and the rest be gear oil. I think the nut on bottom is a 19mm or 22mm. Yeah, about the manuals having the dipstick. My friend has an automatic and the prior owner decided he should add some oil to the tranny...he put ATF in the diff oil spout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferox Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 One important thing to keep in mind is that you probably have to check the gear oil level when it's hot, after you have driven around a bit. That's the way it is in ea81's, so I could be wrong since I don't ea82. If you flush it with gear oil let it drain for a little while, put the drain plug back on, and fill it to specifications. If you fill it right, it should read low on the dipstick before you have driven it, then check it when it's hot to see how close you are to hitting the mark. I use a quart of synthetic with conventional and it seems to work good. You might want to double check this, but if you fill it to spec. you shouldn't have any problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted March 26, 2008 Share Posted March 26, 2008 Johnson']Don't run complete ATF...maybe a half of a quart and the rest be gear oil. I think the nut on bottom is a 19mm or 22mm. Yeah' date=' about the manuals having the dipstick. My friend has an automatic and the prior owner decided he should add some oil to the tranny...he put ATF in the diff oil spout.[/quote'] There is nothing wrong with running complete ATF. As long as you dont do it permanently. I did it for about 500 miles with my car and it free'd up the shifts a good amount. In fact, some new manual tranny cars require ATF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 dont forget that the gears are sharing the same fluid as the front differential. pure atf will kill the front diff, but a temporary drive on it could free things up. i would be more comfortable with gear oil with a touch of atf instead just use regular old gl-5 type oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 Scotty's cocktail or pure Redline are good choices. ATF is great for transmissions, and for cleaning things. Sadly you don't have a transmission - you have a transaxle. You have to comprimise between transmission lube, and hypoid gear oil. Run ATF to flush the tranny - no problem there for a few hundred miles to get things cleaned up. Then switch to something with enough sulfer to protect the hypoid differential gears, and still allow good operation of the syncro's. This is the reason that Subaru's require expensive synthetics, or cocktails to feel right when they are old. When new a high quality GL-5 will work fine, but even owners of new WRX's and such have experienced grinding and poor shifting after only 20,000 miles or less. It's just a result of the design and the comprimises inherent in it. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 27, 2008 Author Share Posted March 27, 2008 Now remember i dotn think this has ever been changed. Do i really want to go cleanout things on a 200thousand mile car. I understand toping off the fluids to remove the potential problem but if i start puttin in new fluid wont that make problems that werent there before very aparent afterwards. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 No. Clean it out. You really think dirt, metal shavings, and varnish are helping your transmission? GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 27, 2008 Author Share Posted March 27, 2008 still works after 20 years though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill90Loyale Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 Ben- You have a five speed manual transmission. Before you hit 400 posts, it's time for you to learn where your tranny fluid dipstick is, and to change the fluid (aka gear oil). 1. Remove the spare tire from the engine compartment (if yours is mounted in there). 2. With flashlight in hand, and standing on the passenger side of the engine compartment, look at the aluminum blob that seems to connect the back lower side of your engine to something that heads underneath your car. That blob is your "transaxle" and you'll (eventually) spot a little wire loop affair sticking into the side of it. The wire loop thing is inviting your finger to grab it. Answer the call. Pull it up. Voila! That stubby thing is the DIPSTICK for the "transmission fluid". This is the same hole that you're going to pour about a cup of "automatic transmission fluid" into (using a funnel), and operating the vehicle (don't forget to replace the dipstick). Operate the vehicle for a couple hundred miles with that auto tranny fluid in there. Why? Because it acts as a SOLVENT, cleaning the varnish and other deposits off your moving parts inside the transmission. See GD's post above. This is a good thing. 3. Have you done the above yet? Good. Now you're ready to PUT IN NEW GEAR OIL IN YOUR STANDARD TRANSMISSION GEARBOX. I apologize for shouting, but I'm in a bad mood and shouldn't be on line in this condition. Here's where things can seem confusing: Above, you used "transmission fluid" added to your old crappy "gear oil" to clean the tranny interior. Now you're going to replace all that crappy old gear oil with nice clean fresh gear oil. But I'm tired now, and will hand the instructional ball back to someone else - or finish this post later today if I have to. Ben, we've all been where you are now. This advice is meant in the best spirit of helping you take the next step in your subie career: actually getting your hands dirty. Take the wheel boys, I'm headed in for some shut eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nug Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 The symptoms in the original post sound almost completely clutch related to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 27, 2008 Author Share Posted March 27, 2008 Ben-You have a five speed manual transmission. Before you hit 400 posts, it's time for you to learn where your tranny fluid dipstick is, and to change the fluid (aka gear oil). 1. Remove the spare tire from the engine compartment (if yours is mounted in there). 2. With flashlight in hand, and standing on the passenger side of the engine compartment, look at the aluminum blob that seems to connect the back lower side of your engine to something that heads underneath your car. That blob is your "transaxle" and you'll (eventually) spot a little wire loop affair sticking into the side of it. The wire loop thing is inviting your finger to grab it. Answer the call. Pull it up. Voila! That stubby thing is the DIPSTICK for the "transmission fluid". This is the same hole that you're going to pour about a cup of "automatic transmission fluid" into (using a funnel), and operating the vehicle (don't forget to replace the dipstick). Operate the vehicle for a couple hundred miles with that auto tranny fluid in there. Why? Because it acts as a SOLVENT, cleaning the varnish and other deposits off your moving parts inside the transmission. See GD's post above. This is a good thing. 3. Have you done the above yet? Good. Now you're ready to PUT IN NEW GEAR OIL IN YOUR STANDARD TRANSMISSION GEARBOX. I apologize for shouting, but I'm in a bad mood and shouldn't be on line in this condition. Here's where things can seem confusing: Above, you used "transmission fluid" added to your old crappy "gear oil" to clean the tranny interior. Now you're going to replace all that crappy old gear oil with nice clean fresh gear oil. But I'm tired now, and will hand the instructional ball back to someone else - or finish this post later today if I have to. Ben, we've all been where you are now. This advice is meant in the best spirit of helping you take the next step in your subie career: actually getting your hands dirty. Take the wheel boys, I'm headed in for some shut eye. What did you say, Why You Little Im just playin. I love to get my hands dirty. I was only commenting about how some people with automatic transmission encounter more problems when they change out there fluid. Ill half to price the fluid and the gear oil. Doesnt royal purple make a gear oil. I will make this my first priority before i change the cable if needed. Ben In fact i should just buy a big thing of atf because i need to flush out my power steering system from all that power steering fluid i put in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samneric Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 Ben-You have a five speed manual transmission. Before you hit 400 posts, it's time for you to learn where your tranny fluid dipstick is, and to change the fluid (aka gear oil). 1. Remove the spare tire from the engine compartment (if yours is mounted in there). 2. With flashlight in hand, and standing on the passenger side of the engine compartment, look at the aluminum blob that seems to connect the back lower side of your engine to something that heads underneath your car. That blob is your "transaxle" and you'll (eventually) spot a little wire loop affair sticking into the side of it. The wire loop thing is inviting your finger to grab it. Answer the call. Pull it up. Voila! That stubby thing is the DIPSTICK for the "transmission fluid". This is the same hole that you're going to pour about a cup of "automatic transmission fluid" into (using a funnel), and operating the vehicle (don't forget to replace the dipstick). Operate the vehicle for a couple hundred miles with that auto tranny fluid in there. Why? Because it acts as a SOLVENT, cleaning the varnish and other deposits off your moving parts inside the transmission. See GD's post above. This is a good thing. 3. Have you done the above yet? Good. Now you're ready to PUT IN NEW GEAR OIL IN YOUR STANDARD TRANSMISSION GEARBOX. I apologize for shouting, but I'm in a bad mood and shouldn't be on line in this condition. Here's where things can seem confusing: Above, you used "transmission fluid" added to your old crappy "gear oil" to clean the tranny interior. Now you're going to replace all that crappy old gear oil with nice clean fresh gear oil. But I'm tired now, and will hand the instructional ball back to someone else - or finish this post later today if I have to. Ben, we've all been where you are now. This advice is meant in the best spirit of helping you take the next step in your subie career: actually getting your hands dirty. Take the wheel boys, I'm headed in for some shut eye. WOW! I don't think I have read such a condescending and sarcastic response to a reasonable question! (You said you were tired so I figure you're appologising ahead of time ) Anyway, I just switched Royal Purple 75W90 into my tranny and will let you know how it goes when my new clutch is in and I've driven for a while. I figured that Royal Purple would be enough to clean out the crap from my tranny as they do use additivies to help clean as well as lube - you should have seen the gloop that came out when I drained the old fluid It was like a pouring a delicious pint of Guiness for the first 30 seconds before the clear synthetic that was in there started pouring out.... Back to your question about flushing a 200k tranny.... I'm not sure if subie Trannys are similar but when I switched my 250k GMC engine oil over to Purple, the cleaning and thining effect of the new fluid did find the holes that were about to be in the gaskets and oil seals. One engine in pieces later.... So I agree that it needs to be flushed but if subie trannys are the same as GMC V8 engines, I would be ready to replace the seals also. Keep us posted with the Purple - I'm going to try the ATF mix in mine when its back together to see if it will help the Purple clean out the crap in my box... Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill90Loyale Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 Ben- As promised, I'm back. Let us know if you need any further guidance on the steps required to change out your gear oil. All the best- Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted March 29, 2008 Author Share Posted March 29, 2008 Fixed. Clutch Cable needed adjusted. Thanks Again McBrat. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaru_dude Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 You still need to replace that fluid though after adding a little atf to free things up. But you will probably spring quite a few leaks if you go full synthetic (Royal Purple). Mine sure did, smoked like you wouldn't believe everytime I pulled off the interstate. My 2wd 5spd feels a WHOLE lot better after some atf flushing and fresh fluid. Mine has 215,000miles and the only thing that I've noticed is nothing but improvement from the flush and fill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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