U-Joints

[sidekickin]

Hey everyone. I need to replace the rear u-joint on my '87 hatchback. Autozone doesn't list a u-joint for this car, but they show one for an '87 Brat. Will the u-joint for an '87 Brat work on my hatchback? Thanks...

[idosubaru]

edit - for ujoints - EA81 does not equal EA82. thanks!

[Durania]

The EA81 u-joints are not staked in like the EA82. When I replaced mine in the Brat all I had to do was unbolt the driveshaft and remove the u-joint and use a vice to put the other back in. An extra set of hands makes this job so much easier.

[TomRhere]

I would have them check that part number to see if it is listed for an '84 Hatch also. Ifso, you should be good. Some places call the EA-82 3-door a Hatch, but it really isn't.

 

EA-81 u-joints have internal clips holding the caps in, and are replaceable like any other u-joint. By internal, it means clips are inboard of the yoke ears, vs being on the outside of the caps = external

 

EA-82 u-joints are staked in. They're called un-serviceable, but they can be replaced.

[Frank B]

Hatchback and the brat share the same u-joints. Look for 2-door hatchback, or the listing for hatchback with ohv engine, or as mentioned above, 84 Hatchback.

[Gloyale]

Hey everyone. I need to replace the rear u-joint on my '87 hatchback. Autozone doesn't list a u-joint for this car, but they show one for an '87 Brat. Will the u-joint for an '87 Brat work on my hatchback? Thanks...

 

I had the same problem while living in Wisconsin. Rusted U-joint, busted all to hell.

 

Is you're car a 3 door coupe, like a short EA82 wagon??

 

Or is it a true Hatchback??? The little stubby guy with the EA81 motor? Front end looks like a Brat?

 

If it is a true *Hatchback*, it is an EA81 series, and yes the Brat U-joint will work.

 

If it is an EA82 3 door coupe (like an RX, Front end looks like the Loyales) then you have the *unserviceable* U-joint.

 

If the latter is the case, i'd say it's easiest to get a non rusty west coast junkyard saft shipped for less than $100. They last forever out here. No joke.

 

 

You can grind out the stake points, press out the old U-joint, press a new one in, and then re-stake it into the yolk, but that type of work is beyond most home mechanics. Plus centering it in the Yolk is near impossible, because there are no premarked indents or snap ring grooves like a *normal* U-joint.

 

I was also not able to find a shop willing to perform this type of replacement. Liability and such.

[Frank B]

I was also not able to find a shop willing to perform this type of replacement. Liability and such.

 

I took my 86 3-door to a 4x4 driveline shop, the type that installs lift kits and such to trucks.

[Reveeen]

You can grind out the stake points, press out the old U-joint, press a new one in, and then re-stake it into the yolk, but that type of work is beyond most home mechanics. Plus centering it in the Yolk is near impossible, because there are no premarked indents or snap ring grooves like a *normal* U-joint.

 

It is not quite like that. You cut out the old staked in joint (cut the center out with a angle grinder/torch) CAREFULLY push the remaining bits inward (the yokes are as soft as baby crap, so carefully is the secret) clean out the holes (a file, or a die grinder) the new joint comes with clips (inside the yoke) to center things.

These folks here will sell you a joint:

http://www.rockforddriveline.com/replacem.htm

(also available @ NAPA in a NAPA box, and slightly more expensive)

 

It is roughly DOUBLE the time than a conventional joint, and certainly nothing to be afraid of.

[Frank B]

You can grind out the stake points, press out the old U-joint, press a new one in, and then re-stake it into the yolk, but that type of work is beyond most home mechanics. Plus centering it in the Yolk is near impossible, because there are no premarked indents or snap ring grooves like a *normal* U-joint.

 

 

It is not quite like that. You cut out the old staked in joint (cut the center out with a angle grinder/torch) CAREFULLY push the remaining bits inward (the yokes are as soft as baby crap, so carefully is the secret) clean out the holes (a file, or a die grinder) the new joint comes with clips (inside the yoke) to center things.

These folks here will sell you a joint:

http://www.rockforddriveline.com/replacem.htm

(also available @ NAPA in a NAPA box, and slightly more expensive)

 

It is roughly DOUBLE the time than a conventional joint, and certainly nothing to be afraid of.

 

Keep in mind that this is for an EA82 car, not the Hatchback. EA81 car u joints are servicable.

[Frank B]

The hatchback in your avatar is what we're talking about right?

1-0027 is the autozone part number you need.

 

P391 is the Napa number. Precision U-joint 391.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Nissan-240Z-Pathfinder-Subaru-Brat-New-Rear-U-Joint_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1247QQcategoryZ10076QQihZ016QQitemZ260228249983QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/UNIVERSAL-JOINT-NISSAN-SUBARU_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1247QQcategoryZ33738QQihZ010QQitemZ200196574230QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/UNIVERSAL-JOINT-MAZDA-NISSAN-SUBARU_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1247QQcategoryZ33738QQihZ010QQitemZ200190957696QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V

[Frank B]

Oh, and get two. Your gonna have the drive shaft off so you should go ahead and replace both of them. Make sure they have grease fittings on them, some new ones don't. And put a couple pumps of grease in them every time you change your oil. Good luck.

[Reveeen]

Keep in mind that this is for an EA82 car, not the Hatchback. EA81 car u joints are servicable.

 

EA82,EJ18, EJ22, EJ25, the 6 cylinder lumps, they are all replaceable, and quite easily, just as long as you do0n't get carried away with the BFH.

[GeneralDisorder]

And put a couple pumps of grease in them every time you change your oil. Good luck.

 

Really, that's a bad idea. The ones without the zerks are best as they really shouldn't be greased at all unless you dissasemble them and regrease them. You'll overheat the bearings and cause them to fail much quicker if you keep forcing grease in like that.

 

By FAR the biggest cause of bearing failure is over-greasing. A 10 year study of bearing life was done by a major industrial manufacturer and they found on average, the most life was had from bearings that were never greased at all. A thin film of grease is all that is required and continually forcing grease into them will stretch and pop the seals, and allows no air-space for expansion. Remember - most bearings run around 175 to 250 degrees durring operation. More grease means more friction = more heat.

 

GD

[Durania]

GD is right. A lot of the bearings that we ship out of INA (I work for Schaeffler Group) comes with little lables that say "Bearing is designed to never be greased".

[mountaingoatgruff]

By FAR the biggest cause of bearing failure is over-greasing.

 

yeah, i see bearings on our diecutting and corrugating machines at work go to crap all the time cuz guys insist on greaing them till they ooze every week!! you'd think a $480 swiss made bearing would last more than 7 months...

[GeneralDisorder]

yeah, i see bearings on our diecutting and corrugating machines at work go to crap all the time cuz guys insist on greaing them till they ooze every week!! you'd think a $480 swiss made bearing would last more than 7 months...

 

Bearings are a very, very tricky business. I deal with some very expensive bearings in the vacuum pumps I work on as well - SKF, made in Austria type stuff. It's amazing what I see come into the shop - there's still lots of customers that will overgrease anything with a zerk attached to it. Baldor motors for a time removed all the zerks from their motors larger than 100 HP and opted for sealed, non-greaseable bearings. They had so many calls to their customer service hot-line they put the zerks back in just to shut people up.

 

Over-greasing, and contamination are the two biggest causes of failure. Just .002% water contamination will reduce bearing life by around 50%. 6% will reduce it by over 80%.

 

Over-greasing is much more sinister because people always think they are helping. It causes more friction, and the added heat decreases the viscosity of the grease, causeing even more heat as it loses it's ability to support the load. It starts to form a varnish and then begins to "coke". This destroys the ability of the grease to lubricate the bearing and also introduces solid particles into the lubricant.

 

Would you just keep adding oil to your engine without draining some? Same goes for bearings. The ones designed to be greased also have a drain plug - you are supposed to add grease and run the bearing till the old grease drips out and it reaches equilibrium at operating temp. Of course the zerk is on the top, and the drain hole is always on the bottom where people can't see it.

 

GD

[Frank B]

You guys are talking precision bearings designed to never be greased, assembled with synthetic grease, with real rubber, or synthetic material designed to take the high heat and stresses of that particular job, not something that will do the job at the lowest production cost so a profit can be made. You said it yourself, a $480 bearing!!! Your talking about a study by a major industrial manufacturer.....

That's NOT the cheap made in china, india, or wherever bearings that are sold in auto stores today. I've woked on top notch, high-tech german production equipment before and yes, there were bearings like that on them, but that big expensive machine is not my Subaru! It is not exposed to the rain spray, mud, dust and changing temperatures that my little car is. The first thing that any good mechanic needs to know, is what they're working on. There's a specific way to maintain a specific machine, and those rules do not apply to all machines.

I grease the u-joints on my truck and my subaru every time I change the oil. I drive in the rain, the snow, mud, and dusty gravel roads. Every time I put a pump or two in them, a bit of water, and dirty grease comes out. How is that bad??

[mountaingoatgruff]

You guys are talking precision bearings designed to never be greased, assembled with synthetic grease, with real rubber, or synthetic material designed to take the high heat and stresses of that particular job, not something that will do the job at the lowest production cost so a profit can be made. You said it yourself, a $480 bearing!!! Your talking about a study by a major industrial manufacturer.....

That's NOT the cheap made in china, india, or wherever bearings that are sold in auto stores today. I've woked on top notch, high-tech german production equipment before and yes, there were bearings like that on them, but that big expensive machine is not my Subaru! It is not exposed to the rain spray, mud, dust and changing temperatures that my little car is. The first thing that any good mechanic needs to know, is what they're working on. There's a specific way to maintain a specific machine, and those rules do not apply to all machines.

I grease the u-joints on my truck and my subaru every time I change the oil. I drive in the rain, the snow, mud, and dusty gravel roads. Every time I put a pump or two in them, a bit of water, and dirty grease comes out. How is that bad??

 

 

i'm sure the manufacturers of decent auomotive bearings can tell you what the service interval is for their product. i'm not going to argue that its bad to pump more grease into a bearing that's got water or dirt in it but i doubt that simply pumping more grease in would fully eliminate the contamination.

[Frank B]

Every u joint I replaced due to failure, had no grease in it, had water in it, or the grease was so hard that it did not do it's job. You repack wheel bearings right? You change lubricating oils, why not grease.

[mountaingoatgruff]

i've only had u-joints go bad on me once and that was in my old 79 gmc 3/4 ton. i had the thing way overloaded with wrought iron stair balusters and drove 80 miles that way in the dead of summer two years ago, pulling over occasionally to cool down. after that day the u-joints started popping when shifting and the truck developed tranny issues later on. the stuff may have been on it's way out but either way - that's the only time i've ever had bad u-joints. my point: i don't even mess with them. i grease serviceable ball joints, repack wheel bearings and all that but i don't even look for zerks on u-joints.

[GeneralDisorder]

Every u joint I replaced due to failure, had no grease in it, had water in it, or the grease was so hard that it did not do it's job. You repack wheel bearings right? You change lubricating oils, why not grease.

 

The key words are "change" and "repack".

 

The problem with a U-joint is that you can't do either without truely dissasembling them. Thus over-greasing is a problem and one that manufacturers have solved by removing the zerks. You won't find them on u-joints in any new vehicles (or ball-joints, tie-rod ends, ect). Forceing grease out through the edges of the seals breaks them away from their sealing surface and when the grease heats up and cools down it will suck contaminates (water and particulate) back into the joint. You are seeing water and dirty grease come out because you have broken the seals by continually pumping grease into them. If you leave them alone they will last far, far longer.

 

The best way you can care for the u-joints is to keep them clean on the outside so dirt doesn't have a chance to work it's way under the seals.

 

I was just talking about a similar thing with one of the older techs at work. 35 years ago he worked for a Ford dealership and had a customer that insisted on having his oil, oil filter, and air filter changed every 3,000 miles and did NOTHING else to the car. He specifically made it clear that he wanted nothing on the chassis greased or lubricated. In the time my friend worked there he went through 3 cars - sold each of them at 200,000 miles (all without a single failure). The 4th one he brought in at 100,000 and my friend thought he would do the man an extra special service and greased the chassis (for free) - adding zerks to the joints (Ford did not put them in stock) and the man was so irate that he sold it immediately and bought a new car.

 

Regardless of whether the bearing was made in china, the ukrain or Austria it will last longer without contaminated grease. Adding more grease is not better and will not make them last longer - it will break down the grease that's in there (through heat, friction, and pressure), and will cause further contamination and degradetion of the lubrication.

 

The only time I've wantonly pumped grease into u-joints is when they were completely frozen and I needed to get to home/parts store/out of the woods, ect. But that's also when you pee in the radiator and pour engine oil into the brake reservoir too..... emergencies will call for drastic action at times.

 

GD

[jacobs]

The only u-joints, tie rod ends, shackles, drag links, & etc I've had fail in the 45 years I've been driving were the newer cheep zerkless garbage that was factory installed and I'm still driving vehicles I purchased in the 1960's. I wrenched professionally for 15 years as a heavy equipment mechanic and the main reason for failures then was when the crews did NOT grease the equipment as required. If greasing was bad, heavy equipment manufactures wouldn't put grease zerks on $500,000+ equipment. The more expensive the equipment, the MORE grease zerks there are.

[sidekickin]

Hey everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback. I appreciate it. The car is an '87 EA-81 hatchback, as shown in my avatar. I purchased the u-joint at Autozone and replaced the bad one last night. When I got the old u-joint off and inspected it, there wasn't much left of it. Under 2 of the caps the bearings were completely disintegrated into a fine rusty dust. And under the other 2 caps there was no grease and the needle bearings were all rusty. Good thing I replaced it when I did. And wow, what a difference it made. The car is completely smooth now with no vibrations. Thanks everyone for your help!

[Frank B]

Hey everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback. I appreciate it. The car is an '87 EA-81 hatchback, as shown in my avatar. I purchased the u-joint at Autozone and replaced the bad one last night. When I got the old u-joint off and inspected it, there wasn't much left of it. Under 2 of the caps the bearings were completely disintegrated into a fine rusty dust. And under the other 2 caps there was no grease and the needle bearings were all rusty. Good thing I replaced it when I did. And wow, what a difference it made. The car is completely smooth now with no vibrations. Thanks everyone for your help!

 

Your welcome, that's why the board is here.

[Frank B]

The only u-joints, tie rod ends, shackles, drag links, & etc I've had fail in the 45 years I've been driving were the newer cheep zerkless garbage that was factory installed and I'm still driving vehicles I purchased in the 1960's. I wrenched professionally for 15 years as a heavy equipment mechanic and the main reason for failures then was when the crews did NOT grease the equipment as required. If greasing was bad, heavy equipment manufactures wouldn't put grease zerks on $500,000+ equipment. The more expensive the equipment, the MORE grease zerks there are.

 

Yes, right on, and thank you for your input.