Bucky92 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I was following hatchsubs thread on his possible head gasket failure..he asked me to check mine to see if I had any bubbles in tha radiator....well I wish I never would have looked...I dont have bubbles..mine foams. So needless to say...mines done for a long time now.. guess I wont be in a hurry for my digi-analog swap edit:...lost over a half gallon of coolant in 5 minutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backwoodsboy Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Sorry about the headgaskets. :-\ Welcome to the "I have a BIG project on the back-burner" club! I cant even take my brat out this year until I change the clutch! Fun Fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 I just emailed CCR...think one of those is going to be in LBs future...but then again...knowing that the tranny is on the way out and the digi dash nightmare...this whole project may end up being a complete wash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audio_file Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 sounds like you're havin' a tough time connie . . . sorry (rock goin' down the one-way road, LB bein' a bit more fun than you'd planned). i'm there too. the weather finally gets better here in seattle for the summer, and i'm really bummed about not havin my G35 anymore, missin' those fun summer drives and shows. back-in-black's stuck in the garage on stands because i don't have the $ to grab the cams i want before i can put the heads back on . . . so its just me and my soobiewagon, which just isn't cutting the cheddar as a "cool guy" summer car. :-\ for what it's worth, once LB is done, you are going to forget about all the days like this and just enjoy the heck out of that car, because it'll be practically new!! chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaru360 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I've got the EA81 here that was in the superoo. It's apart now it looked great inside and there is a new factory gasket set to go with it. I can sell you that really cheap, like say $100. The guy who owns it really doesn't care what I do with it, I'll just put it towards what he owes me. I'll even put the engine back together for you. I've got a trans also, is yours 4WD, I forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reveeen Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 foam? To satisfy a curiosity I have, would you consider dumping what you have in there for coolant, and try plain old water (after giving it a good flushing, with, again, plain old water)? (the only time I have seen foam like that is when windshield washer anti-freeze was used for coolant) Just a *thought*. (the boiling point of WWasher fluid is really low, but it can be used to store a non-running vehicle, in colder climates, when you don't want to spend the money on "real" anti-freeze) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 I've got the EA81 here that was in the superoo. It's apart now it looked great inside and there is a new factory gasket set to go with it. I can sell you that really cheap, like say $100. The guy who owns it really doesn't care what I do with it, I'll just put it towards what he owes me. I'll even put the engine back together for you. I've got a trans also, is yours 4WD, I forget. No mine is a FWD 5spd. Waiting to hear back from CCR about some things before I make my final decision. All I know is I am not wasting any effort on a 235K mile motor and for what CCR charges which includes shipping and return of core shipping..it is probably the best way to go. Thanks for the offer ..who knows I may take you up on it. Looks like ALOT of OT is in my future if I go this route. Not very happy ..this wasnt supposed to be this much of a project...definately bit off more then I can chew on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 foam? To satisfy a curiosity I have, would you consider dumping what you have in there for coolant, and try plain old water (after giving it a good flushing, with, again, plain old water)? (the only time I have seen foam like that is when windshield washer anti-freeze was used for coolant) Just a *thought*. (the boiling point of WWasher fluid is really low, but it can be used to store a non-running vehicle, in colder climates, when you don't want to spend the money on "real" anti-freeze) The car didnt start running hot until after its trip to the Carlisle Import Car Show ( 600 miles round trip)..It has classic symptoms..plus it has a new OEM T stat. Here is the deal...took radiator cap off to do a test for hatchsub.....started car...ran for a good 5 minutes before T-stat opened..no bubbles...t-stat opens..starts as a couple bubbles..then progressively gets worse till it lookd like it does in the pictures..and starts dumping out the overflow. Kept dumping even after turning car off....total coolant loss= half gallon When it did have a working guage..it was running between 5-6 bars on the digi...for those who dont know..6 bars is one before going red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 EA81 head gaskets are the easiest head gaskets out there. Really. You can do it. It is, after all, just a gasket. With the EA81 there's no timing belts, no cams, ect. It couldn't be easier. The parts are less than $100 for everything you could potentially need. You can do both, and have it back together in a weekend (I could easily do both in 4 to 5 hours). Ask yourself - what scares you about this job so much? Is it the vacuum lines and the potential to get things hooked up wrong? No problem - spend $30 and get 3M wire number tapes. Label everything, and take digital pictures as you go. Put bolts into ziplock bags labled accordingly. Is it that you are afraid of breaking something or not having the right tool? No problem there either - first this isn't your primary transportation, and second if you need a tool or break something it will still be a lot cheaper than a CCR motor (which you don't need), and you'll learn something, or have a tool you might need another day. So... what is it exactly that makes a simple head gasket replacement so frightful? Is it just the unknown, and that it's been hyped-up so massively by the general public? I mean - at least read through the procedure (I can scan it for you - I think the HTKYSA PDF has an excelent section on it too), and give it an honest assesment. Really there is nothing to be afraid of - and there is almost no potential for you to screw anything up - no engine internals are dealt with besides the rockers and push-rods. It's a LOT easier and less frustrating than the digi-to-analog swap I can tell you that. You are 10 years my senior - you deserve to teach yourself this - it will put your mechanical ability at a whole new level and open doors for you to be comfortable doing much, much more with your cars. Soon you'll be contemplating the SPFI swap.... no joke. You are already comfortable with wireing.... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 GD..I dont have a hoist or a stand or half the tool needed...and its a known fact that everything I touch turns to poo.. I am still up in the air if I am even going to fix it right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaru360 Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Don't give up on it, I liked that car. You don't need a hoist or stand for an EA81, you can just pick them out by hand. We do it in the junkyards. If you really think you are over your head I could swap it for you, I don't charge a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 Probably going to find it in the for sale section by then end of the week...didnt want this big of a project Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 John and i are in the chat room right now discussing this. We will take a weekend and come get LB back on the road. Headgaskets are not bad at all on these engines. You have a virtually rust free coupe..now its just a matter of finishing it up. Dont give it up just yet. Something tells me if you do you will regret it for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backwoodsboy Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 +1 A year ago, I was leery of H/G replacement too.... Why? ...because it had been "hyped" so much by the ignorant public. Meh. :-\ After reading the HTKYSA manual.... it is cake. Literally one "step" above a brake job. If you are leery of using your old motor (I would not be) I have one (actually its Jess's) that has approx 116,000 on it ...and ALSO needs H/Gaskets. I could have the heads machined at my buddy's shop (cheap) and put it together for you. It would be drag and drop to switch out your old engine. Jess and I would gladly spend the 20 bucks in gas... and come out for a Sat/Sun and get that sweet PNW coupe back in action for ya! Then it would be on to fun stuff like leveling out the back end and making it look perfect! EDIT : If you REALLY want to sell it... I will buy it off of you, fix it, and sell it back to you the next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 i'm hearing you on the 235k stuff, that is a lot of miles. i thought this was a low mileage vehicle, is that a different engine? i wonder how long it's been bad, if it was ever driven like that by the previous owner of the engine? i'd wonder as well. GD..I dont have a hoist or a stand or half the tool needed. sounds like EA81's are easier than EA82's - and they aren't hard at all. air tools and a ratcheting 10mm make it easier. i'm about to start one this morning. on an EA82 anyone using a hoist or stand is wasting time. it's nice, but everything else being equal it's faster without. good luck girl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Did you change out the water pump? I would definitely throw on a 40 dollar water pump, and try that first. My brat I got from Cali, the water pump was going out just from sitting for so long the seals started to leak. I wasn't getting any bubbling like you, but it would run a little warmer than i liked and it started to drip coolant from the pump shaft after i drove it the first several hundred miles, running down the edge of the block, and finally onto the exhaust. Was wierd the pump wasn't noticeable leaking my first hundred miles on the car, but then i guess the seals were just old enough when i began runnning her, it would leak, mainly leaked after i stopped the engine, at first i thought it was overflow leak, but i jacked up the car, looked and it was leaking from right at the water pump.. never a problem since the water pump change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audio_file Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 they aren't hard at all. air tools and a ratcheting 10mm make it easier. i'm about to start one this morning. on an EA82 anyone using a hoist or stand is wasting time. it's nice, but everything else being equal it's faster without. good luck girl air tools aren't needed (agreed, they would be nice . . . ), one eye and i completely removed his brat's engine and transmission and then reinstalled the whole she-bang (after an unfotunate trans-eating mudding incident) in about 4 hours, and it only took that long because he was stuck with me as an assistant no air tools, lotsa mud in the way, but he was back out mudding before the end of the day head gaskets ARE easy, its just a step by step, follow the FSM process. (and if you get good gaskets, you don't need to go back in there and re-torque) lets go connie, git 'er dun!! chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucky92 Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 Not messing with a 235K mile motor... I am in talks with CCR for a new motor.Then it depends on sourcing out a good tranny...not one thats been sitting for years and years in weeds in unknown condition..I only want to do this once. After all the headaches and BS I had with my XT6....not to mention the HUGE loss of money invested in the POS ( I am so happy its gone and cant wait to see the pics of it chopped into little bits). I want known good..not questionable. It took one 600 mile trip to take this motor out.It was fine before the Carlisle show...after the trip the oil leak was 100xs worse and it seemed to run alittle hot. Basically.. if I hear what I want from CCR then thats the way I am going I am working a buttload of OT to be able to afford this ..I want it repaired right. on a side note: I am suprised my husband is even agreeing with getting the CCR over repairing mine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaru_dude Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Doing the headgaskets would be just as much trouble as swapping out motors, but cheaper. 235K? Low mileage. Seen plenty of EA81s with way more than that. Aren't they good for 400,000+ when well mantained? Headgaskets are a 3-4 day job if you've never done them. It's an EA81, easiest possible thing to do headgaskets on. Instead of working all that OT (which will probably just make you hate your car in the long run) go the cheap route and just do the headgaskets if that's all that's wrong. A CCR engine is overkill. And you're gonna need an engine hoist either way, so you might as well make it as easy on yourself as possible. Don't forget, this isn't an ER27 and won't bite the hand that feeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Aren't they good for 400,000+ when well mantained? Thats the key. Whos to say if hers has been well maintained. at 235k someone could have forgotten to change the oil for 10k or let little stuff slide too long. 116,000 like whats on Johns however...thats low for an EA81. And a ton cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaru_dude Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Thats the key. Whos to say if hers has been well maintained. at 235k someone could have forgotten to change the oil for 10k or let little stuff slide too long. 116,000 like whats on Johns however...thats low for an EA81. And a ton cheaper. I guess a good indication to knowing how well it's been mantained is compression #'s as well as how much oil it burns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 GD..I dont have a hoist or a stand or half the tool needed...and its a known fact that everything I touch turns to poo.. No hoist or stand required. HG's are easily done in the vehicle - especially on EA81's. And with the help of the board and it's members, how could it turn to poo? Collectively we have solved so much worse.... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3eyedwagon Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 No hoist or stand required. HG's are easily done in the vehicle - especially on EA81's. And with the help of the board and it's members, how could it turn to poo? Collectively we have solved so much worse.... GD Amen. If I had given in all the times my wagon had given me problems, that thing would probably be a new Subaru by now. Even now, it sits with a blown transmission, and a bent tie rod. But it is all stuff that I am plenty confident in fixing. It even gives me a good chance to check things out while I've got it all apart. Could be worse, it could be wrapped around a phone pole, or rusting out.... Everyone here is right, you gotta keep your chin up, and in the end.... you, and your car will be better for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 236k on the motor in my hatch - excelent power (Weber right now), doesn't burn much oil, and I fixed all the oil leaks. Really - that's fairly low mileage for an EA81. Listen - I know these engines - inside and out. Take $100 and a weekend and do the head gaskets. Trust me - if it doesn't work you are out a couple days and $100 and you'll already have half the familarity with the process you need to put in the CCR engine. It simply IS NOT worth the investment of a CCR engine. While I understand that you like the car and wish to restore it - it's worth virtually peanuts to all but a very select crew (mostly here). And in the comming years it will actually be worth more if the engine is original. And if, sometime down the road, the thing does blow completely up, you can put in the CCR engine or have them rebuild your's. The head gaskets are done in the car. Let me break it down for you: 1. Drain coolant. 2. Drop y-pipe. Nothing you haven't done before I'm sure. 3. Pull manifold - label everything. I'm assuming you have removed a manifold before right? 6 bolts and a flare fitting for the EGR. Take your time and don't break the bolts, but don't worry too much - the heads are comming off so if you have to have a bolt removed it's cheap - $25 or so. It will have to be done anyway with a CCR engine - or even with a Weber swap as you need the Hitachi manifold for the Weber. 4. Remove valve covers (you have done that before too I'm sure). 4 bolts here. 5. Pull the two head bolts that hold the rocker arms on and remove them (though an access hole in the fender well - you just pop out a rubber plug directly opposite the bolts). Remove the push-rods and label them (4 on each side) for location. 6. Pull the remaining head bolts and seperate the head from the block at the gasket. 7. Inspect everything - post pictures here, ect, ect. 8. Clean, Clean, Clean. Razor blades, degreaser, etc for the mating surfaces. A fine wire wheel chucked into a drill works well for the manifold, block and heads. Just a light hit though - major chunks should be removed with the razor blades. 9. Reinstall the heads with new gaskets - oil the bolts and torque them to 55 Ft/lbs in the correct sequence starting at 20 lbs, then 40, and then 55. A $10 harbor freight torque wrench is all you need. 10. New manifold and y-pipe gaskets and reinstall both. 11. Hoses - anything else you removed. Fill with coolant. 12. Done. Really - this is not the bad job people think it is, and you are more than qualified. You have a socket set right? That's all you need - borrow a torque wrench or buy the $10 HF unit. It works just fine for what you will be doing. You have the tools, and with the board and your manuals you have the knowledge. The difference it will make on your confidence level is worth the investment. You almost can't fail with a job this easy. Remember how easy people told you the rear discs were? It was true wasn't it? With Rob and the rest of us you can easily do HG's. Anything that might come up any of us can solve over the phone - your support network is amazing and you don't have to rely on the car for transportation - there's people out there that would kill for those advantages. Use them - that's all I'm asking. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samneric Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 The head gaskets are done in the car. Let me break it down for you: GD ...and piccys here so you can see how it looks without having to lift it out http://www.alonzostreet.com/steve/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=408 Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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