sleepylegacy Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Tourqe Bind ok so I have been reading about the TB and it is when the AWD doesnt kick in right? Also the slows down when turning and clicks alot or somthing like that? so it is a solanoid problem right? mostly in the automatics? cause I have a 1990 legacy LS wagon 5 speed. and I am guessing I could get the TB problem. how would I fix it? and I still am not sure what it TB is. 4wd 1.So driving in the snow in my legacy got stuck a couple of times and my friend said that my back tires were the only ones moving. then I rolled back on the hill a little bit then popped the clutch got up the hill fine. my friend said when i popped the clutch that time all tires moved. all my tires are the same size same tread wear. am I having TB problems? When taking turns the car doesnt slow down or click or clunk. (Changed the Front half shafts) but the thing I dont get is the car says "FullTime 4wd" on the dash, and 4wd on the hatch. when I chaged the half shaft's I got the awd tranny and everything for AWD.I looked under the hood and didnt see the 4wd fuse holder. 2.How does the "Fulltime 4wd" work in my car? done my search on the 4wd all i seen is forums that talk about the fuse holder. This is my first subaru so I will asking alot of Q, but I do search before I ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 welcome aboard boss. clicking is not a torque bind problem. your friend saw the back tires spinning. thing is, maybe he was on the side, and didn't see the front on the other side was spinning? the way differentials work really in bad terrain if your spinning you should have one rear and one front spinning, but they'll be on opposite sides. drivers side rear and passengers side front or passengers side rear and drivers side front. likely he was on one side and just didnt' see the other? torque bind is not as you described, it's when you are essentially in "locked" 4WD all that time. and it is most prominent in auto's, not manuals. it is possible in manuals but it's all different failures modes because those transmissions are completely different systems. the definitive test for torque bind comes int he opposite terrain of what you described - a parking lot. taking tight turns, steering wheel turned at full lock and the car will feel as if it's slowing down, binding signficantly because the front and rear tires can't turn at different rates. tons and tons and tons of info on here about it. insert the FWD fuse and if it goes away, that's torque bind. due a transmission flush or 3 or so fluid changes immediately and it might alleviate it if you're lucky. mismatched tires, lack of fluid changing, lack of rotating, and improper towing will cause torque bind. good chance older ones have seen some of those conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 sounds like you don't have torque bind....have you checked to make sure you have a rear differential and axles on the rear? maybe it's disconnected? FWD and AWD front axles are identical/interchangeable, so that doesn't mean anything that you ordered 4WD axles for the fronts. check to make sure all your 4WD components are hooked up - driveshaft comign out the back of the trans, rear diff, and rear axles. if your buddy said "the rears were spinning" and the front wasn't, sounds like it's all there. if you don't have binding in parking lots like i described int he post above, it's hard to believe you have torque bind. ATF flush is still a good thing. tires all match? i would make sure you don't have a bad front axle. you probably bought an aftermarket axle, they suck horribly. i've had brand new ones break in less than a week. if you have an axle freewheeling inside it's boot then your front diff is spinning, but the tire is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simbey1982 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 yeah if you have tourque bind you will know it.....when i had it in my 4EAT impreza it felt like i had a square wheel...it was bad...so i swapped to a 5MT and was good AWD is diffrent than 4WD you have some good explainations above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 insert the FWD fuse and if it goes away, that's torque bind. due a transmission flush or 3 or so fluid changes immediately Sleepy is a 5 speed, I do not think this applies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 How does the "Fulltime 4wd" work in my car? done my search on the 4wd all i seen is forums that talk about the fuse holder. Your AWD is totally mechanical, it is a viscous coupling in the rear housing of the tranny. When the front shaft spins faster than the rear shaft, the viscous fluid heats then thickens and connects the rear to the front. Hope this helps. Read more here if you wish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscous_coupling Only automatics use the fuse as they have an electronically, via hydraulic solenoid, controlled clutch pack to bring in the rear drive This is my first subaru so I will asking alot of Q, but I do search before I ask. Thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 (edited) An earlier suggestion was to change the transmission fluid; not really applicable since you have a manual transmission. Torque bind: Currently I'm having that issue with our '99 Forester which has the 5MT transmission. Symptoms are when turning at full lock (first gear and slow), the car goes "thump, thump, thump" and doesn't move forward smoothly while turning. It happens when turned in either direction, and is even noticeable in reverse. I had my opinion confirmed by a professional Subaru mechanic this past weekend. The only real fix is to replace the viscous coupler in the center diff. Another fix would be to replace the transmission if you find a suitable used one at a low price. One thing I didn't see mentioned. Check the tread depth on all four tires. If one or two tires are different by even a small amount it can give you the same symptoms. Of course you have all the same size tires on all four wheels, right? Also verify the air pressures are the same in all tires. Edited January 14, 2009 by edrach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Guys, and Gals, settle down. He doesn't have any problems at all. He said he wondered if his car COULD get torque bind. And yes, assuming it has all 4 axles, a center driveline, a rear diff and an AWD transmission, then yes, yes it could. But it doesn't happen nearly that often on a manual. If he had it[TB], he likely would have gotten out of the situation he described lol I think mostly he just needed to know about his open diffs (my front tire isn't spinning) He also didn't know what excactly Torque Bind is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepylegacy Posted January 14, 2009 Author Share Posted January 14, 2009 "Your AWD is totally mechanical, it is a viscous coupling in the rear housing of the tranny. When the front shaft spins faster than the rear shaft, the viscous fluid heats then thickens and connects the rear to the front. Hope this helps." 4WD: So my 4wd is mechanical, run by the viscous coupling, by the fluid heating up and turning in to a glue like state to connect the rear to the front. pretty much is how the 4wd works in my car. reading from the link givin to me. that help alot. ok. if any more Q i know were to look. TB: so for me to get TB I would know if I had it then, makes great for driving in the snow or mudding then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepylegacy Posted January 14, 2009 Author Share Posted January 14, 2009 ok, so after reading the Viscous Coupling, and the 4WD VS AWD, that is 4wd not 4x4, cause 4x4 you the driver control the 2wd or 4wd, then you got the 4H,4L and 2H, I know what those are for. and so on. 4WD: well I am wondering if the viscous Coupling activates the Rearwheel when the front slips or Visa/Versa does that mean I am driving in 2wd till a wheel slips? 1990 Legacy Wagon LS 5 Speed 240+k and going And I do got the Front and rear axles and rear diff, everything is connected, and its all there. If not i can go and drive in the mud to find out and get stuck lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 ok, so after reading the Viscous Coupling, and the 4WD VS AWD, that is 4wd not 4x4, cause 4x4 you the driver control the 2wd or 4wd, then you got the 4H,4L and 2H, I know what those are for. and so on. We call it AWD by convention, it not true All Wheel Drive but what you say is is the jist of it. 4WD: well I am wondering if the viscous Coupling activates the Rearwheel when the front slips or Visa/Versa does that mean I am driving in 2wd till a wheel slips? Yes you are driving in Front Wheel Drive (FWD) until one of or both of the front wheels spin at a higher rate of speed than the back (spinning tire) Then the fluid heats/thickens and connects the rear drive. I thought I read that already? And I do got the Front and rear axles and rear diff, everything is connected, and its all there. If not i can go and drive in the mud to find out and get stuck lol Be aware it has been said many many times, the vicous coupling is not as good as the good old locked in 4WD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Yes you are driving in Front Wheel Drive (FWD) until one of or both of the front wheels spin at a higher rate of speed than the back (spinning tire) Then the fluid heats/thickens and connects the rear drive. Actually, it is just a conventional diff with spiders and pinion that power goes to the path of least resistance, wether it be front or backs that first begin spinning. If all you're wheels are all in contact with the road it is true ALL WHEEL DRIVE. every wheel has equal traction so recieves equal power But let's say the rear wheel spins on ice, the front axles will actually lose some power(it will retain an amount equal to whatever limited traction the slipping wheel is getting, down to zero) Drive power will be increaswed again as the fluid in the diff heats. Then the front gets power. If the front where to spin first, then the same would happen oppositely, rear losing some drive til the VC heats up and sends power rear. This is true of the 5mt transmissions only 4EAT automatics are true FWD with a secondary power transfer to rear controled by hydraulic clutches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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