kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 i have an ea81 GL wagon. just had a shop put in new front axles. Still getting a lot of noise from the front end. sounds like a box of marbles. definitely driveline/steering, etc. both axles and lower ball joints are brand new, like 300 miles on them. any thoughts? steering is tight, no wobbles at speed, no clicking of cv's like when the cv's were busted, pre-replacement... wheel bearings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubaruJunkie Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 Yeah probably. However, if you had a shop replace both CV joints, they would have been able to tell immediately that a bearing was bad, and if it was a reputable shop they should have warned you and not even installed the CV's without replacing the bearings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruguru Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 i think its your bearings like junkie said. i would check that out if i was you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) . Edited February 3, 2009 by kodiak1232003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 Yeah probably. However, if you had a shop replace both CV joints, they would have been able to tell immediately that a bearing was bad, and if it was a reputable shop they should have warned you and not even installed the CV's without replacing the bearings. yeah, its a good shop, "elite automotive" in el cajon (san diego) The shop replaced the axles, installed new lower ball joints and adjusted my brakes all for the same labor fee. He told me he checked out the bearings and they seemed fine. I wonder, do these older-style bearings start out noisy in the morning when its very cold? are they noisy before the grease released its oil? cuz i don't notice the noise much at all on my commute home @ 3pm. Only when the car starts rolling/turning in the cold/dark morning hours. (i go to work @ 5:30am...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 Let me Tell you that the inner Coupler, the one who attach the Constant Velocity Joints to the Gearbox`s Differential, are Almost the Same like the ones at the Other End: The Wheels. They Spin but They Don`t Turn, Just Go Up and Down with the Wheels and they have the same Six Big Balls Bearing inside. Due to its Age / Use \ Runnin` Without Grease, They Makes the Same Bad Axle Noise when They`re Worn... So I Suggest you to Check them Too! Kind Regards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 Let me Tell you that the inner Coupler, the one who attach the Constant Velocity Joints to the Gearbox`s Differential, are Almost the Same like the ones at the Other End: The Wheels. They Spin but They Don`t Turn, Just Go Up and Down with the Wheels and they have the same Six Big Balls Bearing inside. Due to its Age / Use \ Runnin` Without Grease, They Makes the Same Bad Axle Noise when They`re Worn... So I Suggest you to Check them Too! Kind Regards! just to clarify, you're talking about a bearing that the inner axle stub (the end with the drift pin in it) rides on...is that correct? or are you talking about the inner CV joint...the one closest to the tranny? i think, the former, if so, would these make noise when turning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 Lug nuts and/or axle nut's are loose. If it's the axle nuts then you likely need to replace the cone washers and possibly the hubs they ride in to get them to stay tight and not wear/loosen with time. You can't simply tighten the axle nut if the cone washer is worn as it has no mechanical locking abilities if the taper is trashed. It will spin, wear, and loosen till you replace it. And find anther shop or do it yourself next time. They are morons. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one eye Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 Lug nuts and/or axle nut's are loose. If it's the axle nuts then you likely need to replace the cone washers and possibly the hubs they ride in to get them to stay tight and not wear/loosen with time. You can't simply tighten the axle nut if the cone washer is worn as it has no mechanical locking abilities if the taper is trashed. It will spin, wear, and loosen till you replace it. And find anther shop or do it yourself next time. They are morons. GD +1 on this, If you drive real slow and listen outside of the car, it will sounds like a creaking shoe, that's probably it, And like GD said, there is no way to fix it other than replace the cone washers and nut. Also once you go to do it make sure that the other one is at 142-145ft lbs. you don't want to have to go through all of it again....... Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 +1 on this, If you drive real slow and listen outside of the car, it will sounds like a creaking shoe, that's probably it, And like GD said, there is no way to fix it other than replace the cone washers and nut. Also once you go to do it make sure that the other one is at 142-145ft lbs. you don't want to have to go through all of it again....... Jeff great advice...i'll go check em out right now. BTW, this shop comes highly recommended, and all they do is subaru's. Been in el cajon for 30 years. Not defending them, if it's their mistake, just trying to allude to the fact that they aren't the local joe-shmoe shade-tree shop. again, humble thanks...be right back...(axle socket in hand) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSubaruJunkie Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 So what did this "Subaru Only for 30 years" shop say when you asked them about this problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 So what did this "Subaru Only for 30 years" shop say when you asked them about this problem? honestly, i've been noticing it off and on for the last week or so, and have been busy enough that I'm just now trying to troubleshoot. haven't talked to 'em yet. the work they did has a 12month warranty, so we'll see how that measures up if i need them to make it "right" -Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 just to clarify, you're talking about a bearing that the inner axle stub (the end with the drift pin in it) rides on...is that correct? or are you talking about the inner CV joint...the one closest to the tranny? i think, the former, if so, would these make noise when turning? The inner CV Joint, Closest to the Tranny... Please Excuse my English... sometimes I`m Lost in Translation. Kind Regards & Good Luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) alright, well i went outside and checked...all 8 lugnuts tight. both axle nuts on snug/tight w/shiny new cotter pins. as far as i can tell the re-install was just fine. oh, and to loyale 2.0 turbo...the whole shaft was replaced to the tune of $80.00 per side-parts. I saw the parts and then I.D'd them on the rig after installation. shaft/splines are nice and fresh, and boots are (all 4) brand new with new "crimp clamps/collars" or whatever you call them... i understand what you say about the cone washers being trashed and causing problems. do you have any pics of said part or a shot of a bad one? thanks. Edited February 3, 2009 by kodiak1232003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=80735&highlight=axle+cone+washer this poster describes my problem pretty similarly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 You can't check the axle nuts without removing the cotter pin - they should be torqued to 150 ft/lbs. The cone washer is directly under the nut & spring washer. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 (edited) You can't check the axle nuts without removing the cotter pin - they should be torqued to 150 ft/lbs. The cone washer is directly under the nut & spring washer. GD hey thanks for posting. I actually pulled both cotter pins out and used a long breaker bar/axle nut socket and leaned all 270lbs of me on it. no movement. don't have a torque wrench right now, though. and thanks for the description of the components. that helps me picture whats going on assembly-wise in that area. this morning I made a realization...the noise goes away when warm. Its simply gone. there was no noise putting around my parking lot at work, after my 20 min drive on San diego freeways from home, (where the noise was rather noticable pulling out of my driveway and turning onto my street). literally...no noise at work...???...If someone listened to it driving around, they'd hear nothing, as i had the door open doing 2 - 5mph donuts, backing up and turning,etc.... I think thats why i didn't notice it till recently. probably had my ipod turned up leaving my driveway, and when i turn it off in my parking lot before i park it, there are no noises to be heard...LOL...this car certainly does have a personality! Edited February 3, 2009 by kodiak1232003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 Sounds like a subaru Yeah, I'm in agreement with Loyale 2.7 turbo The inner cv axle bearings may be the problem. And on that shop, just because they've been around a long time doesn't mean that they are the best shop to go to. We have a shop that's been around almost 25 years and they misdiagnosed my problems twice. Both time they said it was detrimental damage and it just turned out to be a bad fuel injector and the other is unknown, for now. :frustrated: Twitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 understood on the shop, guys....i'm not defending them, I simply understood the work being done and observed a complete install, with no wierdness, so I'm just at a loss as to this remaining noise. so would a complete disassembly of the tranny be involved to get the bearings out? at the very least i'd have to pull the axles right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 I think they mean the inner cv joints which are on the axle, it;s the closest joint to the tranny. They can be bad right out of the box!! What brand was the axles? A lot of aftermarket cv axles are problematic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiak1232003 Posted February 3, 2009 Author Share Posted February 3, 2009 I think they mean the inner cv joints which are on the axle, it;s the closest joint to the tranny. They can be bad right out of the box!! What brand was the axles? A lot of aftermarket cv axles are problematic. ah! i heard bearings and got distracted, i forgot that loyale clarified what he meant. I'm not exactly sure on the brand, but I believe they were new cuz we called around to local parts houses and only found reman'd. We then found a parts house in L.A. that had NEW shafts and chose those ones. I'm going to call him today and ask him about the whole issue. any ideas on the "getting warm and no noise" thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted February 3, 2009 Share Posted February 3, 2009 I've had many cv axles do that. They get the grease moving around and warmed up and the noise goes away. Hopefully that's the issue because there will be a warranty on them and they aren't too hard to change. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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