Replacing 96 2.5 w/97 2.2 canister question

[davebugs]

o.k. I've always put off doing a 96 but it's Blue - and I'm tired of Green(I don't like Green to begin with). One owner, new tires, etc.

 

Anyways I have a donor 97 2.2 auto (w/EGR) but the 96 had the emissions canister up front by the rad. The 97 doesn't have this plumbing. I already scrapped the 97.

 

Will I get a CEL(I can't have one).

 

Should I try and chase down a 95 w/EGR? (I also have the Y pipe from the 2.2).

 

 

I've done a decent amount of swaps but don't remember this particular problem. But then again my memory isn't that great.

 

I'm stalled a day with the old engine out. and not able to re-seal the 2.2 going in so I thought I'd ask.

 

Dave

[porcupine73]

I think grossgary did this kind of swap some time back, maybe he would know. From what I can remember it's a bit of a headache to go EGR to non EGR, and it sounds like the '97 might have had the enhanced evap setup with the canister underneath by the fuel tank instead of the older setup where it was in the engine bay.

[davebugs]

Both engines have the EGR valve. It's where those hoses run to (or don't run to) that's the issue.

 

I don't recall if the canister was in the RR wheel well on the 97 donor but it pretty much had to be. The filler tube was totally shot so I didn't poke around any more in that area.

[porcupine73]

Ah ok, it might depend on which ECU you use then. Whichever ECU is used it will certainly be looking for the valves and stuff that evap setup is supposed to have.

[88whitecat]

On the 97 the tank pipe goes straight to the purge solenoid through the pipe that is underneath the manifold. The 96 goes from the tank pipe to the canister then to the purge solenoid.

 

What you have to do is disconnect the pipe under the manifold from the solenoid and ignore it from then on. Using some vaccuum tubing and a butt type connector go straight from the tank pipe the canister (tank port) Then with a shorter piece of tubing go from the canister (purge port) to the purge solenoid. There is a one way valve inline on oneside or the other I dont remember which. You may also need a couple of tees so that the map and pressure exchange solenoid are tied in right. It depend how much of the 96 vac hoses were pulled out. Ultimately it should be schematically identical to the under hood label.

 

Can maybe post pix after work.

 

P.S. Dont use cheap connectors! I used some advanced auto universal ones where you cut off the smaller sizes you dont need, but they were a muti-piece modular component type of constuction that fell apart and caused vaccuum leaks

 

PPS use 96 ECM

[davebugs]

Anything you could to to paint me a better picture would be great.

 

I won't get to installing the 97 2.2 until sunday late afternoon at the earliest.

 

I was trying to find out how difficult it was gonna be to determine whether I should just hunt down a 95 even though I have the known good 97 2.2 here.

[porcupine73]

I know on endwrench there's a good article that explains how the newer enhanced evap setup works, showing all the components, schematics, etc., might have even had comparison details to the older style. Maybe go there and search archives for 'evap' it will probably come up.

[davebugs]

I will do that this evening - thanks for the suggestion. I think of endwrench for procedures more than for explanations.

 

I have the worst time searching on that site.

 

I even have bookmarks to TB writeups, HG writeups. But if I try to search for them often I can't find them. Luckily I've saved the links.

[idosubaru]

yeah i've done this and dealt with the canister issues before. it doesn't cause any problems running wise. i don't know about codes though. i got an EGR code from not having EGR, so the CEL is on, but i don't know if there's any other codes for something else.

[davebugs]

gg,

 

Would you be willing to read the codes to see if we can tell? Hopefully the EGR and Canister would have different codes - anyone know?

 

FYI I should have a few complete 2.2 intakes w/EGR here if you're interested or head up this way. I need to pull them from parts engines with HG or bearing issues.

 

Guess I may have to be the guinea pig if no-one else chimes in.

 

Dave

[idosubaru]

Dave, I'm headed out of town for a week starting tomorrow 7am and I'm probably too busy to get to that before I leave. I can when I get back.

 

I intentionally installed my engine without EGR (EGR = less reliable) and want to keep it that way, so I'm good. I would take a spare just for kicks or the future but I have no need right now. So if you have one if we ever meet I might take one.

 

later

[idosubaru]

I was able to pull the codes while cleaning out the car in preparation for a 2,000 mile road trip.

 

Other than the EGR stuff, there appears to be one code related to this canister business. It is:

 

P 0446 Evap Emissions Control System Vent Control Circuit

 

I know nothing about that code except to say I installed an engine without EGR and without a charcoal canister set up in the engine bay. The car originally had both of those.

 

It runs perfectly fine, gets 32mpg, but has the no-no CEL for you emissions states.

 

*** I won't be seeing this thread for over a week at least as I'll be out of town with no access. But I don't know anything about this stuff anyway.

 

hmmmmm....actually dave when i first went to do this swap i posted a thread about the charcoal differences and folks did respond. you might want to dig that thread up, it's within the past year and i started it. might have some useful information on those canister differences and maybe how to get around it?

[davebugs]

GG,

 

Thanks for the effort. I will look for the thread you originated, and the code that you reported.

 

I was looking today. It looks like I could actually mimic the current setup by swapping a Solenoid under #3 intake and the throttle body from the 96 2.5 onto the 97 2.2 and running a few hoses inplace of the metal lines on the 2.5 intake that go up to the canister. Don't know how big of a pain it will be (old hoses and all). But I'm sure it'd be a lot easier with the engines out of the car.

 

I'd like to just put it in as is but I'm afraid of a code.

 

Have a safe trip.

 

Thanks for the input.

 

Dave

[davebugs]

Last chance at finding someone who has just done the replacement without worrying about the canister. I'm leaning towards just installing the 2.2 as it is (expects the canister to be in the rear of the car).

 

I got to looking at an intake off a 96 here but I've stolen the TPS, hoses, EGR, etc. I could combine 3 intakes (the original 96 2.5 throttle body, the 96 Impreza intake with the canister plumbing, and most hoses from the donor engine and the 96 2.5). Getting awful messy. I already gotta reseal the engine - everything but HG's and intake, TB and components, WP, etc.

 

I'd love to hear that someone just installed one of these, didn't worry about the canister not being there, and all was well. I myself may have actually done it - I just can't remember. Talk about annoying!

[davebugs]

Bad news - I'm not using this 97 2.2.

 

But the answer would still be nice.

 

After pressure washing I removed the baffle plate to reseal before placing the engine on the stand. Sludge, tremendous sludge.

 

Donor car had a bad tranny. There was some noise at the back of the engine but I figured it was the tranny pump. This engine sounded good, compression was good all the way around, but I won't put it in a car to sell.

 

Bummer - now I'm held up until I locate an engine. Preferably a 95 2.2 atuo (obviousely).