Susie Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Hi everybody - I was here a year or so ago with problem and everyone was so helpful, I thought I would ask you about my car again. I have a 2001 Forester S with about 140,000 miles on it. It recently has started what I can only describe as a dead miss. I haven't been able to identify any contributing factors - dry/wet weather, hot/cold engine, under a load, etc. It will just seem to start missing on a whim, but when it does, I don't see any movement on the tac which is making me wonder if it is not the engine. I recently had the timing belt replaced along with the water pump but I was having this problem before I replaced them. We've also replaced the spark plugs and added some fuel injector cleaner, and replaced the fuel filter but these did not seem to make any difference. Does anyone have any suggestions on what the problem may be? My ex-brother-in-law fixes my car for me and he is stumped by this. He can probably fix the problem if he only knew what it is! Hopefully someone here will be able to help. Thanks so much!!!! Susie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Could I Ask if your Subie is Automatic? ... It Might be a Transmission Problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 define "miss" - any speeds, constant, accelerating? any check engine lights? if you've ever had any of those we need to know what they are. Subaru spark plug wires and NGK plugs are very important. These EJ engines don't handle aftermarket very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 (edited) i vote for plug wires. use only subaru wires, buy them on line. they are easy to do. they cost about 40$ plus shipping. http://www.subarupartsforyou.com/cp_partdetail.php?partid=10387 Edited May 9, 2009 by johnceggleston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susie Posted May 9, 2009 Author Share Posted May 9, 2009 Sorry for not including complete information... Could I Ask if your Subie is Automatic? ... It Might be a Transmission Problem... My Forester is an Automatic. define "miss" - any speeds, constant, accelerating? It is really hard to explain but I'll do the best that I can. First, this problem is intermittent and I haven't been able to identify any real pattern to it. It seems to do it at anytime - any speed, any weather condition, while braking, while driving on the highway, etc. If it at least had a pattern it would probably be easier to figure out what the problem is. I guess rather than describing it as a 'miss' I could just say that it idles very roughly. I don't know if that makes more sense or not. It will often do it at a particular intersection when I am pulling out from a stop sign and turning right onto an incline. At that intersection, I've found if I feather it I can get to the crest of the hill and it straightens out. any check engine lights? if you've ever had any of those we need to know what they are. I do not get any Check Engine light when the problem happens. And I've verified that the Check Engine light works . Subaru spark plug wires and NGK plugs are very important. These EJ engines don't handle aftermarket very well. ok...I didn't know that. We did replace the plugs but I don't know that he used Subie parts. I'll check with him and suggest that he replaces them if them are aftermarket. Last night and this morning I had a new behavoir - when I was going uphill I had almost no power at all. I noticed that the enging had a low rumble to it -but I'm guessing that it might have been in a lower gear. This morning it did it again while on the highway and it kept downshifting, Then all of a sudden, it would shift back to Drive it would be fine. This evening when I came home, I didn't have any problems at all (this was about a 120 mile round trip). Someone suggested to me that the computer needs reset but I haven't attempted that yet. I hope that answers your questions - if you have any others, I'll be happy to send you more confusing explanations!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 doubt the computer reset will help. how old/many miles are on the ignition wires? new wires (Subaru only for this engine) and NGK plugs may help. normally you'd get a check engine light (cylinder misfire) for those but not necessarily. (miles again?) has the transmission fluid ever been changed? (miles again?) has the timing belt ever been changed? when doing this, will it drive better if you manually shift it into gears - like 1st, 2nd, etc? rough idle - sounds more like an engine issue than a trans/shifting issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susie Posted May 10, 2009 Author Share Posted May 10, 2009 how old/many miles are on the ignition wires? hmmm...thats a good question. I used to take the car to the dealer for service so my guess is that they were changed whenever the book wanted them changed. However, I haven't taken it to the dealer for several years now so they should probably be replaced. new wires (Subaru only for this engine) and NGK plugs may help. normally you'd get a check engine light (cylinder misfire) for those but not necessarily. nope, no check engine light. But, as I said earlier, the plugs he installed probably aren't NGK. But the reason why we replaced the plugs in the first place is because I was having this problem. So, my guess is that the plugs aren't the immediate problem (even though they should be replaced with the NGK plugs, which I will do. (miles again?) has the transmission fluid ever been changed? I haven't changed it recently - and the only time it might have been changed was when I was taking it to the dealer for servicing. (miles again?) has the timing belt ever been changed? Yea!!! Something I've done! The Timing belt was replaced about 2 months ago. Don't remember the mileage but I have about 140K on it now so it was probably about 136K or somewhere around there. when doing this, will it drive better if you manually shift it into gears - like 1st, 2nd, etc? Good question. I've never tried that but I'll give it a try to see what it does. rough idle - sounds more like an engine issue than a trans/shifting issue? Yeah, that's what my ex-brother-in-law keeps telling me. He is starting to accuse me of being crazy because whenever he drives it, it runs fine. It even runs fine if I drive it and he rides along. It only does it when I'm driving it alone. stupid car... Thanks again for all your help! Susie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 you're right, it's unlikely to be plugs anyway. these engines more often than not have ignition wire problems. well over 100K - the ignition wires may need changed. normally they give you a "cylinder misfire code" and a check engine light, but it's possible they're still causing it. by timing belt - you mean the actual timing belt, not the other drive belts right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susie Posted May 10, 2009 Author Share Posted May 10, 2009 by timing belt - you mean the actual timing belt, not the other drive belts right? Yes, the actual timing belt. They also replaced the water pump at the same time since he had everything out (not that it has anything to do with this problem). I finally decided that I was pushing my luck too far since I had 136K on it and it is recommended to be replaced at 80K. Put a big dent in the wallet but it needed to be done. Susie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Susie - yes you indeed did the right thing. It's supposed to be replaced at 105,000 miles. This is an interference engine so if the timing belt breaks it could sustain significant internal damage. So good going getting that done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fixitguy50 Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Check the air filter by removing it and holding it up to the light, if it looks dirty replace it. If you have not had the fuel filter replaced, do so. Each item should be $15-$20. I had a bad plug wire at about 140K, but it gave a OBDII code (check engine). See if the timing belt has been replaced. I'm in the process of rebuilding an engine of a 2.5 SOHC in a 1999 Forester where a idler went out locked up the water pump and bent the valves. The 99 had 160K and no belt maintenance. The belt, tensioner, and all idlers should be replaced every 105K to prevent this sort of damage. You do not want that experience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 If your front Oxygen Sensor has not been replaced in the last 40k miles, replace that. Then report back here. Trust me, I have a 2001 Forester, and I have been down this road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnuman Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Rough idle can be caused by a number of things: Vacuum leak in the intake area, Timing belt misaligned by a tooth (you said the problem preceded the timing belt change, but at that age it could have easily jumped before the timing belt change. ) bad/old plugs and or plug wires. Idle Air Control valve dirty, Idle switch maladjusted. If your mechanic has a manual for these cars, these should be fairly easy to check up on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susie Posted October 18, 2009 Author Share Posted October 18, 2009 I just wanted to thank all who helped me with my little engine problem. I'm sorry that this post is so late but somehow time just got away from me. The problem with my engine was indeed the O2 sensor. Replacing it stopped all the symptoms and my car has been running great since then. It took us a while to replace it but when we finally did, I was a happy girl again! I don't understand why the Check Engine light didn't turn on. There were 2 occasions when it did light but it went out almost right away and didn't stay on. I would have expected it to stay on since there was a problem with the O2 sensor but it didn't. In any case, thanks to all for your help - I've no doubt that you saved me a ton of money because this was something that my friend could do for me. You guys are the greatest! Susie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) Glad to hear you got it fixed Susie and thanks for the kudos. A little note for later on. Even though the CEL light isn't on the ECU will store data on things the ECU sees as a possible problem. Some problems require several drive cycles to show fault before the light is turned on but those things will be recorded in memory even though the light may never turn on. They can then be recovered by a service tech using a scanner to review and help them determine what the trouble is. If the ECU hasn't been reset you will most likely see some data about the O2 sensor and possibly other things in the memory. Edited October 18, 2009 by Cougar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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