Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 local Subaru dealer mechanic has an ea82T long block with fresh heads, all new gaskets and .5mm os pistons... plus an xt spider intake, the complete exhaust and turbo package... so, I could build a pretty fresh turbo... ea82t with the possibility of mounting an intercooler... and I do have 2) double row steel radiators laying around... hmmm on the one hand, all that effort should go into an ej swap... on the other, what would be a fair offer to this guy - I really really hate price games he flipped out the token 'what's it worth to you?' b.s. $1.95 seems low - so I didn't offer that I mean a few hundred bucks for this, and it amuses me right up until it hand grenades... or much longer delayed gratification and an ej... vaguely, somewhere down the road? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruguru Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 you are better off doing an EJ swap ea82Ts SUCK and the 2.2 has more power and more options for improvement right out of the box. my 0.02 Rob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 yeah the suckability has been well established but $$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Buy it! Install it and maintain it the way you know it needs to be maintained. After you put 200K miles on it,you will have proved to the masses the engine is viable. It just needs the kind of attention only a gear head can give it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLoyale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Buy it! Install it and maintain it the way you know it needs to be maintained.After you put 200K miles on it,you will have proved to the masses the engine is viable. It just needs the kind of attention only a gear head can give it. So true, my EA82 hasn't failed, I'm sure I could keep a EA82T is working order aswell. Just takes love and alot of Bltching Hehe -Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast I Drive Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Id say buy it and sell it to Turbone when his EA82 takes a crap, cuz he'll still be wanting to run one... I personally think it would make a GREAT boat anchor... EA82 are pretty good. EA82 TURBO, not so much... Think of it as a turd wrapped in 24K gold foil. Once the novelty and shine wears off, it REALLY stinks. -Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Unless it was bored oversized with a legitimate boring plate, there's potential for the liners to break loose (they are cast-in liners) and spin in the block. The stresses of having the heads bolted to the block must be simulated by bolting a 3" or thicker steel boring plate to the block before the machining takes place. I wouldn't risk it - not unless this guy has a lot of knowledge and has built a few of them. Why is he giving it up? Sounds like he's put some effort into the thing. I'm skeptical, but them I'm not there in person to evaluate him or his supposedly rebuilt EA82T. Also, I know it doesn't need to be said, but no amount of rebuilding or machining will help that engine. Only way to help it is to melt it down and recast it as an EJ22. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLoyale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Well ok, the big issue with the EA82T is the heads correct, so if you had the meens to recast parts, hell you could cast new heads with the proper support and struture so the ports don't crack and such, since this time was not taking when FHI made these heads. if you could do that it wouldn't be so bad. How come no one has ever try to find a place that makes engine parts and have them recast the heads you want with the corrections needed to make them better? I know it would cost money, but for someone who is really into the EA82T it wouldn't be a bad idea, right? The only other downfall is it no having an intercooler (Stock) and of course the Timing belts. but other then that, it wouldn't be bad.. Just my thoughts at 3:53am -Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruguru Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 the ea82 turbo is the ea82 engine with autism... and boom gose the dynamite:grin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 the ea82 turbo is the ea82 engine with autism... and boom gose the dynamite:grin: I am sure you meant no offense. But I have an autistic son. I don't like him being compared to the EA82T. It's degrading to my son, lol. Kidding aside, I actually love the EA82T......to a point. That point is the heads cracking in the exhaust port. Luckily I have a very good TIG welder for a friend:grin: So every cracked set of heads I get is being set aside for a welding party. After fixed I will be bolting them to fresh NA shortblocks and running them non-turbo.(except for a few *experiments*) Tax..the best thing you could do with that engine is put NA pistons in it and run it Non-Turbo with the spider intake. That is what I did to my Turbo wagon, and driving it now is a blast. Pull off the line feels way better and it's only slightly less powerful on the freeway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 Unless it was bored oversized with a legitimate boring plate, there's potential for the liners to break loose (they are cast-in liners) and spin in the block. The stresses of having the heads bolted to the block must be simulated by bolting a 3" or thicker steel boring plate to the block before the machining takes place. I wouldn't risk it - not unless this guy has a lot of knowledge and has built a few of them. Why is he giving it up? Sounds like he's put some effort into the thing. I'm skeptical, but them I'm not there in person to evaluate him or his supposedly rebuilt EA82T. Also, I know it doesn't need to be said, but no amount of rebuilding or machining will help that engine. Only way to help it is to melt it down and recast it as an EJ22. GD The gentleman in question is a factory Subaru mechanic, pretty sure he's up to speed on proper technique, he was rebuilding an EJ25 at the dealership that was covered under the power train warranty (ate the #1 rod bearing) - (another 'great' engine) in short, he came across as technical and very professional the deal is quite simple, and very common to all of us - just too many projects, he decided to put the effort into something else and let the car go, he was going to sell the whole car but I mentioned that I might be interested in parts of it and that he didn't need to put it together just to sell it... (not sure he uses the USMB, but he has a lot of parts he's clearing out... I would like to see him post them here - more on that later) so... I agree on the melting down and re-casting of the block as something more useful... but really, what could I offer that isn't too low or too high? this might be in my price range right now, instead of saving for a looooong time to build a proper EJ and I'm already working on my ea82 every day... ha ha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 the best thing you could do with that engine is put NA pistons in it and run it Non-Turbo with the spider intake. That is what I did to my Turbo wagon, and driving it now is a blast. Pull off the line feels way better and it's only slightly less powerful on the freeway. see, that confuses me. the XT 4 is rated at less power than my SPFI, according to my notoriously inaccurate book... if there is any gain to be had, wouldn't putting the intake, which is potentially for sale seperately, on my healthy SPFI offer some advantage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 (edited) see, that confuses me. the XT 4 is rated at less power than my SPFI, according to my notoriously inaccurate book... if there is any gain to be had, wouldn't putting the intake, which is potentially for sale seperately, on my healthy SPFI offer some advantage? Spider= dual port intake heads SPFI= single port intake heads You would have to swap the MPFI heads on.....additionally you still need to wire the ECU Injection harness. FWIW, 4 cyl XT is rated at 97 HP@5200 RPMs and 139 ft/lbs torque@3200. Edited August 23, 2009 by Gloyale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 see, that confuses me. the XT 4 is rated at less power than my SPFI, according to my notoriously inaccurate book... SPFI = 90 HP Early MPFI = 95 HP Spider MPFI = 105 HP USDM Turbo MPFI = 115 HP JDM/EMD Turbo MPFI = 135 HP At least that's how I have it remembered. Someone will correct any errors I'm sure.... GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 As far as what's wrong with the EA82 - some of it is the heads, yes. Up to about 200 HP it's the heads and the head gaskets and the head bolts. Here's how you get to 200 HP: 1. Switch the head bolts to studs. ARP will make you a set for about $1000. They are a totally oddball size - 11mm. Note that you have to remove the engine from the car if you want to pull a head when using studs. The reason they used bolts is so you wouldn't have to do that. 2. O-ring the block. It's the only way you are going to get the fire-ring on the head gaskets to hold the pressure. 3. Forged pistons. Another custom animal but not as expensive as the studs. 4. MegaSquirt and very good monitoring equipment. You need to monitor EGT's for both heads, cylinder head temps, wideband for mixture control, and a lot of hope and prayer that you don't have an injector fail..... That would get you to a reliable 200 HP. Beyond that and you are talking about more than the 3 main bearing crank can handle and the heads would never make it. And at the end of the day it will never be as cheap or reliable as an NA EJ22 with 5 pound of boost - which generally comes in around the same 200 HP. GD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 Spider= dual port intake heads SPFI= single port intake heads You would have to swap the MPFI heads on.....additionally you still need to wire the ECU Injection harness. FWIW, 4 cyl XT is rated at 97 HP@5200 RPMs and 139 ft/lbs torque@3200. -doch- yeah that the engine he had, had the dual port heads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 (edited) As far as what's wrong with the EA82 - some of it is the heads, yes. Up to about 200 HP it's the heads and the head gaskets and the head bolts. Here's how you get to 200 HP: 1. Switch the head bolts to studs. ARP will make you a set for about $1000. They are a totally oddball size - 11mm. Note that you have to remove the engine from the car if you want to pull a head when using studs. The reason they used bolts is so you wouldn't have to do that. 2. O-ring the block. It's the only way you are going to get the fire-ring on the head gaskets to hold the pressure. 3. Forged pistons. Another custom animal but not as expensive as the studs. 4. MegaSquirt and very good monitoring equipment. You need to monitor EGT's for both heads, cylinder head temps, wideband for mixture control, and a lot of hope and prayer that you don't have an injector fail..... That would get you to a reliable 200 HP. Beyond that and you are talking about more than the 3 main bearing crank can handle and the heads would never make it. And at the end of the day it will never be as cheap or reliable as an NA EJ22 with 5 pound of boost - which generally comes in around the same 200 HP. GD LMAO my favorite part is the thousand dollar studs, that's pretty damn funny GD !!! I'm not expecting 200 hp from an ea82T, nor do I wish to commit to building an orphan engine for the shear vicarious thrill of it anyone got a dollar figure? what's a reasonable offer for an 'interim engine' like this engine-in-a-box? this is a couple of hundred dollar bolt in, with a freshened block, new heads, spider intake, turbo and complete exhaust... but I have no idea what a 'fair' price for both of us would be Edited August 23, 2009 by Txakura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjw Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 For me, $300 tops. And thats only if your sure all the work was done correctly. And only because he is supposedly a subi mech with mad subi skills. But,I bet he wouldn't like that offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 For me, $300 tops. And thats only if your sure all the work was done correctly. And only because he is supposedly a subi mech with mad subi skills. But,I bet he wouldn't like that offer. I don't know about "mad" subi skills thank you for posting a dollar amount Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 anyone got a dollar figure? what's a reasonable offer for an 'interim engine' like this engine-in-a-box? this is a couple of hundred dollar bolt in, with a freshened block, new heads, spider intake, turbo and complete exhaust... but I have no idea what a 'fair' price for both of us would be See, the problem is, it IS NOT a bolt in. Other than sourcing an adapter plate and drilled flywheel(about $300 order yours today:grin:) there is nothing less expensive or difficult than doing an EJ swap. To run this MPFI engine, With or without Turbo, requires a major rewire. I see 2 paths to this MAYBE...... The maybe path would be to swap the entire front end harness, back to the ECU and main Plugs. This would mean all the harness depicted in The front wiring harness diagrahms chpt.6-3, pages 8 and 10 with all the F-- labeled connectors. If you have an FSM to look at for 89 or 90. No need to rewire, but the whole damn front of the car would need torn apart. And where are you going to get you're MPFI harness and ECU from? Or , approach it like an EJ swap and just cut out needed wires from MPFI loom and mate them into existing SPFI harness. And at that rate.....you could easily just put an EJ in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Having an SPFI now, to run a turbo you will need a turbo crossmember. Otherwise, the up-pipe and crossmember will be trying to share the same space. You can get a Legacy that runs for just as much as this engine might cost, and either swap in it's AWD 5speed, or get an adapter plate, plus you also get all the stuff for the front 5lug swap. I'm working on an affordable alternative to the XT6 rear stuff, and once that's done, you'll be set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 24, 2009 Author Share Posted August 24, 2009 Having an SPFI now, to run a turbo you will need a turbo crossmember. Otherwise, the up-pipe and crossmember will be trying to share the same space. You can get a Legacy that runs for just as much as this engine might cost, and either swap in it's AWD 5speed, or get an adapter plate, plus you also get all the stuff for the front 5lug swap. I'm working on an affordable alternative to the XT6 rear stuff, and once that's done, you'll be set. damn that's right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted August 25, 2009 Author Share Posted August 25, 2009 just thought I'd add that together all of you beat some sense into my head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zukiru Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 Having an SPFI now, to run a turbo you will need a turbo crossmember. Otherwise, the up-pipe and crossmember will be trying to share the same space. You can get a Legacy that runs for just as much as this engine might cost, and either swap in it's AWD 5speed, or get an adapter plate, plus you also get all the stuff for the front 5lug swap. I'm working on an affordable alternative to the XT6 rear stuff, and once that's done, you'll be set. very interested in the affordable alternative... I hate the idea of xt6s parted for five lug swaps on wagons.. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruguru Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 (edited) For the price of what he might want for that motor you can put an EJ in your car. Total spent on my car for JUST the engine swap 400.00 i traded for most of the stuff but for fair value i did the harness myself just copying a friends and everything els is gravy engine prety much bolts right in with the adapter and flywheel you get it to mate to the tranny but engine mount holes are the same. im just saying a 2.2 will blow the doors off most ea82 turbos ( I SAID MOST) right out of the box and will live to tell the tail the turbo might not be so lucky haha. Rob. PS yes no ofence to any one with or related to someone with the disability and thank you for being polite about it and even jokeing along Rob... Edited August 26, 2009 by subaruguru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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